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Thai Police Get Tough Net Laws


bangbuathong

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> Wonder what the rate for making the IT police go away will be?

Assuming the skills of the IT police are below the farang hobbyist user - they will probably accept a copy of the porn on a self - executing autorun CD that will install and then self replicate across networks and through any email gateways it can see, that'll solve the problem.

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Cracking down on cyber crime is no bad thing but these people are incompetent and corrupt and certainly can't be trusted with such draconian powers. The existing laws seem quite adequate. Why can't they get a warrant to seize private computers? These powers can easily be used to intimidate political opponents and extort money from businesses. (Would you like us to remove all your computers or would you prefer to make a contribution to our benevolent fund.) It is also not beyond them to plant pornographic material into people's computers, just like they carefully planted bags of amphetamines and guns in the hands of those summarily executed in Thaksin's war against drugs.

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welcome to your police state.....

LOS truly has become a magical place in the last year.....disapperaing democracy, disapperaing political parties, disapperaing civil rights, disappering freedom of speech...... an illusion of improvement, .....the boys in green must have consulted the magician David Copperfield for this wonderful magic show........the only thing i wonder is that for the last act, what will appear?

:o:D:D

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I think it is more about intimidation then any other . There is no way they are gonna check places randomly ,

I just do not believe that . But when in case they have an oppertunity they this law in place , probably nothing more with it . :o

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Whilst I agree that cracking down on on-line fraud etc can only be a good thing, it needs a police force that has some knowledge of computers

The way I understand it, and please correct me if I'm wrong, people that have internet provided by the condo operators (in other words, people that DO NOT HAVE A PRIVATE LINE) share Ip addresses with other residents. So how can anybody be pinpointed?

My only concern is can I still use Limewire with impunity!

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I can see it now...

Monday, plain clothes police officer stops off at an internet cafe or guesthouse and uses the computer. Same plain clothes officer proceedes to upload a few porno snaps.

Tuesday, officers in uniform stop at the same location and announce that it has been brought to their attention that porno is on a machine here. The look into the "loaded" machine and bingo! The owner is stitched for an obscene amount of baht or he can forget about ever seeing the computers again.

I recommend that any business which allows public use of the computers install some type of software which reboots and deletes all files installed after usage by each customer. I am not sure where you can buy it but I saw it on a computer in Tokyo at FedEx Kinko's.

Actually, I read about a similar incident involving music. Illegal music was uploaded onto a guesthouse computer and either the next day or later that afternoon the same 'officals,' who uploaded the music, showed up, went to the same machine and 'found' the music. The owner had is stuff confiscated and I do not know the final outcome. Good luck to those of you with publicly used computers.

And to the guys playing in the various nightlife venues, be doubly careful as all it takes is a pissed off woman who has heard about this law and recalls your taking some snaps of her in the buff. Just a word or two to the proper person and you could be in for a very, very expensive lesson. hel_l, once the word gets out I could imagine some of the girls definitely creating something of a permanent income stream from this type of activity. Take some photos, call the coppers, collect some baht.

Cheers,

TheWalkingMan

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In thailand, many hotels or apartments let you use their ADSL connection for free or for a small fee without any authentication or login of any sort. So all guests are using the same IP Adress of the host. If someone does something illegal there, the police can only find the host via the IP adress. The guest cannot be identified.

I hope this won't lead to the shutdown of these internet services for tourists.

In germany we have a similar problem with Wifi hotspots. If you do not use WEP or WPA and someone logs into your wireless lan and does something illegal, you will get the problem. (police seizing computers or a lawsuit for sharing copyrighted MP3s or software).

I hope the same won't happen in thailand, stopping guesthouse owners from providing easy internet access.

Marco.

It's not only Thai guest houses and hotels that offer free and open wifi, big hotels around the world do the same, so this is still an open door for porn merchants and spammers everywhere, not just in LOS.

If these open doors are found to be being abused, then there's a technological remedy in the form of giving each guest a unique username and password to log-in with, so that if necessary any abuse could then be subsequently traced back to the individual guest.

My guess is that as the identification of abuse increases, we'll probably start to see totally open wifi having to be replaced by log-in systems like this. They would act as a great deterrent, and in their simplest form many could probably get away without the actual traceback facility - rather like installing a dummy burglar alarm in a prominent position ouside your house!

It's sad that we live in an immoral world where abuse perpetrators force these kind of tiresome new precautions on us, but the battle of good against evil has been going on since time immemorial, and I suppose it always will.

+ SJ

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I suppose most modern countries are caught in some kind of struggle between urges toward enlightenment and fascism, loving kindness and hatred. What happens in this struggle, it seems to me, in a moment in time, determines a country's culture, its hum and buzz, the feel of it. For me the extemes of these contesting forces in Thailand are personified by a monk and a cop, militerism and Buddhism. The absence of civil government, and some kind of representative political body to mediate the struggle, has thrown the country out of balance and caused the conditions for a police state. Sad.

One can only hope that the present government will relinquish its power by returning the country to civil society. Without a representative government to check the misuse of power, there's no reason to think that country will not continue on its present course, and the police will be given even more power to restrict civil rights and personal freedoms, which will create a cops and robbers culture. I would prefer the state to protect Thailand's beautiful culture over its efforts to legislate morality while making more robbers for the cops to chase.

The most worrying one is

Article 11: Those who send data or electronic mails to others without revealing their identity, or by posing as someone else, in an act that disrupts the others' normal computer use: subject to a Bt100,000 fine.

Most of us here do not reveal our identity and de facto we pose as someone else (our pseudo).

So now we should have a registered ID and an email with our own name?

[sandy]

People obviously tend to read over the most crucial part:

... IN AN ACT THAT DISRUPTS THE OTHERS NORMAL COMPUTER USE. Simply translating "misuse" to harm third parties.

In short, spammers, identity thieves, virus spreaders and other virtual crooks. Nothing wrong with a law to get those busted and should be in the interest of any legitimate user of the internet.

Cheers,

Richard

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Yeah, but this sounds quite normal...................anybody who is still contesting this point.......wake the ###### up.

Granted there are lots of things to bitch about but this does not seem to me to me to be one of them.

As someone mentioned earlier......it seems more like its aimed at spammers and hackers than anything else.

Stop with the political analysis already

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I think it's going a bit far. Since the block many websites, they can record your IP address (your fingerprint on the net) , know who had that IP at any time (your username/password) and raid your premise any time they want.

To get around that, you could always VPN (encrypt) your data go a remote location (another country would work) and then browse the net through there. There are companies that sell this service.

To use a proxy to go around a blocked site is braking this new law. To use of VPN to aviod the new law and its effect is braking the law. Using a proxy even if not braking the law or using VPN services is reason enough to take the PC (if they can't produce web log evidence then they can take the PC to find what they are looking for) to see what you have been doing and those who take it are protected from any law suite if they ruin you. They are not allowed to make puplic what they are doing until they file charges. There are alot of good reasons for many parts of this law. Problem is they got carried away with their power tripping in some areas of it. Try to make it clearer If your web log at the ISP cannot show clearly everyhting you do online and when you did it then you are a suspect and they can come to your home and take your PC and search any and everthing else they wish, but it must be during the daylight hours and they must show ID. PS if the ISP fails to keep the detailed records they will be closed by the military for violation of the security acts so you can count on compliance.

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Thailand seems to move more in a dictatorial regime direction, frightening!

Taking effect today, a new law allows police officers or government inspectors to seize computers on private premises suspected of containing pornographic material or evidence in connection with either general criminal activities or cyber crimes.

Yes we are loosing time by speaking about THB and USD... And meanwhile, a totally insane law is becoming effective...

And... well... few reactions.

It's enough to read a few articles of this "law" (what a very dirty word) to understand that Thailand is entering the rabbit-hole in the Wonderland...

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I think porn is used as an excuse to restrict people's privacy and to be able to controll everything and everybody, for example if people are politically active ,or form labor union etc.

Porn Illegal in Thailand?

Please tell me more about this.

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Draconian laws like this should be crystal clear so that people can follow them. What constitutes "porn", what is a threat to "national security", when do you unlawfully hide your identity? This law is one in a string of measures to create an authoritarian state, and to make it easier for the "authorities" to crack down on opponents. Expect police and military to increasingly seize computers at junta opponents. The ISOC bill if passed as it is would of course make things much worse but even the new "more-democratic-than-1997" constitution contains a clause allowing the police to search your private home without a warrant. Instead of a paper issued by a judge who weighed your rights against the state's, the boys in brown can just enter your house under some pretext and wave the constitution in your face. And it's doubtful that an elected government will get rid of these convenient tools of repression.

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I think, as with many things in this forum, this 'news' has been blown out of proportion. We've not had any big news for some time so it appears that people are getting a bit sensationalist. As with every other draconian law in Thailand this one will blow over by the weekend. The only people who'll ever be affected by this are those that truly deserve it.

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Again I ask! Who is the "Officer" if they allow the "Boys in Brown" to do it than we really have problems. Just want to know who is the authorized Officer who can come into your home or office and look at your computer with out a complaint or evidence of act against the law. It is obvious that if I looked at information on 95% of the computers anywhere I could find something that could fall into the category of suspicious, I could than confiscate your computer based on my opinion!!!

Do they need probable cause, if so do they need to tell you what it is?

Thanks

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The most worrying one is

Article 11: Those who send data or electronic mails to others without revealing their identity, or by posing as someone else, in an act that disrupts the others' normal computer use: subject to a Bt100,000 fine.

Most of us here do not reveal our identity and de facto we pose as someone else (our pseudo).

So now we should have a registered ID and an email with our own name?

[sandy]

Why would you want to send anonymous emails, unless you were either:

a) causing mischief,

:o trying to hide something from your partner,

c) doing something very illegal,

d) just trying to shit someone else up the wall.

It seems from my experience there is a world-wide practice of using dud names and handles by zillions of ######s trying to sell viagra, or send you an infected file, so if that type of shit can be curtailed, then it is a good thing.

What a wonderful world it would be if everyone was up-front and had the balls to say who they were instead of using wanky nick names.

Go Thai Police !

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Almarg, I understand your point but sometimes its better to be anonymous in my opinion. The Chinese gov't puts people away for posting anything critical on the net. But if we could turn typing and nicknames into something equal to written papers with signatures, there sure would be a lot more people in jail, getting sued, etc.

I think its a good thing that they may crack down a bit. the Internet is pretty bad when it comes to porno. But I really wonder how serious they are. The funny thing about Thailand is that you hear lots of rumours of cops getting money from all the bars which offer hostesses for personal entertainment. I wonder if the Internet is cutting in on their business. I'm not sure about porno. I often wonder if porno leads to more 'real' sex or less of it. Wouldn't it be better to have guys at home in a safe environment taking care of business than going into a real environment where they might get a sexual disease? You could compare this to playing a war game on the computer to actually going out in a war.

Disclaimer: Although the above statements may seem to have been posted by aujuba, they might not have been.

Welcome to the Twilight Zone Or is it the Outer Limits. See that's what I mean!

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The most worrying one is

Article 11: Those who send data or electronic mails to others without revealing their identity, or by posing as someone else, in an act that disrupts the others' normal computer use: subject to a Bt100,000 fine.

Most of us here do not reveal our identity and de facto we pose as someone else (our pseudo).

So now we should have a registered ID and an email with our own name?

[sandy]

People obviously tend to read over the most crucial part:

... IN AN ACT THAT DISRUPTS THE OTHERS NORMAL COMPUTER USE. Simply translating "misuse" to harm third parties.

In short, spammers, identity thieves, virus spreaders and other virtual crooks. Nothing wrong with a law to get those busted and should be in the interest of any legitimate user of the internet.

Cheers,

Richard

Quite right.

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Hummm.

Somehow, I have some difficulties understanding why a majority of posts in this thread display what one might term "slight paranoïa". I mean: anyone here who's got something to hide & a few skeletons in the closet or what?

Posting under a pseudonym in forums is hardly the equivalent of sending fake emails [and is hardly targeted here], now is it? And if anyone around here should happen to be a bot-master (meaning: instigating bot attacks & similar) or spammer, then by all means: have "the boys in brown" grab his PC at the blink of an eye and have him go figure on his next stroke of wicked genius at Bangkok Hilton...

Get used to the fact that pretty well anywhere in the world, you're "electronically exposed" in some way or other. So bloody what?!? How much do you have to hide, and from whom or what? I've yet to hear from someone halfway straight who's come to any sort of harm from "electronic tags". Okay, agreed, that leaves out fascist government ruled countries where freedom of speech is a non-issue and people are put behind bars for criticizing the king-pins et.al. But in my opinion, there's still a very large difference between - say - North Korea, Burma, ..., ... - and LOS.

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Yeah, but this sounds quite normal...................anybody who is still contesting this point.......wake the ###### up.

Granted there are lots of things to bitch about but this does not seem to me to me to be one of them.

As someone mentioned earlier......it seems more like its aimed at spammers and hackers than anything else.

Stop with the political analysis already

Just think back a few months to the CNS' paranoia after the coup about chat rooms and their order to web masters to delete posts critical of them. That should give you some idea of how this can be used poliltically in the name of "national security". Also look down South and see how Singapore and Malaysia arrest teenagers for posting blogs mildly critical of their governements.

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I recommend that any business which allows public use of the computers install some type of software which reboots and deletes all files installed after usage by each customer. I am not sure where you can buy it but I saw it on a computer in Tokyo at FedEx Kinko's.

I know of at least 2 internet cafes in Pattaya and 1 on Phuket that "ghost" their computers on a daily basis. (This rebuilds a clean image to the hard drive, wiping out all manner of viruses, illegal downloads etc. in the process)

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this is ridiculous.

laws in thailand only come from one side of the law. the police are protected, not the suspects. and granted, even though police know their jobs well enough (not usually here, unfortunately. investigate does not mean 'ask for bribe again') and know what needs to be done to catch a criminal, they have no idea why people wouldn't want to help them (the most common reasons being they don't like being treated like a brain-dead prisoner ). police don't like people who aren't interested in helping them, but a lack of interest doesn't mean guilt. police would probably like it best if we all stayed indoors and sat quietly at our tables with our hands where the police could easily see them. do we do this? no. should we? of course not. it's ridiculous. :o

did you know that if you put a password on the bios when your computer first boots up, nobody can do anything to that computer until the password is entered? switching hard drives doesn't work. booting from a cd doesn't work. granted, you can still take the hard drive out and put it in another computer to get the data off, but theres got to be some kind of encryption trick that will protect from that. :D

all in favor of these wonderful new laws? hands?

yeah, I thought not.

:edit:

7-11 widgets! oh boy. now we've got the cheap knockoff version with legs that asks for money coming into our homes. :D

Edited by Choscura
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The most worrying one is

Article 11: Those who send data or electronic mails to others without revealing their identity, or by posing as someone else, in an act that disrupts the others' normal computer use: subject to a Bt100,000 fine.

Most of us here do not reveal our identity and de facto we pose as someone else (our pseudo).

So now we should have a registered ID and an email with our own name?

[sandy]

Maybe. But I think it refers to those who send you an email with a Trojan Horse, etc attached, thus 'disrupts..normal computer use.' I'm all for that, if that's the intention.

But here's something else to be concerned about (in the sense I think you meant above).

The Act also subjects those circulating pornographic material or libellous content through e-mails to heavy fines.

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I think it is more about intimidation then any other . There is no way they are gonna check places randomly ,

I just do not believe that . But when in case they have an oppertunity they this law in place , probably nothing more with it . :o

Right. I remember an article where the police searched an apartment where 2 guys were living in bkk. I think it had something to do with the gf of one of the guys was pissed off so she reported that they had porn in their apartment. After the search the police found 2 magazines that they bought from someone selling on the street at patpong. They did not go to jail but they were deported.

The only time the police should be able to come in without a warrant is if they catch someone in the act. Say they are walking by and see something that isn't supposed to be there on the screen. Any time they know in advance that they are going to go into someones place they should have to have a warrant.

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