Plus Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 He submitted his book to the authorities himself He did??? What authorities? What for? I believe so, hence the copy being in the national library. I read about it somewhere that it was submitted and passed without comment. On one of the articles reporting on his original arrest back in August, can't remember exactly where now... I don't think the librarians would have run to the police. More likely they were given a copy AFTER it has become a scandal. Maybe Harry himself gave it to them as a promotion because it's note very likely his self published book was on their acquisition list. Maybe he hit someone too sensitive with his giveaways, but I still think someone with a grudge ratted him out. Thai police doesn't go round reading English books themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LevelHead Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Wonder if he has a sore bum ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray08 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Only thing i don,t understand was , why no bail ?, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuian Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 (edited) One thing is for sure if I was writing a book and living in Thailand I would'nt be writing about the royal family in any way however unintentional that could lead to me going to jail!Yes the law is strict regarding this but thats the way it is! Respect the laws of the country you go to. The law, is the law..... is like the driver who was caught running the red lights... for his defense it was "early green"! or "I wasn't speeding, the car did!" "Can't really except that the speed limit is so low, my car is so fast!" "Did you kill this guy? No, the bullet did!" Only thing i don,t understand was , why no bail ?, granted! Maybe, to bring this into the international limelight and embarrass a few people... who knows, comes the "Rohingiyas Scandal" to mind...an quite a few other "things" which have been kept comfortably under the lid and their numbers were growing.. Edited February 21, 2009 by Samuian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve2UK Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 (edited) I don't think the librarians would have run to the police. More likely they were given a copy AFTER it has become a scandal. Maybe Harry himself gave it to them as a promotion because it's note very likely his self published book was on their acquisition list. Not exactly......... Verisimilitude___National_Library_of_Thailand_copy.pdf Edit: No need to panic - it's not the whole book. Just the library's own cataloguing/accession stamps. Edited February 21, 2009 by Steve2UK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dee123 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 (edited) I signed the petition.I've been waiting for the door to be kicked in. LOL I did too,.............but from a DISTANCE!!! Edited February 21, 2009 by dee123 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 (edited) One thing is for sure if I was writing a book and living in Thailand I would'nt be writing about the royal family in any way however unintentional that could lead to me going to jail!Yes the law is strict regarding this but thats the way it is! Respect the laws of the country you go to. Sometimes people have to learn the hard way. Common sense would dictate your first statement for nearly anyone. Particularly someone that had spent more than 24 hours in this country. That it was done in a rather deliberate intentional manner compounds his culpability. He is a lot more famous now then previously when he was writing for an unknown Greek periodical in Thailand, but it seems like he was willing to go through the ordeal to reach that point. Who'll portray him in the movie? Edited February 21, 2009 by sriracha john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve2UK Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 One thing is for sure if I was writing a book and living in Thailand I would'nt be writing about the royal family in any way however unintentional that could lead to me going to jail!Yes the law is strict regarding this but thats the way it is! Respect the laws of the country you go to. Sometimes people have to learn the hard way. Common sense would dictate your first statement for nearly anyone. Particularly someone that had spent more than 24 hours in this country. That it was done in a rather deliberate intentional manner compounds his culpability. He is a lot more famous now then previously when he was writing for an unknown Greek periodical in Thailand, but it seems like he was willing to go through the ordeal to reach that point. Who'll portray him in the movie? Perhaps this member will confirm to us whether or not it is his intention to now portray Nicolaides as having deliberately set out to "go through the ordeal" in order to reach a point of being "a lot more famous now". Yes or no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 (edited) One thing is for sure if I was writing a book and living in Thailand I would'nt be writing about the royal family in any way however unintentional that could lead to me going to jail!Yes the law is strict regarding this but thats the way it is! Respect the laws of the country you go to. Sometimes people have to learn the hard way. Common sense would dictate your first statement for nearly anyone. Particularly someone that had spent more than 24 hours in this country. That it was done in a rather deliberate intentional manner compounds his culpability. He is a lot more famous now then previously when he was writing for an unknown Greek periodical in Thailand, but it seems like he was willing to go through the ordeal to reach that point. Who'll portray him in the movie? Perhaps this member will confirm to us whether or not it is his intention to now portray Nicolaides as having deliberately set out to "go through the ordeal" in order to reach a point of being "a lot more famous now". Yes or no? It's very suspicious. Did he really not think it would upset the authorities to write what he did? That's hard to believe of someone who has been here the length of time he had. Is he more famous now? Undoubtedly. Is there a precedence for writers to "push the envelope" in order to get noticed, even it means some temporary untoward side effect to their efforts? Yes. Was this intention from the outset? Don't know, but as said, it's very suspicious. Time will help to determine that. Will he go on the lecture circuit? Pen his prison memoirs? Accept lucrative movie offers? Or... will he quietly contemplate his good fortune to be released and help to educate others that don't have his knowledge as to avoid a repeat for them. If he goes with the latter, then it would seem less likely his actions were deliberate. If it's the former, then it comes down between he was deliberate in his action or extremely stupid. Edited February 21, 2009 by sriracha john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dee123 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 One thing is for sure if I was writing a book and living in Thailand I would'nt be writing about the royal family in any way however unintentional that could lead to me going to jail!Yes the law is strict regarding this but thats the way it is! Respect the laws of the country you go to. Sometimes people have to learn the hard way. Common sense would dictate your first statement for nearly anyone. Particularly someone that had spent more than 24 hours in this country. That it was done in a rather deliberate intentional manner compounds his culpability. He is a lot more famous now then previously when he was writing for an unknown Greek periodical in Thailand, but it seems like he was willing to go through the ordeal to reach that point. Who'll portray him in the movie? Robert Redford as the persecuted........but who will play THE PERSECUTOR Manat Kongpan of ISOC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeaceBlondie Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 I have spent the last 4.5 years writing a book about Mexico and...XY38 star system, I guess. Like the author of The Ugly American, I guess the second half of my book occurs in some unknown SouthEast Asian country...Jamboody? Malusia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Who'll portray him in the movie? Robert Redford as the persecuted... Couldn't do much better than that choice with several excellent prison movies under his belt like Brubaker and The Last Castle , with a range of characters covering all sides from inmate to warden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongeman Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 I have agree with S.John on this one.......good points made. Another person in Thai jail and the papers go mad over conditions.........YAWN. One thing I learnt from my time in Thailand is that Ok the standing up in the cinema etc its no problem......the work they do for the poor is immense. Even I see it in the wife......thais d'ont change so d'ont try and change the world. Would I buy the next book..........NAH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve2UK Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 One thing is for sure if I was writing a book and living in Thailand I would'nt be writing about the royal family in any way however unintentional that could lead to me going to jail!Yes the law is strict regarding this but thats the way it is! Respect the laws of the country you go to. Sometimes people have to learn the hard way. Common sense would dictate your first statement for nearly anyone. Particularly someone that had spent more than 24 hours in this country. That it was done in a rather deliberate intentional manner compounds his culpability. He is a lot more famous now then previously when he was writing for an unknown Greek periodical in Thailand, but it seems like he was willing to go through the ordeal to reach that point. Who'll portray him in the movie? Perhaps this member will confirm to us whether or not it is his intention to now portray Nicolaides as having deliberately set out to "go through the ordeal" in order to reach a point of being "a lot more famous now". Yes or no? It's very suspicious. Did he really not think it would upset the authorities to write what he did? That's hard to believe of someone who has been here the length of time he had. Is he more famous now? Undoubtedly. Is there a precedence for writers to "push the envelope" in order to get noticed, even it means some temporary untoward side effect to their efforts? Yes. Was this intention from the outset? Don't know, but as said, it's very suspicious. Time will help to determine that. Will he go on the lecture circuit? Pen his prison memoirs? Accept lucrative movie offers? Or... will he quietly contemplate his good fortune to be released and help to educate others that don't have his knowledge as to avoid a repeat for them. If he goes with the latter, then it would seem less likely his actions were deliberate. If it's the former, then it comes down between he was deliberate in his action or extremely stupid. Such fancy footwork . Still, I think Fred Astaire's title is safe for a while yet. Now, we have the new, improved version: "it comes down between he was deliberate in his action or extremely stupid". I guess the last three words got accidentally left out of the first version? There can be few who don't question the wisdom - rather different from effectively saying that there was ulterior motive. Another question. By your lights, if he now makes a satang arising out of this - then he's guilty as you charged him? Yes or no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dee123 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 I have agree with S.John on this one.......good points made. Another person in Thai jail and the papers go mad over conditions.........YAWN. One thing I learnt from my time in Thailand is that Ok the standing up in the cinema etc its no problem......the work they do for the poor is immense. Even I see it in the wife......thais d'ont change so d'ont try and change the world. Would I buy the next book..........NAH. "standing up in the cinema ect its no problem..." you can actually stand up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 (edited) One thing is for sure if I was writing a book and living in Thailand I would'nt be writing about the royal family in any way however unintentional that could lead to me going to jail!Yes the law is strict regarding this but thats the way it is! Respect the laws of the country you go to. Sometimes people have to learn the hard way. Common sense would dictate your first statement for nearly anyone. Particularly someone that had spent more than 24 hours in this country. That it was done in a rather deliberate intentional manner compounds his culpability. He is a lot more famous now then previously when he was writing for an unknown Greek periodical in Thailand, but it seems like he was willing to go through the ordeal to reach that point. Who'll portray him in the movie? Perhaps this member will confirm to us whether or not it is his intention to now portray Nicolaides as having deliberately set out to "go through the ordeal" in order to reach a point of being "a lot more famous now". Yes or no? It's very suspicious. Did he really not think it would upset the authorities to write what he did? That's hard to believe of someone who has been here the length of time he had. Is he more famous now? Undoubtedly. Is there a precedence for writers to "push the envelope" in order to get noticed, even it means some temporary untoward side effect to their efforts? Yes. Was this intention from the outset? Don't know, but as said, it's very suspicious. Time will help to determine that. Will he go on the lecture circuit? Pen his prison memoirs? Accept lucrative movie offers? Or... will he quietly contemplate his good fortune to be released and help to educate others that don't have his knowledge as to avoid a repeat for them. If he goes with the latter, then it would seem less likely his actions were deliberate. If it's the former, then it comes down between he was deliberate in his action or extremely stupid. Such fancy footwork . Still, I think Fred Astaire's title is safe for a while yet. Sorry to have elaborated for you, but I don't do well with ultimatums of "yes or no" replies... as they are often incomplete. Now, we have the new, improved version: "it comes down between he was deliberate in his action or extremely stupid". I guess the last three words got accidentally left out of the first version? not at all... just didn't really think that level of stupidity could possibly occur, but upon further reflection during my reply, I could see that it is within the realm of possibilities that someone could actually be that moronic. There can be few who don't question the wisdom - rather different from effectively saying that there was ulterior motive. It's a distinct possibility. He's certainly played it up enough rather than seem genuinely repentant for his actions. Another question. By your lights, if he now makes a satang arising out of this - then he's guilty as you charged him? Yes or no? hmmm... more ultimatums... oh well. His actions over the coming weeks will help to determine his motivations. If he "goes Hollywood" over this it would indicate one path. If he quietly shows humility and true repentance and makes an effort to prevent anyone else from getting themselves in the same situation, it would indicate another path. While he's certainly entitled to earn a living in his chosen profession... how he specifically goes about it will help to separate the wheat from the chaff. Edited February 21, 2009 by sriracha john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc2 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 this guy is like the jesus of LM law. he was persecuted and publicly crucified , forsaken by his goverment I also believe he will be asked to do interviews , it has got a fair amount of news coverage and he seems quite interviewable, i think he will be humble and just tell his story. I hope he makes a bit of money out of it, or gets some type of reward. For one, I am happy that he was release quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffer Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 There are a lot of things that have not come out about this case and may never come out while certain people are still in Thailand. As to why Harry was ever charged... his book was first investigated several years back and it was decided then there was no case to answer because it was a novel and it was obvious Harry did not have an anti-monarchy agenda. There has been a lot of speculation as to why the case was reopened. It has been mentioned once or twice before on another website but the instigator was not Thai it seems. It may be similar to the BBC charges where the person who brought the charges about English language news reports reportedly cannot even read English... people in the media in Thailand know what I'm on about but no one can talk openly about it for obvious reasons. The reason why he was not granted bail? Due to the charge, every judge was petrified of what would happen to them if Harry was to jump bail. Harry has been through a lot and while you can certainly argue if what he wrote was wise, any sensible person should see the punishment he has endured is out of all proportion to the alleged offence. Good luck to him if he writes a book and it it sells a bundle however that will not even begin to compensate him and his family and friends for all the emotional and financial strain they have been through. I just hope Harry gets over his ordeal as quickly as possible and that his mother can recover from the major stroke she suffered, clearly brought on by the strain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dee123 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 I think the Thaivisa readers must be getting fed up with me,steve2uk,plus and of course srirachajohn for hogging the boared,......what you say guys lets give the others a chance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc2 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 (edited) http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7903019.stm BBC article. His laywer is hopeless. He still seems to think that he was responsible for harrys release through "applying pressure" to the goverments, ozzie and thai, raising the profile of the case internationally. getting people to sign petitions etc. I would have fired that <deleted> long ago, cos he clearly has no idea how it works. all that lobying crap was for nothing, it could have even jeopordized his chances if they took it too far Edited February 21, 2009 by mc2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7903019.stmBBC article. His laywer is hopeless. He still seems to think that he was responsible for harrys release through "applying pressure" to the goverments, ozzie and thai, raising the profile of the case internationally. I would have fired that <deleted> long ago, cos he clearly has no idea how it works. all that lobying crap was for nothing, thats not how it works. Please tell us all exactly how it works with your vast experience in dealing with LM cases in Thailand and Oz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc2 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7903019.stmBBC article. His laywer is hopeless. He still seems to think that he was responsible for harrys release through "applying pressure" to the goverments, ozzie and thai, raising the profile of the case internationally. I would have fired that <deleted> long ago, cos he clearly has no idea how it works. all that lobying crap was for nothing, thats not how it works. Please tell us all exactly how it works with your vast experience in dealing with LM cases in Thailand and Oz just got to lay low, be humble , bide your time knowing a pardon is likely. Thats the strict advice I would have given. he probably would have gotten out earlier or at the same time , with less stress to himself and family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7903019.stmBBC article. His laywer is hopeless. He still seems to think that he was responsible for harrys release through "applying pressure" to the goverments, ozzie and thai, raising the profile of the case internationally. I would have fired that <deleted> long ago, cos he clearly has no idea how it works. all that lobying crap was for nothing, thats not how it works. Please tell us all exactly how it works with your vast experience in dealing with LM cases in Thailand and Oz just got to lay low, be humble , bide your time knowing a pardon is likely. Thats the strict advice I would have given. he probably would have gotten out earlier or at the same time , with less stress to himself and family. and this is based upon what knowledge that you have sitting in the UK, whilst commenting on Thailand and Oz? This case moved WAY faster than most ever do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpoint Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Quite frankly, I wouldn't rule out one of the foreign media companies bringing it to the attention of the authorities. It's not been unknown for it to have happened before. Look at how much mileage they got out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc2 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7903019.stmBBC article. His laywer is hopeless. He still seems to think that he was responsible for harrys release through "applying pressure" to the goverments, ozzie and thai, raising the profile of the case internationally. I would have fired that <deleted> long ago, cos he clearly has no idea how it works. all that lobying crap was for nothing, thats not how it works. Please tell us all exactly how it works with your vast experience in dealing with LM cases in Thailand and Oz just got to lay low, be humble , bide your time knowing a pardon is likely. Thats the strict advice I would have given. he probably would have gotten out earlier or at the same time , with less stress to himself and family. and this is based upon what knowledge that you have sitting in the UK, whilst commenting on Thailand and Oz? mostly based on common sense (the big man is not going to bend to pressure nor would he want it to appear that way) and partly based on the knowledge I have from completing a phD in Thai cultural studies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve2UK Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 I think the Thaivisa readers must be getting fed up with me,steve2uk,plus and of course srirachajohn for hogging the boared,......what you say guys lets give the others a chance! Perish the thought that I should ever want to hit that kind of "keyboard diarrhoea" posting volume. Simple questions, long prevaricating answers - apologies if I am to blame for triggering those. I find that these things usually reach the point where TV members are entirely capable of reaching their own conclusions for themselves without me needing to hammer every nail - let alone repeatedly; that was already my view here and before seeing your post. A different point (not worth the space of a separate post): I disagree with mc2 that Nicolaides was "forsaken by his government". It seems clear that at high levels (appropriately more behind the scenes than in public) they were bringing strong pressure to reach the pardon stage sooner rather than later (and this one has come sooner than others). This has been discussed previously - as well as the competence of the lawyer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7903019.stmBBC article. His laywer is hopeless. He still seems to think that he was responsible for harrys release through "applying pressure" to the goverments, ozzie and thai, raising the profile of the case internationally. I would have fired that <deleted> long ago, cos he clearly has no idea how it works. all that lobying crap was for nothing, thats not how it works. Please tell us all exactly how it works with your vast experience in dealing with LM cases in Thailand and Oz just got to lay low, be humble , bide your time knowing a pardon is likely. Thats the strict advice I would have given. he probably would have gotten out earlier or at the same time , with less stress to himself and family. and this is based upon what knowledge that you have sitting in the UK, whilst commenting on Thailand and Oz? mostly based on common sense (the big man is not going to bend to pressure nor would he want it to appear that way) and partly based on the knowledge I have from completing a phD in Thai cultural studies. LOL Tell us all about that 'phD' in the UK and then explain WHY this case moved along so rapidly (conviction Jan 19th? pardon and home on the 20th of Feb?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p_brownstone Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 (edited) Perhaps there is more to this situation than is immediately obvious. Nicolaides apparently “self-published” this book – according to all reports I have seen only 7 copies of 50 printed were ever sold. If this arrest and imprisonment of the Author had never happened the book would have sunk into probably well deserved obscurity. Yet someone decided to bring this prosecution – the first result of which has been to encourage thousands to look for the reference to Royalty ….. thus giving the book far more publicity than it would ever have earned on its’ own merit; thousands of hits on the various Threads on Thai Visa alone for example – how many of those have Googled to find the book or references to the “offensive” passage?. The second, and more destructive, result is to call attention to the Lese Majeste Law in Thailand and – by implication – call down ridicule internationally on an Institution which has to resort to such draconian legislation to protect itself. My personal feeling is that those who instigate these prosecutions do so with the deliberate intention of damaging the Institution they pretend to protect. Patrick Edited February 21, 2009 by p_brownstone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Now, we have the new, improved version: "it comes down between he was deliberate in his action or extremely stupid". I guess the last three words got accidentally left out of the first version? not at all... just didn't really think that level of stupidity could possibly occur, but upon further reflection during my reply, I could see that it is within the realm of possibilities that someone could actually be that moronic. gosh... I might have to reflect even more now... as that realm is getting more and more possible. "A few hours before that I was informed I had a royal pardon... A few hours before that I was climbing out of a sewerage tank that I fell into in the prison," AP quotes him as saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc2 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 and then explain WHY this case moved along so rapidly (conviction Jan 19th? pardon and home on the 20th of Feb?) cos hes a foreigner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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