New Entrance Fees For National Parks

[sriracha john]

Meadish

Excellent post. It makes very interesting reading.

Sriracha John

Printed out the announcement now. I'm armed and dangerous!

Those of you who believe you will never be charged 400 or 200 Baht.

Trust me, I speak pretty good Thai, have a non-confrontational attitude, have a tax card, driver's licence and work permit. Usually I pay the local's price. But some parks are unbending in their enforcement of the foreigner fee. It depends on what the head of the National Park has instructed the rangers to do. The heads rotate every few years so things can change. Examples of Parks that would not lower the price under any circumstances were/are Pang Sida in 2002, Khun Tan in 2004, Hat Wanagorn this year, the list goes on.

Good post and to extend the list (I see we share Pang Sida)...

I have never heard of a tax id and work permit in tandem NOT get someone in at local prices.

Just off the top of my head and to be quite specific from personal experiences, the following parks would accept ONLY Thai National ID cards for admission at Thai prices:

Pang Sida National Park

Huay Huat National Park

Khao Sam Roi Yot National Marine Park

Perhaps the same as the NP have grouped their parks into 1, 2, 3, and 4 categories.... we can compile a listing of parks into categories of which parks always enforce the official rules, which ones usually do, which ones do so sporadically, and which ones have gate keepers napping or absent.

[Briggsy]

Perhaps the same as the NP have grouped their parks into 1, 2, 3, and 4 categories.... we can compile a listing of parks into categories of which parks always enforce the official rules, which ones usually do, which ones do so sporadically, and which ones have gate keepers napping or absent.

Coincidentally, I was musing exactly the same thing the other day, a sort of "Cheap Charlie's National Park Database". Dangerous to post it on the net though, he he.

On an aside, they've thought through the list quite well in that the best parks are generally in the pricey category and the bottom category parks are often little beyond some scorched bamboo, at least the area around the visitor centre. However, fish around and you'll find some gems in the lower divisions! Salawin for 100 Baht. That's a bargain. Although when I camped there, they didn't bother charging me anyway!

[thai_narak]

Nothing is fare in life. Why would anyone expect fairness in Thailand? Thais can do whatever they want. It's their country, their laws, and their tactics. If you don't like it, then go elsewhere! The world is a big place.

fully agree with this...

to all the whiners, start preparing your exodus back home or to other asian countries that you may think batter than thailand because the time has come the smiles in thailand have already turned sour towards us foreigners and it's not the thais fault but the bad amongst us ie. sex tourists, child molesters, fake teachers, druglords, mafias, scammers, etc. i can go on and on.

[apetley]

Nothing is fare in life. Why would anyone expect fairness in Thailand? Thais can do whatever they want. It's their country, their laws, and their tactics. If you don't like it, then go elsewhere! The world is a big place.

fully agree with this...

to all the whiners, start preparing your exodus back home or to other asian countries that you may think batter than thailand because the time has come the smiles in thailand have already turned sour towards us foreigners and it's not the thais fault but the bad amongst us ie. sex tourists, child molesters, fake teachers, druglords, mafias, scammers, etc. i can go on and on.

Whilst I agree to an extent that the 'bad' foreigners here have bought about some of the tightening of the rules against expats I can't agree that it's deserved in some way. A few 'bad eggs' are not an excuse to victimise everyone of the same ethnicity, thats playing the Nationalist card in the worst way.

The sex industry will not disappear if there are no westerners in Thailand. The vast majority of customers are homegrown Thai anyway.

There was a report recently, think I read it in the Bangkok Post, detailing child sex abuse in Thailand and that the problem is much as it is worldwide, that is people abusing others in their own family or close friends, ie Thai on Thai. Yes there is farang abuse, but a tiny percentage of the total.

Fake teachers, yes there are fake teachers and good luck in getting rid of them. The fact they are here has as much to do with lack of enforcement of current rules as anything else.

Drug lords, mafia and scammers are nearly all homegrown, some of them even sit in government!

[thai_narak]

Nothing is fare in life. Why would anyone expect fairness in Thailand? Thais can do whatever they want. It's their country, their laws, and their tactics. If you don't like it, then go elsewhere! The world is a big place.

fully agree with this...

to all the whiners, start preparing your exodus back home or to other asian countries that you may think batter than thailand because the time has come the smiles in thailand have already turned sour towards us foreigners and it's not the thais fault but the bad amongst us ie. sex tourists, child molesters, fake teachers, druglords, mafias, scammers, etc. i can go on and on.

Whilst I agree to an extent that the 'bad' foreigners here have bought about some of the tightening of the rules against expats I can't agree that it's deserved in some way. A few 'bad eggs' are not an excuse to victimise everyone of the same ethnicity, thats playing the Nationalist card in the worst way.

The sex industry will not disappear if there are no westerners in Thailand. The vast majority of customers are homegrown Thai anyway.

There was a report recently, think I read it in the Bangkok Post, detailing child sex abuse in Thailand and that the problem is much as it is worldwide, that is people abusing others in their own family or close friends, ie Thai on Thai. Yes there is farang abuse, but a tiny percentage of the total.

Fake teachers, yes there are fake teachers and good luck in getting rid of them. The fact they are here has as much to do with lack of enforcement of current rules as anything else.

Drug lords, mafia and scammers are nearly all homegrown, some of them even sit in government!

you have a point but i'm talking 'bout whiners, complainers, and sort and that the law were tightened because of the bad amongst us so do not complain or better yet get out of thailand...

i'm not a whiner so i'll stay and accept the facts.

[apetley]

I am not a whinger too , or hope that I am not.

But if I see a problem and things can be better or done a better way then I will say so.

Not to is ignorant and lazy.

I will stay in Thailand for as long as I can because I have a lovely Thai wife and because the pros far outweigh the cons.

[JetsetBkk]

the pros far outweigh the cons.

I've rarely been conned.

[sriracha john]

National park fees reduced for foreigners

The National Parks Department has cut the entrance fees for foreigners to national parks countrywide in a bid to lure more overseas tourists. The reduction came after the department received a number of complaints from foreign visitors that the fees are too high, compared with the poor facilities for tourists at the parks. Effective from Dec 1, entrance fees for adult foreigners have been cut from 400 to 200 baht for the most popular parks, and by 75% for the less popular ones, according to the department. Among the most popular sites where the fees were cut by half for foreigners include the marine national parks of Koh Lanta National in Krabi, Koh Chang in Trat, Koh Angthong in Surat Thani and Koh Tarutao in Satun. The entrance fees for the top national parks in the North and Northeast such as Doi Suthep and Doi Inthanont in Chiang Mai, Jae Son in Lampang, Khao Phra Viharn in Si Sa Ket and Khao Yai in Nakhon Ratchasima have also been cut by half. The entrance fee for the famous Koh Surin and Koh Similan in Phangnga province is still set at 200 baht for children and 400 baht for adult foreigners. To lure more tourists to lesser-known national parks, the rate for foreigners has been cut from 400 to 100 baht for adults and from 200 to 50 baht for children. Department chief Chalermsak Wanichsombat said the fee adjustment was aimed at promoting tourism. While foreigners enjoyed a sharp reduction in national park entrance fees, locals will be charged more at some popular sites.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/07Dec2007_news15.php

[Sourdough Al]

Some finally woke up and smelled the coffee

I guess the decision making process sometimes works.

[Scott]

Well apparently they aren't going to be like the boy who killed the goose that laid the golden egg--at least not for now!

[wilko]

Some finally woke up and smelled the coffee

I guess the decision making process sometimes works.

Not really this is a face-saving exercise that is totally ill thought out and will result in chaos around the national parks. What is needed is a simple one tier pricing system based on the budget of the parks.

Edited December 7, 2007 by wilko

[Galong]

And (to me at least) the most surprising bit in this article is, "locals will be charged more at some popular sites". I'm guessing that that will be changed as the locals start complaining.

This is a move in the right direction. Now, if only they would improve the facilities at most national parks and start patrolling the parks to catch poachers.

[wilko]

How do you propose to catch a poacher who's the ranger's Dad?

UIt'll only be a move in the right direction if it was enforceable and organised - ?????

what will happen will be an open market where everyone will have to negotiate with the local "jobsworth" to get an entrance fee.

I still can't see the point of visiting a park the size of Kao Yai when the entrance fee is only valid for one day - it just kills the whole thing.

Edited December 7, 2007 by wilko

[tartempion]

From Bangkok Post:

Thon Thamrongnawasawat, a leading marine biologist at Kasetsart University, said lowering the entrance fees would only benefit tour operators.

Foreign tourists mostly buy a package tour from local operators which includes the park fees. So the new rates are unlikely to lure more foreign tourists to the national parks, he said.

So this man ignores the expat community.

With lower fees I would and will vistit parks.

As for the original translation it says the main parks (Kao Yai, Doi Inthanon etc) remain at B400, go figure

[Galong]

From Bangkok Post:

Thon Thamrongnawasawat, a leading marine biologist at Kasetsart University, said lowering the entrance fees would only benefit tour operators.

Foreign tourists mostly buy a package tour from local operators which includes the park fees. So the new rates are unlikely to lure more foreign tourists to the national parks, he said.

So this man ignores the expat community.

With lower fees I would and will vistit parks.

And what's so wrong with helping tour operators? Many, if not most of them are Thai. All tour operators have been hit hard by increases in transportation costs thanks to oil company greed. This would only help a little bit I reckon.

Why should Thon Thamrongnawasawat, a biologist, be able to vent his apparently racist views? He should have his hands full with finding ways to protect the marine environment that is being raped by Thai fishermen... concentrate on that Khun Thon.

[sriracha john]

I still can't see the point of visiting a park the size of Kao Yai when the entrance fee is only valid for one day - it just kills the whole thing.

You're supposed to be good to go for 5 days.... previously we've stayed at another, much smaller, park (Tarutao) for this long and paid only once. Similarly, with Erawan, 3 days for one admission.

Edited December 7, 2007 by sriracha john

[sriracha john]

From Bangkok Post:

Thon Thamrongnawasawat, a leading marine biologist at Kasetsart University, said lowering the entrance fees would only benefit tour operators.

Foreign tourists mostly buy a package tour from local operators which includes the park fees. So the new rates are unlikely to lure more foreign tourists to the national parks, he said.

So this man ignores the expat community.

With lower fees I would and will vistit parks.

As for the original translation it says the main parks (Kao Yai, Doi Inthanon etc) remain at B400, go figure

Thon does quantify his statements somewhat mildly with the use of "mostly". What are the percentages of visitors on tour packages versus the ex-pat visiting? From what I've seen, I'd say there are "more" tour package visitors.

Thank you for pointing out some of the specifics on any discrepancy between the latest news and meadish's OP. I was rushed when I posted the article and I hadn't had a chance to do that.... although I had suspected there would be some.

With any drastic change, there's likely to be some inconsitencies with the gatekeepers as wilko points out. I do, however, agree with the premise of the OP in that parks with more facilities, etc. charge more than those with not much or even nothing.

[bonobo]

The dual pricing system used to upset me, but then I started to think that as I haven't been paying taxes to the Thai government until recently, it fell in line with out-of-state tuition in the US. And now that I do pay taxes, if my work permit will get me the Thai rate, then all is copescetic.

As an aside, we were on a houseboat on a lake north of Kachanaburi and late at night, pulled into a park with 7 waterfalls. I got up early for a run, and the guards and such, besides giving me water, helpfully pointed me up the long road to the falls. I had a really nice run, and went back down to the boat where my Thai friends were just stirring. We ate, then started back up to see the falls together, and now, I was asked to pay 400 baht. As I had already seen the falls, I declined and went back to the boat to read.

THe lesson for this is that I am going to try to jog onto some parks and see if that works again!

[Ricardo]

How do you propose to catch a poacher who's the ranger's Dad?

Answer ... very diplomatically.

[rono]

I have a guesthouse near khao yai and have watched the road traffic. I also know some tour operators.

Most large scaled resorts around will take their guests into the park and will most probably not reduce the price because they charge for a package including transportation, entrance fee, ranger fee, food,... so visitors using this package will most probably not benefit from the reduced entrance fee, its only extra profit for the resort.

Forget about the rising fuel cost, they are located about 10 km from the park and push up to 10-12 foreigners in the back of a pick up so fuel cost is minimal but 10-20 x 200 baht extra profit per day is most welcome.

Independent local tour operators: they work same as the resorts. Prices they all charge: 2000 to 2500 baht per person, not bad for a days work if you have 20 guests.

I advise my guests not to use tour operators but to take a 10 baht bus to the park and pay the entrance fee, they will benefit from the reduced fees.

From what I see, most foreign visitors (90%) are tourists buying the package, expats come with their friends/family by car, they will benefit from the fees, so in general the reduced fees are mostly good for the expats.

rono

[wilko]

I still can't see the point of visiting a park the size of Kao Yai when the entrance fee is only valid for one day - it just kills the whole thing.

You're supposed to be good to go for 5 days.... previously we've stayed at another, much smaller, park (Tarutao) for this long and paid only once. Similarly, with Erawan, 3 days for one admission.

So now you pay 400 baht every day???.......that's what the new regs imply!

Edited December 7, 2007 by wilko

[007]

From Bangkok Post:

Thon Thamrongnawasawat, a leading marine biologist at Kasetsart University, said lowering the entrance fees would only benefit tour operators.

Foreign tourists mostly buy a package tour from local operators...

Does he (she?) think that only Chinese and Korean tourists visit the parks? The last time I bought a package tour was twenty years ago.

Edited December 7, 2007 by 7

[sriracha john]

I still can't see the point of visiting a park the size of Kao Yai when the entrance fee is only valid for one day - it just kills the whole thing.

You're supposed to be good to go for 5 days.... previously we've stayed at another, much smaller, park (Tarutao) for this long and paid only once. Similarly, with Erawan, 3 days for one admission.

So now you pay 400 baht every day???.......that's what the new regs imply!

Could you please point out where it implies that?

Sorry, but what I meant was that you are now good to go for 5 days for one admission, whereas previously it was 7 days.

Unfortunately the official NP website still hasn't updated as the portions dumped contained the rule I was referring to.

[rono]

I can only speak for khao yai park, heard that the old 400 baht fee was for one day only, of course you can rent a room in the park (booking) and stay as long as you wish.

With the new fees in place you can visit the park twice for the same money

rono

[sriracha john]

From Bangkok Post:

Thon Thamrongnawasawat, a leading marine biologist at Kasetsart University, said lowering the entrance fees would only benefit tour operators.

Foreign tourists mostly buy a package tour from local operators...

Does he (she?) think that only Chinese and Korean tourists visit the parks? The last time I bought a package tour was twenty years ago.

I think you have to look at his "most" part... and keep our presence in perspective.

There 8 parks in the NP system that each have in excess of 100,000 visitors per year. (NP website stat)

While the numbers for ex-pats visitors might be large; in comparison to those levels, it is not that many.

"Most" non-Thai visitors probably DO buy package tours when they visit a NP.

[wilko]

I can only speak for khao yai park, heard that the old 400 baht fee was for one day only, of course you can rent a room in the park (booking) and stay as long as you wish.

With the new fees in place you can visit the park twice for the same money

rono

No - they can now charge you for every day you stay there - just knock on your door in the morning.....it says DAILY

Edited December 7, 2007 by wilko

[sonnyJ]

I can only speak for khao yai park, heard that the old 400 baht fee was for one day only, of course you can rent a room in the park (booking) and stay as long as you wish.

With the new fees in place you can visit the park twice for the same money

rono

No - they can now charge you for every day you stay there - just knock on your door in the morning.....it says DAILY

Come on. TIT. Nobody will pay.

edit:

Would it be same for Thais? Again, come on.

Edited December 7, 2007 by sonnyJ

[gregb]

Just to repeat, never, ever is race mentioned in any entrance requirements; citizenship status is. Do citizens of a country have rights and priveleges non-citizens don't have? Around the world, yes!

This is the kind of ridiculous garbage that always annoys me.

In a national security situation (AKA Visa, immigration, etc.) yes, you are correct, citizenship matters.

In all other instances, RESIDENCY matters. If you live somewhere and pay taxes, you are treated the same as anyone else living there and paying taxes. Show me an instance where that isn't true, and I'll show you discrimination.

So, you are WRONG! Around the world, NO! Except in cases of national security. Otherwise, residency is the defining issue. If the Thais used residency rather than citizenship as their criteria, we would not be having this discussion.

Don't confuse people with incorrect statements in the future, please.

I for one, just avoid the national parks altogether. I won't pay the ridiculously inflated prices, and it isn't worth the stress.

[TAWP]

I always find it amaizing to see the protectors of all that is thai - but obviously wrong - come crawling out of their little holes. A pathetic bunch - would definately do well in UK councils. They are easily recognisable by their appearance - usually short (having short man syndrome), bald, and with bad dental hygene. However, they adopt the most ridiculous contentious view points - it is a sort of psycholical reaction to having bad teeth, or like standing on a box to give them stature. They know who they are!!

Can we see a picture of the handsome you?

For you and Sunrise007, a mirror will do.

[wilko]

I can only speak for khao yai park, heard that the old 400 baht fee was for one day only, of course you can rent a room in the park (booking) and stay as long as you wish.

With the new fees in place you can visit the park twice for the same money

rono

No - they can now charge you for every day you stay there - just knock on your door in the morning.....it says DAILY

Come on. TIT. Nobody will pay.

edit:

Would it be same for Thais? Again, come on.

I've said earlier that this new system is destined for failure...it's far too complicated and un-enforceable.

So why oh why make such ridiculous laws in the first place? this is just another way for some local to bully the unsuspecting tourists into paying an unreasonable amount of money......

"Look....you should pay 1200 baht each for 3 days...I give you discount - only 800 baht each.." and so on thetourists think they are getting a good deal the "ranger" gets his 400 baht a head and the park gets sod all towards up-keep!