Spee Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 Thai language class is going well and I'm taking the first really big step by plunging head first into reading and writing thai script, starting with the alphabet, numbers and simple words. In going through the alphabet training program from www.learningthai.com, I had some questions on some of the word representations. I wanted to understand what the words represented accurately but couldn't find an exact description to these letters (and their thai names). What are they? ฎปฎัก tor bpa-tuk picture looks like a spear or javelin or maybe a pen, but can’t tell and the dictionary gives different thai words for these anyway ฑมณโฑ thor mon-tho picture looks like a prince or princess or some sort of spiritual figure ภสำเภา phor sam-phao picture looks like an older style sailing ship ษฦาษี sor reu-see picture looks like an old man meditating หหีบ hor heep picture looks like a storage box or suitcase ฬจุฬา lor juu-laa picture looks like a kite, but the dictionary word for kite is: wao/f/ or ว่าว ---------------------------- On a separate tact, I am having trouble understanding when and how to use the "ai" dipthong. Is it something to do with inantimate ojects versus living objects? In class, the teacher said the “ใ“ was used more towards spritual things (e.g., jai dee), whereas the “ไ“ is used more for inantimate objects. But I don’t understand things like this case where they are used in the same phrase to describe a leaf or group of leaves. ใบไม้ bai/m/ maai/h/ In this case, both forms of the "ai" dipthong are used in describing the same thing, which is a leaf or group of leaves. Help please !! TIA .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Jones Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 ฎปฎัก tor bpa-tuk - A kind of spear ฑมณโฑ thor mon-tho - Montho the Queen ภสำเภา phor sam-phao - a kind of ship ษฦาษี sor reu-see - hermit หหีบ hor heep - a kind of box ฬจุฬา lor juu-laa - a kind of kite On the second point, the use of ai-mai-muan (sorry no Thai keyboard - I had to copy your script from below), I think it is only used with the following 20 words: Glai (falling tone) Krai (normal tone) Krai (falling tone) Chai (falling tone) Chai (high tone) Yai (normal tone) Jai (normal tome) Dai (normal tone) Dtai (falling tone) Nai (normal tone) Bai (normal tone) Bai (falling tone) Fai (low tone) Sa-pai (low/hight tone) Sai (low tone) Sai (rising tone) Long-lai (normal/rising tone) Hai (falling tone) Mai (low tone) Yai (low tone) It's just a question of learning these and then every other word with an ai vowel, uses ai-ma-lai. Spee are you based in the UK? If so had did you get hold of your Thai keyboard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the scouser Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 Spee are you based in the UK? If so had did you get hold of your Thai keyboard? Hi Jack, If you use Windows XP the facility to type in Thai is already lurking on your computer, you just need to install it. It's then a matter of plodding through your Roman alphabet keyboard seing which key relates to which Thai character. For instructions try here. Click on the "Thai fonts" link. Scouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the scouser Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 picture looks like a kite, but the dictionary word for kite is:wao/f/ or ว่าว That's the most common word for kite and if you kite fly you can be said to ชักว่าว. Scouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gburns57au Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 But I don’t understand things like this case where they are used in the same phrase to describe a leaf or group of leaves. ใบไม้ bai/m/ maai/h/ In this case, both forms of the "ai" dipthong are used in describing the same thing, which is a leaf or group of leaves. Help please ! That is a word not a phrase..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spee Posted October 31, 2004 Author Share Posted October 31, 2004 Spee are you based in the UK? If so had did you get hold of your Thai keyboard? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks for the advice Jack! Yeah I'm on a temporary assignment in the UK. The keyboard I use is a virtual keyboard called Unitype GlobalWriter. It is the demo version that can be downloaded from their website (www.unitype.com and look for the globalwriter demo). It is a pretty slick little app. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boon Mee Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 picture looks like a kite, but the dictionary word for kite is:wao/f/ or ว่าว That's the most common word for kite and if you kite fly you can be said to ชักว่าว. Scouse. And you can be sure to get some laughs if you tell your Thai friends about going to the park to "Chuck-Wow" บุญมี Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firefoxx Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 I never remembered the "b is for boat" stuff for Thai and I learned the language well enough. It's not a necessary part of learning a language. As for the ใ ไ dipthongs (never knew they were called dipthongs, hehe) I don't think you should worry yourself over the details. You'll learn to know the difference of which one to use as you go along, just like you learn to know when to use "to" "too" and "two", through experience, and not through getting generalizations in your head. ไหม silk ไหม้ burning ไฟไหม้ a fire ใด which ใคร who ใต้ south ใจ heart ใช้ use ให้ give ใบ any type of sheet ไม่ no ไม้ related to trees ใบไม้ a leaf ใบเรือ a sail เรือใบ a sailing boat ใน inside ไหน where ไฝ mole ไว fast ไง how ไป go ไอ cough ไท free ไทย Thai! As you can see, there is really no good rule to describe which word uses which. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spee Posted November 1, 2004 Author Share Posted November 1, 2004 As for the ใ ไ dipthongs (never knew they were called dipthongs, hehe) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks for the info. Not a language expert, but "dipthong" is not something specific to Thai. I think it is a description for vowel pairs is any language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Jones Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 I don't know much about the history of the language but I would guess that some of the words used to represent the letters of the alphabet are older style words and not used today in everyday language. With regard to the query on bai-maai, ai-mai-muan is only used with the word bai (leaf) and ai-mai-m-lai is used with the word maai. I think if this translated into English there is a hyphen between the two words, although you are right bai-maai and bai both mean leaf. I guess it's one of the querks you get with any language. My advice would be to learn those 20 words and then you're safe in the knowledge that every other word with an ai sound uses ai-mai-m-lai. BTW: Thanks for the advice on the keyboard, I'll have a play at the weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard W Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 ฎปฎักtor bpa-tuk - A kind of spear Also translated as 'goad', as in a cattle-goad. ฑมณโฑthor mon-tho - Montho the Queen Wife of Totsakan ('ten-necked'), the villain of the first part of the Ramakhian.In the Indan version, the Ramayana, she is known as Mandodari, with plain dentals! However, there is an alternative traditional of spelling the name with cerebral consonants. Mandodari is one of the group of five virtuous women of Hindu mythology (the others are Sita, Draupadi, Ahilya and Tara), but this tradition does not seem to present in Thailand. ภสำเภาphor sam-phao - a kind of ship A junk, to be precise. ษฦาษีsor reu-see - hermit หหีบ hor heep - a kind of box ฬจุฬา lor juu-laa - a kind of kite For a while I though it peculiar that there should be a special word for the male of this species. Then I discovered it did not mean the bird! I'm still not quite sure what a 'male kite' is.On the second point, the use of ai-mai-muan (sorry no Thai keyboard - I had to copy your script from below), I think it is only used with the following 20 words: Exactly. It's rather like igh in English - a historical remnant. Some dialects, and Lao, still make the distinction in speech. Krai (normal tone) Is there any historical justification for the vowel in this word? คน ไร should have contracted to *ไคร, not ใคร. Standard Thai has historically incorrect tonemarks often enough to show that false spellings can easily creep in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meadish_sweetball Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 lor juu-laa - a kind of kiteFor a while I though it peculiar that there should be a special word for the male of this species. Then I discovered it did not mean the bird! I'm still not quite sure what a 'male kite' is. http://www.thailand-travel.net/index.cfm?menuid=116 explains a little about the kite fights and the female and male kites used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterPaolo Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Sawaddee krub, There're only 20 words that use "ใ" and I'll try to get them right for you ผู้ใหญ่ ใหม่ ให้ สะใภ้ ใช้ ใส่ ใจ หลงใหล ใคร ใคร่ ใบ ใส ใด ใน ใต้ ใบ้ ใย ใกล้ apprearantly I can't get all 20 of them Gotta go but will be back tomorrow (with their meaning2) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowleopard Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Sawaddee krub,There're only 20 words that use "ใ" and I'll try to get them right for you ผู้ใหญ่ ใหม่ ให้ สะใภ้ ใช้ ใส่ ใจ หลงใหล ใคร ใคร่ ใบ ใส ใด ใน ใต้ ใบ้ ใย ใกล้ apprearantly I can't get all 20 of them Gotta go but will be back tomorrow (with their meaning2) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Here are a few different meanings I can think of... ผู้ใหญ่ "poo-yai"=adult,elder,senior,leader; chief; commander; superior, principal, ruler, head ใหม่ "mai"=new; fresh;novel; latest; recent;again;once more; repeatedly;newly; recently ให้ "hai"=give;offer;present; award;permit; allow; consent to สะใภ้ "sa-pai"=daughter-in-law; female-in-law ใช้ "chai"=use ใส่ "sai"=dress oneself;put something in;enter things like passwords ใจ "jai"=heart;mind; spirit;disposition หลงใหล "long lai"=fascinating ใคร "krai"=who ใคร่ "krai"=want; wish for ใบ "bai"=leaf;classifier for fruits,containers,tree leaves,documents ใส "sai"=transparentl;clear ใด "dai"=which;any ใน "nai"=in;of ใต้ "dtai"=south;under ใบ้ "bai"=deaf; dumb;signal;hint;silent ใย "yai"=web; fiber, thread;bright;fine and/or delicate ใกล้ "glai"=near; close; approach;adjacent Cheers. Snowleopard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango-Guy Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Spee, if you're starting out on the alphabet you may find this a useful site (unless you're already using it...) as it includes downloadable flashcards: http://thaiphrasebook.com/books/014.php MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spee Posted November 3, 2004 Author Share Posted November 3, 2004 Spee, if you're starting out on the alphabet you may find this a useful site (unless you're already using it...) as it includes downloadable flashcards:http://thaiphrasebook.com/books/014.php MG <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yep, have had it for a while. It is a nice little freebie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diggerbasher Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 It appears learningThai.com has a bandwidth problem so does anyone know of another site where the Thai alphabet can be listened to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard W Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 It appears learningThai.com has a bandwidth problem so does anyone know of another site where the Thai alphabet can be listened to. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thai Consonants at thai-language.com. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diggerbasher Posted March 10, 2005 Share Posted March 10, 2005 Thanks Richard W for the link. Seems today learnthai have now coughed up the money for some more bandwidth.Great site for beginners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taotoey Posted March 10, 2005 Share Posted March 10, 2005 ฎปฎัก tor bpa-tuk It is more like a javelin. It is(was) used to control some animals, buffalo, ox, cow, in the old days. ภสำเภา phor sam-phao Yes, it is an older chinese-style sailing ship. หหีบ hor heep Storage box many of you/us use to keep things in it. ฬจุฬา lor juu-laa It is a kind of kite with specific shape just like you see in picture. ใบไม้ bai/m/ maai/h/ Your curiosity on this (I use "this" only, not "this word") is a good one. ใบ and ไม้ are two different words. Composing them together to mean leaf or leaves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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