carmine Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 The fault lies with Capello. Green made a howler, but I'd still play him in the next game. He should never have started with Heskey and Wright Philips is rubbish - both shouldn't have even been on the plane! With these lesser teams, you have to go for broke, Crouch & Defoe up front - Rooney behind and Carrick holding. Whether Gerrard and Lampard should play together is debatable. And for Christ's sake they should get the ball out to Lennon more. He has the ability to devastate any defence, but he needs the passes. Milner....oh my oh my....and they want 30 million for him? Citeh will pay 30m because they are desperate I think Capello got it wrong also. But for the next game we'll have Barry back holding midfield. I'd be suprised if he did'nt stick with Heskey though. The main issue is CB. As i've said already, Ledley King has damaged his abductor muscle are cant play in the next game. Carragher is way too slow, Upson should'nt even be in the squad, so it may well be Dawson. Joe Cole would have been far more effective than Wright Philips who is not up to the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptheos Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 The fault lies with Capello. Green made a howler, but I'd still play him in the next game. He should never have started with Heskey and Wright Philips is rubbish - both shouldn't have even been on the plane! With these lesser teams, you have to go for broke, Crouch & Defoe up front - Rooney behind and Carrick holding. Whether Gerrard and Lampard should play together is debatable. And for Christ's sake they should get the ball out to Lennon more. He has the ability to devastate any defence, but he needs the passes. Milner....oh my oh my....and they want 30 million for him? Citeh will pay 30m because they are desperate I think Capello got it wrong also. But for the next game we'll have Barry back holding midfield. I'd be suprised if he did'nt stick with Heskey though. The main issue is CB. As i've said already, Ledley King has damaged his abductor muscle are cant play in the next game. Carragher is way too slow, Upson should'nt even be in the squad, so it may well be Dawson. Joe Cole would have been far more effective than Wright Philips who is not up to the job. Dawson had an amazing season with Spurs and deserves a chance. Absolutely agree about Joe Cole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave111223 Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 I agree that Dawson and Joe Cole should start the next one, but i thought Heskey played well. He won a large percent of the long balls, and setup the goal. To be fair he did about 3 times as much as Rooney. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HANYUHAN Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 <deleted> performance from Green,Carrhager,Lampard,Lennon,Milner,Rooney The rest where poor. USA where not that much either! Algeria next! what a disapointment! I started watching the geckoes running up the wall they where more creative I felt sorry for Green. its never easy being a keeper. Everyone else makes errors, bad passes, giving runs to the opposition etc. Its a big day out. I thought the USA played ok /moderaley, but they did play as a team which is something England cant seem to get the knack of. That would have been a lonely walk for green, walking off pitch, and he had to do it alone. No team mates at all. No supportive coach. Just cranky bitter celebrities.Well done USA. You held together as a team. Thats what its about. South Korea played well, again, above expectations.Good luck to the 2 Koreas. Im pretty sure it will be Asia rather than Africa that brings the big surprises this time around.Please fedex me some geckos I'm not back home until the second round.....you might well be out by then. Only joking of course England should have won the game but for a good performance by Tim Howard....OK some defensive errors and the howler by the goalie but still.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfieconn Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 (edited) The fault lies with Capello. Green made a howler, but I'd still play him in the next game. He should never have started with Heskey and Wright Philips is rubbish - both shouldn't have even been on the plane! With these lesser teams, you have to go for broke, Crouch & Defoe up front - Rooney behind and Carrick holding. Whether Gerrard and Lampard should play together is debatable. And for Christ's sake they should get the ball out to Lennon more. He has the ability to devastate any defence, but he needs the passes. Milner....oh my oh my....and they want 30 million for him? Citeh will pay 30m because they are desperate I think Capello got it wrong also. But for the next game we'll have Barry back holding midfield. I'd be suprised if he did'nt stick with Heskey though. The main issue is CB. As i've said already, Ledley King has damaged his abductor muscle are cant play in the next game. Carragher is way too slow, Upson should'nt even be in the squad, so it may well be Dawson. Joe Cole would have been far more effective than Wright Philips who is not up to the job. Why play Lampard and Gerrard together when they don't compliment each other;) . Why bring on Wright -Philips at left mid/wing when he is a right sided player and we had Joe Cole to bring on;) . I thought we took Carragher as cover for right back and then he brings him on before Upson and Dawson;) Telling the players whose playing a few hours (if true) before the kick off, whats that about . Even the Physio must have been asleep when Johnson got injured and had to start running back to the bench to get seen too. Can someone explain to the players that when a team looks like they going to take a short corner 2 players run out there to close down, not let the other team take a short one and then proceed to run 10 yards into the box (school boy stuff). Just all too predictable if you ask me, where's the imagination from our great foreign coach who you would think might have a few new ideas but decides to play the same old boring English style. Perhaps our players are just not good enough but wheres the flair and panache we see in some of the other teams (bring back Gazza). Rant over. Ps. Will go and watch a real team tonight Chiang Mai FC . Edited June 13, 2010 by alfieconn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noel2499rk Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 Green should not even be in the England squad never mind carry on playing. The first and most important thing you need from a goal keeper is reliability and Green has consistently proved he does not have this. 4 Rob Green made four errors leading to a goal this season, more than any other player in the division. rob green error prone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevieH Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 pretty laughable that was. lampard and gerrard far too deep to be any use, heskey still almost like playing with ten men, rooney really easily marked out of it. no creativity, no imagination and utterly incapable of playing possession football. about par for the course really and second half they were lucky not to lose it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noel2499rk Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 Premier League 09/10 Robert Green Joe Hart David James Team West Ham United Birmingham City Portsmouth Appearances 38 36 25 Minutes On Pitch 3403 3240 2234 Goals Conceded 66 42 46 Minutes per Goal Conceded 52 77 49 Clean Sheets 8 10 3 Saves Saves 122 124 79 Saves per game 3.2 3.4 3.2 Saves from Inside Box 62 64 44 Saves from Outside Box 60 60 35 Saves to Shots ratio 65% 75% 63% Catches Punches 35 34 18 Catches 67 69 49 Dropped Catches 5 2 3 Catch Success Rate % 95% 98% 96% Error Leading to Goal 4 0 1 Kicks Long Kicking Distribution 446 423 288 Kicking Success Rate % 49% 40% 45% This is not a one off aberration by Robert Green he is error prone and should never have started the game or even been in the squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noel2499rk Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 Those stats are not very clear in my last post you can see them clearer here Incompatible Browser | Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevieH Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 I agree that Dawson and Joe Cole should start the next one, but i thought Heskey played well. He won a large percent of the long balls, and setup the goal. To be fair he did about 3 times as much as Rooney. i wonder how fit rooney is. last season he played every match if he was available, never got rotated / rested and pretty much carried man united on his shoulders all season. he could be all burnt out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptheos Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 Green should not even be in the England squad never mind carry on playing. The first and most important thing you need from a goal keeper is reliability and Green has consistently proved he does not have this. 4 Rob Green made four errors leading to a goal this season, more than any other player in the division. rob green error prone Perhaps James hould have started, he's not so nervous and has made so many errors in the past one more wouldn't bother him. That leaves Joe Hart - young inexperienced, but a great talent. It's sad that English teams feel it's necessary to go abroad for goalkeepers, we used to produce such great keepers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevieH Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 Green should not even be in the England squad never mind carry on playing. The first and most important thing you need from a goal keeper is reliability and Green has consistently proved he does not have this. 4 Rob Green made four errors leading to a goal this season, more than any other player in the division. rob green error prone Perhaps James hould have started, he's not so nervous and has made so many errors in the past one more wouldn't bother him. That leaves Joe Hart - young inexperienced, but a great talent. It's sad that English teams feel it's necessary to go abroad for goalkeepers, we used to produce such great keepers. think that's a bit of one of those lazy football cliches that. banks, clemence, shilton, seaman. not really that many top class keepers given that it spans the last 50 years. unless i've missed anybody really obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkksteviejai Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 Green should not even be in the England squad never mind carry on playing. The first and most important thing you need from a goal keeper is reliability and Green has consistently proved he does not have this. 4 Rob Green made four errors leading to a goal this season, more than any other player in the division. rob green error prone Perhaps James hould have started, he's not so nervous and has made so many errors in the past one more wouldn't bother him. That leaves Joe Hart - young inexperienced, but a great talent. It's sad that English teams feel it's necessary to go abroad for goalkeepers, we used to produce such great keepers. think that's a bit of one of those lazy football cliches that. banks, clemence, shilton, seaman. not really that many top class keepers given that it spans the last 50 years. unless i've missed anybody really obvious. I think the main point is that usually there would be one stand out keeper to put on the teamsheet (good or not, well thats relative to the other keepers) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevieH Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 I think the main point is that usually there would be one stand out keeper to put on the teamsheet (good or not, well thats relative to the other keepers) well yeah. england have never replaced david seaman and he's been gone for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarpSpeed Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 (edited) <deleted> performance from Green,Carrhager,Lampard,Lennon,Milner,Rooney The rest where poor. USA where not that much either! Algeria next! what a disapointment! I started watching the geckoes running up the wall they where more creative Have to agree, the U.S. couldn't have given you guys more space if they retired to the locker room and let you keep playing........ And yet even after we gifted you an early goal Tim managed to shut you out after that in spite of his defense trying to gift you guys on every opportunity. IMO both teams looked very out of sorts and had little rhythm, it was painful to watch as I had high hopes of a back and forth with more polish and cohesiveness on both sides especially after the U.S. womped up on Australia a few days ago.. The U.S. kept running towards the ball in packs like first graders and leaving miles of space and players unmarked instead of covering and overlapping it was distressful I hope they can get their act together for the future matches and in that light having dodged this bullet with a team the caliber [?] of England if they can find their rhythm it bodes well for the rest of the cup.. I think Bradly needs to emphasize the basics of almost everything in training over the next several days.. Just want to add one more thing. It was very sporty of Green to gift back that goal after our gifting you the first one. It was just like when a player goes down injured and the opposing team plays the ball out of bounds so he can get aid. Cheers!! One more thing as I've always said and when I coach I emphasize a shot on goal is just that, unlike the Nigeria game where every shot was wide or high at least put the shot on goal and make the goalie save it even if it's weak because anything can and does happen.. I also had empathy for Green too in spite of him being the opposition I played goalie and certain every goalie has had such follies but geezz!! In the world cup?? Can't imagine anything more demoralizing... Edited June 13, 2010 by WarpSpeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfieconn Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 I started watching the geckoes running up the wall they where more creative Was that with or without a football . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hansum Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 As soon as the team was announced that performance could have been predicted. Too many right wingers in the squad, a natural left footer is whats needed ... was a case of square pegs in round holes again. (Downing or A Johnson should have gone) Lennon was dreadful with his deliveries last night, when he should have crossed it quickly he took his time and vice versa. Green was even badly placed for the save he did make that hit the post, he was very lucky not to have conceded in his near post. J Cole, Barry and James in, and Milner/Phillips, Heskey, Green out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NADTATIDA1 Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 At least we have only Algeria next.....there! I have said it now Team v the Algerians Calamity James G Johnson J Terry Les Dawson A Cole M Carrick/G Barry S Gerrard F Lampard J Cole A Lennon W Rooney/Defoe maybe rest Ronney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarpSpeed Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 Green should not even be in the England squad never mind carry on playing. The first and most important thing you need from a goal keeper is reliability and Green has consistently proved he does not have this. 4 Rob Green made four errors leading to a goal this season, more than any other player in the division. rob green error prone Perhaps James hould have started, he's not so nervous and has made so many errors in the past one more wouldn't bother him. That leaves Joe Hart - young inexperienced, but a great talent. It's sad that English teams feel it's necessary to go abroad for goalkeepers, we used to produce such great keepers. Yep I remember Kevin "the cat" Keelen [spl?] who used to play for Tampa Bay Rowdies in the former NASL and our goalie Gordon Banks for the Ft. Lauderdale Strikers always having a go at each other later in their careers.. It was a great rivalry for many years.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokie36 Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 At least we have only Algeria next.....there! I have said it now Team v the Algerians Calamity James G Johnson J Terry Les Dawson A Cole M Carrick/G Barry S Gerrard F Lampard J Cole A Lennon W Rooney/Defoe maybe rest Ronney Haha rest Rooney? Still feeling confident then are we? You're mad you lot really...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carmine Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 (edited) At least we have only Algeria next.....there! I have said it now Team v the Algerians Calamity James G Johnson J Terry Les Dawson A Cole M Carrick/G Barry S Gerrard F Lampard J Cole A Lennon W Rooney/Defoe maybe rest Ronney Well Nad, i think you are pretty much on the mark. He might i think start with Rooney with the hope to take him off at half time. Picking James would ofcourse leave the door wide open for another calamitous goalkeeping error. I think our next game could be a very tough one. Edited June 13, 2010 by carmine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarpSpeed Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 (edited) At least we have only Algeria next.....there! I have said it now Team v the Algerians Calamity James G Johnson J Terry Les Dawson A Cole M Carrick/G Barry S Gerrard F Lampard J Cole A Lennon W Rooney/Defoe maybe rest Ronney Personally I think he needs to play Green again and get his confidence back and this would be one of the games to do it. A top coach at this level knows you don't just dump your first squad goalie because he made a mistake it's piling on and the cup is not thrown away yet but it might be if he is benched and they need him to come back later to cover an injury you don't want him to be psychologically injured especially as the competition gets tighter, he needs to be top form confidence wise he's made his mistake and gotten it out his system early now he can move on.. A goalkeepers psyche is different from any other players you could bench a field player without too much ramifications but goalkeepers operate more on self confidence as the position is so isolated in essentially a team sport.. Not unlike a quarterback in American football, a goalie in hockey etc.. Edited June 13, 2010 by WarpSpeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokie36 Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 :D Yes please play Green again and again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hansum Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 (edited) No matter how much confidence Green gets back, the one thing he can never get back is an abundance of talent as he's never had it, so confidence is not overly important. Edited June 13, 2010 by hansum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarpSpeed Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 (edited) ^&^^Obviously a fan and field player not really a student of the game or the psychology behind it... But hey I wish you were the England coach and not someone as ill qualified as Capello ... :D Edited June 13, 2010 by WarpSpeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokie36 Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 Joe Hart should come in now take the no1 jersey and keep it for the next decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NADTATIDA1 Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 The World Cup is not a tournament to give players confidence booster games,this is it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carmine Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 ^&^^Obviously a fan and field player not really a student of the game or the psychology behind it... But hey I wish you were the England coach and not someone as ill qualified as Capello ... :D Ofcourse the other train of thought is that he will be under enormous pressure not to make another cock up and we can hardly afford to take that risk. It's a difficult decision and not as obvious as you seem to think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarpSpeed Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 I almost forgot where I was posting, with the in security, bitterness and disappointment you must be feeling for only leveling with America there is going to be no logical discussion to be had merely emotional as I'm only an American and you Brits are the self proclaimed gods of SOCCER (yes soccer)and right now are seeking a scape goat to flame so I'll leave it to you to cry in your beer.. I offered no flames or trolls just a differing point of view and should have known better then to think you'd be adult and objective enough just to debate teh sport and not demean or condescend but it just isn't in you... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokie36 Posted June 13, 2010 Share Posted June 13, 2010 I almost forgot where I was posting, with the in security, bitterness and disappointment you must be feeling for only leveling with America there is going to be no logical discussion to be had merely emotional as I'm only an American and you Brits are the self proclaimed gods of SOCCER (yes soccer)and right now are seeking a scape goat to flame so I'll leave it to you to cry in your beer.. I offered no flames or trolls just a differing point of view and should have known better then to think you'd be adult and objective enough just to debate teh sport and not demean or condescend but it just isn't in you... :lol:I think he don't get it does he...... if you want an argument go to the club threads.....this is just friendly banter mate.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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