Harry Palmer Posted August 17, 2004 Share Posted August 17, 2004 In my opinion & experience I believe that those seriously wanting to teach English in the LoS should have a minimum set of academic qualifications, they are as follows. A genuine & verifiable university or college degree A genuine & verifiable Cambridge CELTA I’m afraid that one stands little chance of being offered a position by one of the reputable language schools providing a decent salary & set of working conditions, without them. Yes you can get by on a TEFL or a fake degree but that’s strictly for the backpacker community or losers fleeing their own country in search of cheap & easy sex. As I said, it’s only an opinion… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 Harry a CELTA is a TEFL it used to be called the CTEFLA! And as it's purely for adult teaching by your reckoning: "I’m afraid that one stands little chance of being offered a position by one of the reputable language schools (that teachers children) providing a decent salary & set of working conditions, without them." I sense a change in you mate, you okay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadFrankie Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 Whats a decent salary in a reputable language school just out of interest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 I suppose in the 40k upwards range??? Depends on hours and who, what and where you're teaching? BC pay 70-80k a month (perks on top?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ijustwannateach Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 Awwwrright.... the first qualification thread in the Thai visa teacher's room, and Harry has to go throwing the ol' firebrand issue of cert. brand into it (as if innocently). For the record, I don't think anyone who's been DOING TEFL for awhile needs either of those bits of paper [though they can't hurt] and anyone who's STARTING TEFL probably needs one of them- but I doubt it matters so much which one. Surely the issue of qualifications should center around education and experience first, and where experience is lacking one of those certs is a good stand-in. Shame on you, Harry! "Steven" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 For the record, I don't think anyone who's been DOING TEFL for awhile needs either of those bits of paper [though they can't hurt] and anyone who's STARTING TEFL probably needs one of them- but I doubt it matters so much which one. If the MoE continues to push for them you will indeed (and schools are already asking for them, certainly AUA and ECC amongst others are) need a cert to obtain a teachers licence (with an unrelated to teaching degree) and thus work permit. Although again it can depend on who, what and where you're teaching. I know a lot of people that have taken TEFL courses after teaching here for years, each to their own I suppose? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
britmaveric Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 Harry- thought first qualification for teaching english = breathing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 Nah you gotta 'look' like a native speaker, then they check for the pulse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ijustwannateach Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 Ken, if that's true, then some people might have to reconsider- but I somehow doubt that adding another bottleneck to already incredibly inefficient and messy process of getting real employment here is either going to be desirable or functional. And if it's not, people will just keep on ignoring it. "Steven" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 It is true, I wouldn't fib mate. It's okay for current teachers, but people applying for a 'new' teachers licence (again depending on who, what and where they're teaching) will have to do so and this is happening more and more and more. If schools like AUA and ECC etc. have to follow these rules, it seems to me most schools will have to as well? "but I somehow doubt that adding another bottleneck to already incredibly inefficient and messy process of getting real employment here is either going to be desirable or functional." ^ Yes, spot on this is Thailand mate, when has this ever made a difference? What's the problem? What's the worst way to fix it (or make it worse)? Well let's do it then! People may ignore it, but I don't think the schools will. The MoE is already stopping other TEFL providers from setting up courses as there is such a glut of them (according to the MoE people that visited us a week ago!). Everyone said the 15 credits hours would be done away with as it's too impractical, and as far as I know (other than the odd get around it this way, get around it that way (again the MoE spoke about this to us)) it's still in place! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 From Ajarn (Q&A, although some of the answers are a bit hit and miss): "The current Ministry of Education requirements are a minimum of a BA and a TEFL certificate, so by law you won't be able to obtain a teacher's license and then a work permit. There may be some schools however that can find a way of getting you a WP without the degree and we've certainly heard of it happening out in the provinces. Basically you're going to need to ask each potential employer straight out and see what they say." Link: http://www.ajarn.com/questions/askusaquestion2.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ijustwannateach Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 I bet the law says "the equivalent of a TEFL certificate," and that's where the opportunity for lots of people will be. "Steven" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 And the equivalent would be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ijustwannateach Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 Anything they wanted it to be (including a bit under the table, if you take my meaning?!) On a more serious note, experience could probably be substituted. "Steven" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 Generally we you get your teachers licence the school get's (helps) you get it, so they'd have to 'bribe' the MoE, yes I agree the better schools won't have a problem (but then they'd pay enough to attract the people with the right bits of paper) but the smaller langauge schools....well let's just say this 'tea' money thing is maybe a tad over rated (it was hard enough before just having a degree). Well they tried (are trying it) that for the 15 credit hours (3 years EFL/ESL experience at a 'proper' (i.e. not a language) school and obviously if you didn't have a WP....you can't really use it). Another option is to employ them as instructors or consultants! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Palmer Posted August 18, 2004 Author Share Posted August 18, 2004 Harry a CELTA is a TEFL it used to be called the CTEFLA! And as it's purely for adult teaching by your reckoning: "I’m afraid that one stands little chance of being offered a position by one of the reputable language schools (that teachers children) providing a decent salary & set of working conditions, without them." I sense a change in you mate, you okay? you must understand that i had to post what in my opinion & experience best prepares an ELT for work in the LoS. you & others are free to debate this opinion, hopefully out of it will come a well-balanced discussion that will benefit those who use the forum. Harry F. Palmer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadFrankie Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 shouldnt LoS be an all capital LOS harry as an acronym should be written, I aint an english teacher or nothin but its somehthing I was taught at primary school. I hope your not as flippent as this with your students, bad habbits do wear off you know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Palmer Posted August 18, 2004 Author Share Posted August 18, 2004 shouldnt LoS be an all capital LOS harry as an acronym should be written, I aint an english teacher or nothin but its somehthing I was taught at primary school. I hope your not as flippent as this with your students, bad habbits do wear off you know thank you for your correction, one should never be too old or too proud to learn something new. BTW shouldn't sentences begin with the first word capitalised? Oh & shouldn't 'habbits' be spelt habits, aside from not being a teacher, i assume you are not English either i have never yet felt the need to teach the acronym 'LoS' but i will bear it in mind... thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadFrankie Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 As a matter of fact im not throughbread english know, I will now begin all my sentances with a capital letter though. I hope you do not try to mock your students when they make mistakes with grammar aswell it would be ever so unprofessional of you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Palmer Posted August 18, 2004 Author Share Posted August 18, 2004 As a matter of fact im not throughbread english know, I will now begin all my sentances with a capital letter though. I hope you do not try to mock your students when they make mistakes with grammar aswell it would be ever so unprofessional of you Where did I ever claim to be professional? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbkudu Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Another option is to employ them as instructors or consultants! I understand that one can get a work permit without a degree as a 'consultant,' but I am lost on the teacher vs. 'instructor.' Does this mean an English 'instructor' with a TEFL or CELTA and no degree could obtain a work permit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenkannif Posted August 22, 2004 Share Posted August 22, 2004 ^ Possibly (i.e. I don't really know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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