Thai "beach Boys" And The Like

[Nampeung]

Tarts get the rough end of the stick - get real and understand that and don't complain on TV because Thai men will take advantage of any Western woman offering her body up. I am married in a good Thai/Farang marriage. All you guys out there in dodgy rels with Thai guys... ask advice here and it shall be offered

Edited November 20, 2008 by Nampeung

[zaza]

Well I became involved with a well educated guy who is well respected (in his eyes at least) and has a good job in the humanitarian sector. He is not poor but kept bleating on about his poor beginning in life (he is in his 50's so when will he get over it). Also the terrible things that happened in his life, etc etc. I ran around after him while he spent time off visiting the first wife up north and the much younger one in Laos (he told me he was divorced from #1 and #2 well he was just looking after her and it was not a real marriage)- plus all the others in various places. But what a consumate liar he was and what a fool I was. Reading these posts have opened my eyes that I am not the only one that gets the treatment. Yes, marriage, plans for the future were discussed, cute sms messages etc until he turned into a total creep and became nasty and then I said bye bye. Thank you everyone for the valuable information and insights you are providing.

MM

Scum bags and crooks are from all over the world, you can meet one of them wherever you live.

There is NO affiliation at all between honesty and a particular race or nationality or gender or religion or even education.

p.s.I honestly feel for you;I know how you feel now, if you need help ,please don't hesitate in asking.

[patklang]

u could substitute the word thai for italian, israeli or whatever; the young travel the world girls arrive, and the local boys see a big sign over their heads saying: sex free...

ask my 18 yr old what he thinks of the american girls coming over for volunteering on kibbutz etc.... : he says, ans i quote: mom, they all dress like they are the mattress of the group..." and he is a virgin!!! and not a hard boy at all... but reputation and action (even if its bluff) project the message that is misread by the locals....

i think most of these girls also leave their brains at the airport when they see the sun and fun....

tel aviv beach is filled with the same stories.....

mothers, teach your daughters well...(and put some condoms/birth control in their suitcase as well)

bina

israel

Very good point bina.Too many farang/brit women go on holiday and act like tramps and give the decent ladies a bad name.you ask any guy in the world about european women and they all say,EASY.Even some of my west indiand ates from uk go out to pick up brit ladies because they cant get sex on the first date with west indian women.i also find the turks disgusting in the way they talk about non turk women.

[popmybubble]

u could substitute the word thai for italian, israeli or whatever; the young travel the world girls arrive, and the local boys see a big sign over their heads saying: sex free...

ask my 18 yr old what he thinks of the american girls coming over for volunteering on kibbutz etc.... : he says, ans i quote: mom, they all dress like they are the mattress of the group..." and he is a virgin!!! and not a hard boy at all... but reputation and action (even if its bluff) project the message that is misread by the locals....

i think most of these girls also leave their brains at the airport when they see the sun and fun....

tel aviv beach is filled with the same stories.....

mothers, teach your daughters well...(and put some condoms/birth control in their suitcase as well)

bina

israel

Very good point bina.Too many farang/brit women go on holiday and act like tramps and give the decent ladies a bad name.you ask any guy in the world about european women and they all say,EASY.Even some of my west indiand ates from uk go out to pick up brit ladies because they cant get sex on the first date with west indian women.i also find the turks disgusting in the way they talk about non turk women.

So do you think a woman is a tramp if she has a one night stand? If a man does it, what does that make him? a tramp too?

[girlx]

well the topic is not about tramps but rather normal nice girls who inadvertently fall "in love" with the bad boys of the beach. but i agree, there are many "tramps" throwing themselves at guys on the islands and elsewhere, and it makes it difficult and dangerous for the rest of us because a lot of (ignorant) thai men will assume we are all up for it even when we are not. the tramps also provide an unending supply of ready, willing, and nubile flesh which perpetuates this situation of the boys treating the girl of the moment like crap simply because they can. it's not the implied immorality that bothers me, it's the lack of understanding of the local culture (by the girls) and their effects on it. similar to the full moon partiers' disregard for thai culture and the local environment.

Edited November 23, 2008 by girlx

[JimsKnight]

When I first arrived in LOS many many moons ago I got talking to this chatty security guy at the Lucky Mansion down in Phuket.

It turns out that he was a former 'beach boy' doing the parachuting gliding/speedboat thing in Pattaya when he was younger.

He was telling me all about his one time where he deflowered / (date raped??!) a hi-so girl after drugging her first (ya ba i think).

He then was lucky not to be killed when her father (wondering where she was all night) interrogated his daughter and hunted this guy down with 2 of his henchmen and the said beach-boy saw them coming and fled to on a waterski out to sea until the coast was clear!! He was insistant that he was going to be killed and dumped in the middle of nowhere!

I kind of agreed with the fathers position on that one.

But he seemed to certainly consider it a badge of honour in 'getting' a hi-so girl into the sack. I tried to extract the exact nature of why he'd drugged her for an answer but he wouldn't give a straight answer. I think he truly believes its OK to drug girls to get them into bed. A complete lack of empathy is what I sensed from him.

He ended up returning to Pattaya beach later and fleeing to Phuket on the bus with nothing except 1500 baht in his pocket and the clothes he stood up in.

getting thrown in jail.

The scary thing is he still admitted to sleeping with Thai women at the massage brothel despite having a wife and two kids in Phuket!!

He then had the nerve to ask if I'd pay for him to come drinking and whoring there!!

Parasitic doesn't even come close, he got told to take a hike!

He looked in bad shape and circumstances, I think he deserved it.

I find in life Fate has a certain way of swinging around like a wrecking ball and knocking such characters into the middle of next century

[girlx]

I find in life Fate has a certain way of swinging around like a wrecking ball and knocking such characters into the middle of next century biggrin.gif

i really hope you are right about that... as i know quite a few characters like that myself.

[Gaccha]

well the topic is not about tramps but rather normal nice girls who inadvertently fall "in love" with the bad boys of the beach. but i agree, there are many "tramps" throwing themselves at guys on the islands and elsewhere, and it makes it difficult and dangerous for the rest of us because a lot of (ignorant) thai men will assume we are all up for it even when we are not. the tramps also provide an unending supply of ready, willing, and nubile flesh which perpetuates this situation of the boys treating the girl of the moment like crap simply because they can. it's not the implied immorality that bothers me, it's the lack of understanding of the local culture (by the girls) and their effects on it. similar to the full moon partiers' disregard for thai culture and the local environment.

ah...but it is the implied morality that bothers you. You are reinforcing it. You are aware of the discourse of good girl/bad girl (madonna/whore) and you are depending on it for your analysis.

So lets look where it comes from. In a social sense a female must be a hypocrite. As a strategy, admitting to vast numbers of sexual partners and a liberal attitude is catastrophic for her chances of finding a long time mate unless she is so stunning that her looks enable her to keep the guy (at least until the inevitable children are old). The alternative strategy, practised out of necessity by most females of the human species, is along a line of continuum from virgin to whore. In the West the line heads towards whore as they entice the male with the possibility of sex but also must ensure he feels they do not sleep around. The worst case scenario for a male is to be cuckolded. So a male's preference is for all women to be whores except his one. She must only be with him. And noone else. So the rational strategy of every woman must be to claim to be a madonna (unconvincing in the West, so a mild adaption is made, perhaps 3 or 4 boys now seems reasonable) but to behave as a 'tramp'.

So lets deconstruct Girlx. Girlx is falling for a very powerful and seductive dichochomous discourse of either whore or madonna. Either a tramp or nice girl. Indeed, it is so dangerous for a girl to admit to a sleeping around (cf. boys) that even on this forum it is unlikely that any girl/woman on this forum will admit to it, unless strictly anonymous, yet every indicator out there says all women in the West are at it. If you are now offended by this last sentence, it shows just how powerful this discourse is. It should not offend you in a liberal, secular way of thinking, but I am questioning how many men you sleep with, and this will damage your long-term relational prospects.

But surely it is only an idea, it doesn't matter. But it really matters. Ideas control the way you behave. They are so powerful, every woman who has gone with a 'beach boy' (another idea) is keen to retrospectively morally justify their position. Current academic thinking, is that all actions have no moral deicision, but are a moral construction is retroactively applied. "I slept with him as he was different from the usual boys".

You will now need to read this again.

Is there anything that can be done? Yes, you can fight the discourse of ideational relationships with a discursive analysis. Look out for the intellectual gymnastics that people perfrom to show they are on the right side of morality and, in this case, not the tramp.

It is remarkable how far this goes. If I said 'gender' is socially constructed you would probably say 'of course'. But what if I said your 'sex' is socially constructed. That is 'sex'(girl or boy) is not a brute truth, it is not a scientific fact that can be ticked off by objective indicators... How does that tickle you?

[girlx]

pretentious much? i believe there is a whole spectrum between girls who take their time and carefully choose their sex partners with good intention in addition to lust, and those who do so carelessly without regard to the boy's relationship status, culture, or potential diseases etc. (just as there is a spectrum with men). you could refer to the two ends of the spectrum as madonna and whore if you like, but that implies a religious or at least moralistic perspective that preaches that a woman is more of a sinner the more notches she adds to her belt. i do not care about the moral aspects beyond the fact that i think girls (and boys) should not hurt others- ie. they should make an effort to scope out the situation first and see if there is already a significant other who would feel betrayed by their physical pleasure. they should also realize that coming into a culture with very different traditions and norms, they have a responsibility to respect those, and they should take into consideration how not respecting them reflects on fellow female visitors. the madonna/whore dicotomy is not really on topic anyway- the topic (as i have had to repeat throughout the thread) was intended to warn the more innocent and vulnerable of girls who travel to thailand that there is a very definite game on, and the players are professionals wearing very deceptive masks. similar to the numerous warnings everywhere to the farang men who come and play a similar but more transparent game with bar girls.

[sbk]

Nicely said, girlx.

And to Gaccha, let me just add that this thread is not about "deconstructing girlx". I am sure she will do quite well without your armchair psychoanalysis

[Gaccha]

pretentious much? i believe there is a whole spectrum between girls who take their time and carefully choose their sex partners with good intention in addition to lust, and those who do so carelessly without regard to the boy's relationship status, culture, or potential diseases etc. (just as there is a spectrum with men). you could refer to the two ends of the spectrum as madonna and whore if you like, but that implies a religious or at least moralistic perspective that preaches that a woman is more of a sinner the more notches she adds to her belt. i do not care about the moral aspects beyond the fact that i think girls (and boys) should not hurt others- ie. they should make an effort to scope out the situation first and see if there is already a significant other who would feel betrayed by their physical pleasure. they should also realize that coming into a culture with very different traditions and norms, they have a responsibility to respect those, and they should take into consideration how not respecting them reflects on fellow female visitors. the madonna/whore dicotomy is not really on topic anyway- the topic (as i have had to repeat throughout the thread) was intended to warn the more innocent and vulnerable of girls who travel to thailand that there is a very definite game on, and the players are professionals wearing very deceptive masks. similar to the numerous warnings everywhere to the farang men who come and play a similar but more transparent game with bar girls.

I like this post. Except the first sentence/question

You have spotted the important point, that it is a game. The control of the idea means someone is controlling who thinks what. Your question is to ask why. Instead, depressingly, your question was to ask if my reply was 'pretentious'. You feel I am claiming undeserved self-importance in what I wrote.

My post, was deconstructing the language of the girlx post, not to psychoanlayse girlx (on an armchair or otherwise). I, of course, do no psychoanalyse in my post. On the contrary, it is a language analyse (a la Foucalt). I have no idea what girlx is really thinking.

So, was my claim I made important? Well, I appear to have been misunderstood by sbk. I was saying that this thread would not exist if girlx was able to break away from the ideas that she so well presents in the post above. Someone, somewhere, have imposed the ideas of tramps and beach boys and by there imposition has affected how you behave. I said don't let them. So was my post important? It could not have been more important. I question the very foundation for the entire thread.

I remain a devoted fan of many of girlx's astutely observed comments throughout the forum.

The bit I highlighted was exactly what I wanted to hear. That is what my post aimed to conclude. When I said Madonna/Whore, I was not, of course, applying my own morality, but placing the two extremist, unspoken positions of the ideas. If you spit out the extremes you can often attack the preposterous core of many 'truths' in the world. I think girlx has just done that.

I am hoping the thread will conclude:

1. don't class girls as tramps

2. don't class boys as beach boys

3. be aware of a new environment where you are unfamiliar with its workings

4. don't get brainwashed by social codes derived from 'common sense'

5. enjoy your time on the beach

[girlx]

Instead, depressingly, your question was to ask if my reply was 'pretentious'. You feel I am claiming undeserved self-importance in what I wrote.

My post, was deconstructing the language of the girlx post, not to psychoanlayse girlx (on an armchair or otherwise). I, of course, do no psychoanalyse in my post. On the contrary, it is a language analyse (a la Foucalt). I have no idea what girlx is really thinking.

i understand, i am super analytical and am often accused of pretentiousness as well. The way you write does come off as patronizing at first, but I see your points nevertheless.

[Gaccha]

i understand, i am super analytical and am often accused of pretentiousness as well. The way you write does come off as patronizing at first, but I see your points nevertheless.

I know I know, but what do I do? Obviously, if it was just a one-to-one exchange I could dump the rhetorical style and make it much more pithy. But I want to persuade casual readers that I am right (and I am right... ). And even when I lay out my argument with so much exposition, even going to the (patronising) length of asking people to read my post again, I still find third parties not not 'getting' my points.

Anyway, I fear we are both liberals in a world awash with bigotry , prejudice, ignorance, ill-informed chronic inanane stupidity. Not that anyone on this forum would fit into those categories... perhaps.

...which neatly brings me back to the topic. For all new girls coming across beach boys. Look out, as you would look out in a nightclub in Luton, and hold back fro safety reasons, but don't hold back because you fear a label.

[BarryM]

That's an awful lot of talking for simply getting laid on holiday.

[Lite Beer]

Posts containing links to items referring to Bar Boys have been deleted as per forum rules.

[sbk]

Lets be clear on one point here, in order to suffice those posters complaining about double standards.

The beach boys I know are not play for pay, do not engage in prostitution. In fact, all of them have jobs and do work. In most cases, the girls they are with are just for a casual night of fun. These boys are ubiquitous to all beach resorts, from what I understand. Their behavior and attitudes towards western women who may think that they are something other than what they are, is an issue that affects women visiting and living in this country. The fact is, these boys are out for a fun time and live a life that most single guys would find enviable in that they have single, usually very pretty, girls throwing themselves at them every night. Just because they engage in casual promiscuous sex does not make them prostitutes.

Also, let me point out that the Ladies forum is a forum for women to talk about issues concerning women in Thailand. We have been discussing just that.

[Gaccha]

Also, let me point out that the Ladies forum is a forum for women to talk about issues concerning women in Thailand. We have been discussing just that.

Yes, yes. But what are "women"? The author below explains how sex (male vs. female) is a product of the discourse of gender (and not the other way around). Recommended reading.

"All Made Up: Performance Theory and the New Anthropology of Sex and Gender", Rosalind C. Morris, Annual Review of Anthropology, Vol. 24, (1995), pp. 567-592

[Nampeung]

[Tommy89]

It's like dating a chav !!

wich smart girl that respects her self would date a chav ?

only the naive ones that don't have enough experience with dating boys .

A chav (in europe) :

please note: there also exists a kind of chav that wears nice and representfull shirts and hats. (

Edited November 28, 2008 by Tommy89

[HorseDoctor]

having spent much time on the larger islands in thailand and observed the ways of the thai beach boys from a cultural and habitual perspective, i feel it might be helpful to put out some advice for those new girls to thailand who find themselves interested in a thai beach boy, as i am so tired and depressed at seeing these young, beautiful, naive girls come to thailand with no knowledge of the culture or situation and getting beat, cheated on, lied to, left pregnant or sick with STDs, and publicly humiliated by one of these guys, and sent home crying their eyes out, their self esteem ruined.

here's the deal, and you might think i am being overly harsh but i could refer you to plenty of girls who learned the hard way:

- it's all about sex, not love. thai guys have to work very hard and even pay money to a thai girl's family before she will let him in. in contrast, farang girls on holiday will jump right into bed with the boys, and it's free! they have many girls to choose from, you are not important to them. every single week there arrives a new load of nubile, easy tourist girls. i have seen so many times the boys take their "girlfriend" of the week to the boat to leave, and they wait there for the next boat to pull in and pick up whatever stupid girl is on it. face it, these guys get these jobs many time because thai girls do not want them. they work around farang girls because they know it is easy and free to get them in bed. every single one of these girls thinks they are special, and that their new man is "different" and they soon find out they are wrong.

- they lie. they will say absolutely ANYTHING to get you to sleep with them. it is a game. there is a lot of backslapping with their friends when they succeed in picking you up. they will lie about their age, marital status, how much money they make, everything in their past. the goal is simply to win. this is the same in every culture but in a tourist area it becomes a lot more hard core.

-they are not safe. you need to wear condoms, and if you don't, god help you. these guys sleep with an insane number of girls, and some with boys as well. even if you have been together for a couple weeks, that doesn't mean it is safe to stop wearing condoms. if yu want to do that, go get both of you tested first.

-some of these guys are serious criminals. you might think it is glamorous to date a drug dealer, but look up the drug laws in thailand. it isn't fun to watch your boyfriend out of his head every night either. a lot of the boys i know have actually raped and/or murdered someone in the past! they definitely aren't going to tell you this themself. they also can be very violent, and no one is going to tell you that they beat the crap out of the last little english girl who was here because everyone around them is afraid of repercussions. a good rule to keep in mind is that if there are any long term farang girls around, and they seem wary of discussing your man, it is because they have been threatened. if they drop you any hints, take them seriously- they have seen these guys in action. the stupidest thing you can do is run right back to the guy saying "so and so said"- in the long run you will have sabatoged the only support network available to you.

- if they get you pregnant and want to marry you in a short amount of time, they probably want a visa to your country. most of the girls i know who got pregnant were abandoned by their boyfriend for the next sweet young thing. as for marriage, it doesn't stop most of them from cheating. do some reading on thai culture, visit their family, look at their friends and position in society, and ask yourself "do i really know and trust this guy to build a life with?" before you get ahead of yourself. some of these guys are very poor and see you as their meal ticket. don't trust an offer of free land either. nothing is free.

beach boys have a bad reputation, and it is well deserved. don't assume that all thai men are the same (there are lots of nice thai guys around, but it seems like once they become too involved with the tourist industry they get jaded and hard), and there are even one or two of the beach boys that turn out to be ok in the long run. but there are far, far more broken heart stories than good ones in this element of society. generally speaking, if you meet a young, good looking guy in a tourist area, who speaks decent english, has a tattoo or piercing or farang style clothes, who says he is a dj, who twirls fire, or who works at a bar, they are most likely professionals with a long history. the worst ones i have met are on koh chang, in bangkok, and on koh phangan. make sure you know what you are in for. it's cool to come and have fun for a week or so on your holiday, but it is when you start taking it more seriously that you will have problems. you have to be willing to work through a lot of crap over a long period of time before there is a possibility of a successful relationship. if you don't plan on staying in thailand, then forget about it. watch out for number one, and good luck.

So Thai Beach Boys will say anything to get laid, etc etc., so are different from other men..... how?

[HorseDoctor]

Also, let me point out that the Ladies forum is a forum for women to talk about issues concerning women in Thailand. We have been discussing just that.

Yes, yes. But what are "women"? The author below explains how sex (male vs. female) is a product of the discourse of gender (and not the other way around). Recommended reading.

"All Made Up: Performance Theory and the New Anthropology of Sex and Gender", Rosalind C. Morris, Annual Review of Anthropology, Vol. 24, (1995), pp. 567-592

.

Yeah " Ladies" forum ???, uh let's all sit around and hold an aspirin between our knees.

And "girls?" It's like woman is a bad term . You can't be sexually attractive if you're a woman , too old? Only " Girls" are f*ckable . JUst more sexism .

[sbk]

Actually the naming of the forum had more to do with google, search terms and ranking then sexism but if it makes you feel better to think so, feel free

[HaleySabai]

Just when I thought I couldn't hear more good things about the 'Thai-man'...along comes this astute commentary on this particular species of male Homo-Sapian.

I was under the impression that Farang women generally went to Bali for 'beach-boy' encounters.

Where there is a fool wearing panties or jockeys there is someone willing to remove them...and so the story goes.

 

Edited July 25, 2019 by HaleySabai