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The Missus' younger brother has been called up for military service.


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Anyone  realistically know what he can expect.?   He's cut off from contact with the rest of the world so she doesn't even know where he is at the moment.  No phones permitted during training.

 

He's about the most quiet person I've even met.      I suppose  he'll change a lot  over the next two years  and I wish for him that it's all positive.

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Know I guy who really was a good kid PRIOR to being called for service here. He came out totally twisted and we could not work with him any longer. All what a good Army education normally teaches you, he did not have at all.

Still see him around once in a while and he seems to be back on track now. But still, they screwed him up.

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Pilotman said:

That is very unusual and usually means that the kid had a mental/character problem already and the military just brought it to the fore.

 

So anyone who comes out of the military messed up. . . was messed up before going in? 

A bit of an absolute belief, no? Surely, the military is far from perfect?

 

 

Edited by ThLT
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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, ThLT said:

 

So anyone who comes out of the military messed up. . . was messed up before going in? 

A bit of an absolute belief, no? Surely, the military is far from perfect?

 

 

Far from perfect indeed, but they are generally expert in  developing their people and getting the best out of them , this is of course a vital necessity in a fighting force, as you don't want inadequates beside you in a fire fight. or on your wing in air combat. I can't speak for the Thai military of course,  but I would be surprised if they don't share many of the characteristics of western military in their needs, wants and training.   In answer to your first question, yes, in my 24 years past Military experience, including in training roles, almost inevitably the character traits were there already and the military just brought them out. The messing up you speak of often comes when the person loses the comfortable structure and discipline of the military, not because the military messed them up. For some, its like being cast from a family and from having direction in their lives they are suddenly on their own.  

Edited by Pilotman
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54 minutes ago, Pilotman said:

That is very unusual and usually means that the kid had a mental/character problem already and the military just brought it to the fore. I am a great believer in the ability of a military training and environment to turn around bad ones, develop good ones and make young people much better for the experience.  It can and does give confidence to the underconfident ( which it did for me) open a life of adventure and discovery and aid social skills. To the OP, there is no need to worry, in all probability, the lad will be all the better for it and especially in Thailand, to be away from Mums apron strings.  

Should do that in uk  if they won.t work.make a man of them instead of mummy's boys .

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Posted (edited)
55 minutes ago, Bob12345 said:

I think it is important to distuinguish between the military service in Western slash developed countries, and the one that is avalable in Thailand. In developed countries it is a way to develop skills, learn discipline, and contribute to your country, in Thailand there is much less on offer. Many of the recruits in Thailand are just used as cheap labor, or slaves, to be used as their CO seems fit. Add to that the regular reports of mistreatment and recruits dying, with nobody taking responsibility, and I know I will do my best to keep my kids out of the Thai army. 

 

Edit: with a draft people will come in all the time and leave again after 1-2 years, there is no reason for a military to invest huge amounts of money and effort in developing these people as they will soon walk out of the door and take all their skills with them. They teach you the minimum and try to get as much out of you as possible (go be a gardener for a general). In a porfessional army the opposite is true: these people will be there for 20 years and the more you invest in their skillset and education, the more they are worth to the army. So don't mix up draft soldiers in Thailand with professional soldiers in developed countries.

I think your first paragraph is an exaggeration.  Yes they train hard and do menial jobs, but that is no different to Thai village and farm life and maybe good for them not to be sleeping in a hammock at the middle of the day and being looked after by Mum and G.F and doing nothing to help the household.    I see the military recruits doing social projects, such as clearing jungle for village development, cleaning beaches etc, which is no bad thing, teaching them to help others and serve.   They are also helping to set up and manage field hospitals in the present pandemic. I have also seen them scuba diving, deep sea fishing, water skiing, parachuting, getting the chance to fly in helicopters ( good luck with that one) and in 'normal times' travelling to nearby countries on good will visits and having a rare old time, so its not all negative. Draftees here are also enabled to take exams and improve their education, including in many cases learning other languages such as English.  

Edited by Pilotman
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1 hour ago, Bob12345 said:

I think it is important to distuinguish between the military service in Western slash developed countries, and the one that is avalable in Thailand. In developed countries it is a way to develop skills, learn discipline, and contribute to your country, in Thailand there is much less on offer. Many of the recruits in Thailand are just used as cheap labor, or slaves, to be used as their CO seems fit. Add to that the regular reports of mistreatment and recruits dying, with nobody taking responsibility, and I know I will do my best to keep my kids out of the Thai army. 

 

Edit: with a draft people will come in all the time and leave again after 1-2 years, there is no reason for a military to invest huge amounts of money and effort in developing these people as they will soon walk out of the door and take all their skills with them. They teach you the minimum and try to get as much out of you as possible (go be a gardener for a general). In a porfessional army the opposite is true: these people will be there for 20 years and the more you invest in their skillset and education, the more they are worth to the army. So don't mix up draft soldiers in Thailand with professional soldiers in developed countries.

?? Your first paragraph couldn't have been more reasonable.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Pilotman said:

Far from perfect indeed, but they are generally expert in  developing their people and getting the best out of them , [...] In answer to your first question, yes, in my 24 years past Military experience, including in training roles, almost inevitably the character traits were there already and the military just brought them out. The messing up you speak of often comes when the person loses the comfortable structure and discipline of the military, not because the military messed them up.


Still sounds like absolute thinking. By "military," you're excluding war, both coming out messed up from that—or literally dying, right?

 

Edited by ThLT
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1 minute ago, ThLT said:


Still sounds like absolute thinking. By "military," you're excluding war, both coming out messed up from that—or straight-up dying, right?

That's  a very different debate to the OPs question. 

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4 hours ago, ChipButty said:

Join the Army and see the World, they used to say

 

It's "Join the Navy, see the world."

 

It's still said and largely true for the big Navy fleets of this world.

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16 hours ago, BlueScouse said:

My son volunteered so only did one year instead of two. He was based at a camp about 15km from home.

First 3 months no contact with anyone.  No leave or visits allowed. After that he had leave every few weeks. We also visited every Sunday. Food quality and quantity very poor so we took food for him, and also a few kgs of fruit every visit. After 6 months a new batch of recruits came. My son was kept back to help train the newcomers. The rest of his intake were sent to the border in SiSaKet. He wanted to go, more exitement and an extra 100 baht a day wages. Monthly wages paid into an army bank account. Shop in the barracks selling food a bit more expensive than outside.

All in, my son enjoyed himself and his character changed when he left. More self confident.

Hope he packed his Everton shirt when he left..c.o.y.b...

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Hopefully he will learn how to take care of himself and not suck off his moms titt the rest of his life. My wife has 2 sons 21 and 25 . Both sponging off their mother. Every baht she earns goes to the care of her elderly parents and lazy sons. The two boys always have an excuse for not working. 

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Posted (edited)
22 hours ago, Pilotman said:

Yes they train hard and do menial jobs, but that is no different to Thai village and farm life and maybe good for them not to be sleeping in a hammock at the middle of the day and being looked after by Mum and G.F and doing nothing to help the household. 

I must admit I agree there with you, but I would rather see that parents raise their kids and not just avoid responsibility as long as possible and then hope their kid gets drafted so the army has to instill the values/skills they failed to instill and the school failed to instill. It is not, and should not, be the role of the government ( = army) to raise kids, but if the parents hopelessly failed and this is the last way out then its better than them never being raised properly.

 

And here again a big difference with armies around the globe: in Thailand it is a "last resort" to raise kids when the parents failed, while in western countries with professional armies it are more motivated kids who join up as the army offers them educational opportunities and the chance to see the world.

(exception are the officers in the army here: one old classmate of mine went there after his MBA, probably to make connections and have some of that huge cake the higher-ups in the Thai army are enjoying)

Edited by Bob12345
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19 hours ago, fabruer said:

 

It's "Join the Navy, see the world."

 

It's still said and largely true for the big Navy fleets of this world.

My youngest brother did join the navy having not been in that long when got posted on a brand new Type 42 then spent the best part of a years cruising the world 

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More than likely will be cutting grass on a golf course or washing his colonels car, Military service should be compulsory for all Thai males, might stop them being such mummy's boys

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On 5/12/2021 at 11:13 PM, BTB1977 said:

My wife has 2 sons 21 and 25 . Both sponging off their mother

Gee that is terrible.

 

What work does you wife do?

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As far as I know, the Thai military still sticks by an archaic and unconstitutional  regulation that, although Thais with foreign fathers (foreign mothers OK) can be conscripted, they are not allowed any promotiional beyond the rank of private.  That appears to make the option of volunteering to 6 months military service as a 2nd lieutenant after graduating from university impossible for look krungs with foreign fathers. A friend of the missus who was an accountant took up this option and spent his 6 months doing accounting work in the army but paid a fraction of what he had earned as an accountant on the outside. 

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