Rottweiler

[kandahar]

On the one hand:

Where common sense is of no avail,

famous last words will always prevail.

On the other hand:

I'm sure, statistically, we kill each other a lot more often than all of the dog breeds put together.

Edited August 9, 2010 by kandahar

[lannaman]

I can see how people love their dogs. I am pretty fond of a good dog. I have friends who have had several rotties over the years and their kids grew up with them, no troubles.

At the same time, I have read enough news accounts and seen enough interviews on TV about how the sweetest, most loving, gentle rottie in the world killed the owner's kid or kids or wife or husband or grandmother or whatever. On and on and on those stories go. I just read one today about a rottie that killed a neighbor's kid and the owner and the grandmother of the victim BOTH said that the rottie loved the little boy, the little boy had played with the dog for a long time and they all thought that the biggest danger the dog posed was licking someone to death. Then, the boy was standing on the street, not even knowing the dog was in the area when the dog attacked and killed him. Man, I have seen so many cases where the owners and the neighbors are just in total disbelief about what the dogs have done. That dog was their baby, their friend, their family member. NO WAY that dog did that! But it happened and they saw it happen. And it isn't always kids that get killed. Healthy adults have fallen victim to the same gentle dogs.

So, while it may be great for some to have one, I would never have one. Not when my kids were little, not now that I don't have any of my own kids nearby. I think more of my neighbors than that. It is just not worth the risk and there are too many other breeds out there that don't have that record. Being hard-headed about having a notorious breed isn't worth it. You can always have the dog put down when he screws up but you can't bring back that kid that was killed.

Now, if you know that you're always going to have the dog on a leash in public and that no children can come into contact with the dog on your property and there is no way the dog can EVER leave the property without you going with it, then maybe it is safe.

I killed a neighbor's rottie about eight years ago. I lived more than a mile from the neighbor but I had a bitch in heat and here he came. Huge dog. I called the neighbor, she said he will come home when he gets hungry and not to worry. I told her that he was being aggressive towards me and that my daughter couldn't come out of the house for fear and because I would not let her come out when the aggressive dog was in the yard. She said he won't hurt anyone. I closed the phone, walked outside with a gun in one hand and a pool cue in the other and headed for the dog. He headed for me. I raised the cue in plenty of time to warn him and still he came. One shot, one kill. Loaded him in the truck and took him home and dumped him in her driveway. She asked me what happened. I told her he was hungry now. I normally HATE to shoot a dog but I felt pretty good about that one. I'm a family man. My yard is my yard and my kids aren't going to be kept in the house because of an idiot dog owner.

Tibetan Mastiff. HUGE dog. But one of the very best for identifying what is his/hers to protect and knowing just how much aggression to display or force to use to end a threat. That dog is Man's Best Friend, regardless of the movie by the same name that shows one to be out-of-his mind ferocious. But if you get one, get a female. Males go where the scent is, when it comes. They can't help themselves. A female will stay home and take care of what is hers to take care of. You teach her where the property line is and she owns it after that. Introduce her ONE time to a friend or worker and she will always allow that friend or worker to pass if you're home. She will instantly recognize people she has already met. If a stranger comes, she will position herself between the stranger and you or your loved ones until you introduce her to the stranger. If you do not make an introduction, then she will repeat that performance if the stranger returns later. And if the stranger moves left or right, she moves too, to stay in the center. She isn't paying him any attention that you can discern but she is aware of what every square inch of his body is doing

The truth is, any dog can turn on its owner or neighbors. And just about any human can turn on its family, neighbors or co-workers. But all things considered, we just have to use our experience and knowledge to make the best decisions for our own and our family's safety.

A gay guy with aids is someone that I could take care of, day in, day out. I couldn't turn my back on someone like that. Aids doesn't scare me, nor do gay people. But that gay guy with aids is not going to take care of my kids. I don't know all that could go wrong and I think too much of my family to give it a test run. Same with Muslims in Afghanistan. I have worked with Muslims there and in Iraq. Great guys, great people, will give you the shirt off their backs. Been invited to homes, weddings and all sorts of social events where I really thought that the likely outcome was me getting ambushed and killed; not by my Muslim friends and co-workers but by the "Bad Guys". The Bad Guys spent enough time trying to kill my Muslim friends so I know they would not blink about killing me. I'm all too happy to spend time with the good ones. But NONE of the MEN are going to be watching my kids. I am all too aware of how different their societies are from ours and the things that they see as "okay" to do to children; boys or girls. Muslim women- Yeah, they can watch my kids if I know them. No problem. They are as upset about what the men do to children as I am. Is it a Muslim thing in itself when one speaks of Afghanistan people? I don't know. I just know the culture there and their men babysitting my kids isn't a good thing. Are Christian men in those countries the same as the Muslim men in that debate? I don't know. Never met one.

So, there is no convincing a rottie owner. And there is no convincing someone who is wary of rotties. In that case, perhaps it is best to follow the advice of the rottie experts. Look VERY far into the heritage of your almost new dog before you make the purchase. If you cannot trace the history of the dog back through many generations of gentle ancestors, then the risk of getting a bad one outweighs buying one. Wait until you can find one that is proven to be from gentle breeding, many generations.

But to answer the original question, I have no idea where to buy a rottie. Try a PM to Scea. I think he is a dog guy and even if he isn't, he knows lots of folks around here and where to find lots of stuff.

Blimey! Kanders you do have the verbals today! Busy chap like Lman will have to save this one for bedtime reading!

[skybluestu]

Hello, me again. So if cmjantje was looking for a Tibetan Mastiff puppy then nobody would bat an eyelid but because it's a Rottweiler he's after it's a different story and everyone comes out with the usual nonsense about them being evil child-killers! I was aware of the Tibetan Mastiff, beautiful dog, but didn't know that much about it so just spent 15mins reading about it on many different websites, they all say exactly the same thing and here's a quote which sums up what they say.

'The Tibetan Mastiff in Tibet is larger and more ferocious than Western examples. Protective, fearless, and distrustful of strangers, it is a fine guard dog, but too strong willed and massive to make a good family dog.

Perhaps the best way to help you visualize the Tibetan Mastiff is to compare him with more common breeds. He is similar in temperament to the Akita and Rottweiler in that he is generally reserved with strangers, trustworthy with children and gentle and affectionate with his family.'

Edited August 9, 2010 by skybluestu

[kandahar]

And there you have it. I love a good Tibetan Mastiff. Only dog I ever heard of that can and will pick up a baby in its mouth, move it from danger and set it down without upsetting the baby.

Personally, I would rather see anyone get a rottie than a poodle or dachshund.

Then again, that statement will probably bring some fire.

[kandahar]

Quote: "'The Tibetan Mastiff in Tibet is larger and more ferocious than Western examples. Protective, fearless, and distrustful of strangers, it is a fine guard dog, but too strong willed and massive to make a good family dog".

This is a true statement, Stu. If anyone wants a dog that is going play and frolic with the kids, the TM isn't the dog. When little Timmy tells the TM to go fetch, the TM is going to tell little Timmy to get bent. However, if little Timmy starts to wander away from the "safe zone", the TM is going to get up and stay close by little Timmy. No harm is going to come to the boy.

And as far as the relationship with the master goes, it isn't all warm and fuzzy either. The TM will come to the master at least once a day but probably not more than that and the TM and the master will verify the relationship. A little petting, a little instruction and reinforcement and the dog goes back to business. He/she probably won't bother you again all day. If you "call" the dog, the dog isn't going to come unless it really wants to. If you want the dog to come when it feels it shouldn't, you have to "command" the dog to come and it will immediately. But little Timmy calling and calling for the dog to come close by him just isn't going to happen unless the TM wants to be annoyed by Timmy for a little while .

Ferocious. Yes. But I have never heard of one being ferocious to someone on the "approval" list. There may be some stories out there but I don't know of any. I do know of lots of stories of the dog interceding when it thought it should with strangers or non-family that didn't follow the rules. However, as I said before, the dog only takes it as far as necessary to negate the threat. Most of these dogs are big enough that it doesn't take much. And I have never heard of one leaving its own property to go looking for someone to attack. They are too dedicated, typically, to leave their area of responsibility.

The last one I had was two generations removed from Tibet. But others are available that are 50 or more generations removed.

Edited August 9, 2010 by kandahar

[cmjantje]

My sister is breeding Tibetan terriers. Beutiful dogs but I would Never leave my child, how old I don't care with one of those, and she confirms that!

[kandahar]

My sister is breeding Tibetan terriers. Beutiful dogs but I would Never leave my child, how old I don't care with one of those, and she confirms that!

Yeah. Most terriers of any breed suck. Then again, that statement will probably bring some fire.

TM's eat TT's just to clean their teeth after a real meal.

[jubby]

I was very wary of commenting on this Thread. Dogs are such an emotive subject.

I think in all fairness the Guy was just asking for Rottweiler puppies, I hope he finds some.

[kandahar]

I was very wary of commenting on this Thread. Dogs are such an emotive subject.

I think in all fairness the Guy was just asking for Rottweiler puppies, I hope he finds some.

Sorry. I didn't know we were supposed to be fair. I'll try harder next time.

[cmjantje]

OK! We know now.. there are two camps.. one that knows about Rottweilers and have their personal opinion about the dog and a second one who reads articles about the Rottweiler and think they know better.

At least I got Some answers and try to buy one.

Oh BTW.. I already wrote I am a Boxer lover.

Training a Boxer is far more difficult because these beautiful animals stay young until they die. After 6 to 8 years they won't run away anymore, and No mine was Never a "drooper".

Edited August 10, 2010 by cmjantje

[skybluestu]

OK! We know now.. there are two camps.. one that knows about Rottweilers and have their personal opinion about the dog and a second one who reads articles about the Rottweiler and think they know better.

At least I got Some answers and try to buy one.

Oh BTW.. I already wrote I am a Boxer lover.

Training a Boxer is far more difficult because these beautiful animals stay young until they die. After 6 to 8 years they won't run away anymore, and No mine was Never a "drooper".

Excellent reply and hopefully the penultimate one, I think the first part is absolutely spot on.

[thaigerd]

OK! We know now.. there are two camps.. one that knows about Rottweilers and have their personal opinion about the dog and a second one who reads articles about the Rottweiler and think they know better.

At least I got Some answers and try to buy one.

Oh BTW.. I already wrote I am a Boxer lover.

Training a Boxer is far more difficult because these beautiful animals stay young until they die. After 6 to 8 years they won't run away anymore, and No mine was Never a "drooper".

I am a Rotti and a Boxer lover and we have both, they are a nice pack.

You are right, they stay young forever......my Rottis are sleeping already but the Boxer is still running around in the garden

[wolf5370]

I don't often feel nostalgic when reading TV but I do today, I used to love Jackanory!

I've been bitten a couple of times and almost bitten many times by dogs in the UK, Australia, India and Thailand and none of them were by a Rottweiler. They were mainly mongrels but also a Collie, Golden Retriever, Jack Russell and a Great Dane. My dog, almost on a daily basis here in Thailand, has dogs either bite or try to bite her and they have ranged from Golden Labradors and Poodles to Dalmations and Alsations. She has never, not once, tried to fight back and has never, not once, shown any aggression to anyone. She has met many of my students, neighbours kids and kids while out on her daily walk and on the hash here and there has never been a problem. Sure, everyone has read about a Rottie killing a kid, dogs do unfortunately sometimes kill people but you'll only read about it if a Rottie or Pit Bull does it! Of course if a big dog bites someone then the damage will be greater than a smaller dog but only a very small % of Rottweilers attack people, much less so than most other breeds. Applied Animal Behaviour Science recently conducted a study on the most aggressive dogs, here are the results and a link to some more interesting reading.

http://www.telegraph...ssive-dogs.html

10. German Shepherd

9 Border Collie

8. English Springer Spaniel

7. Beagle

6. Pit Bull

5. Australian Cattle Dog

4. Akita

3. Jack Russell Terrier

2. Chihuahua

1. Dachshund

So, while it's been an interesting discussion with some great points of view, I will continue to let my dog meet people/kids and walk her off the leash as I have done every day until there is a reason (apart from just her breed!) not to.

The difference being that a bloody Chihuahua isn't going to kill you (unless you get it caught in you throat or trip over it) - neither are most of those breeds. Aggressive doesn't read the same as dangerous. A slightly aggressive (or even playful) 90KG rottie beats a very aggressive Chihuahua any day.

I have a big dog too, (only 60Kg), and the breed is very old and makes an excellent family guard dog and he can be over protective when strangers approach me/him outside (just growls - still makes them run!) - especially when I have the kids with me too (he protects them outside more than he does me alone). However, all dogs become a pack in numbers and then their temperament can change in a blink and big dogs kill as often in play as they do in aggression. I am sure as a good owner your Rottie is good, well behaved and knows its place in your family (i.e. just above the cat and below all people - as in my house - though cat sometimes disagrees with this). However, a second one could change everything and destroy all that hard work training them. If you know your dogs, can train them properly and never let them play alone near kids (or get out alone), then I'll shut up, but please be careful. Nuff said.

[kandahar]

New topic just popped up on TV for any of you who might be looking to buy a boxer pup. The OP has six for sale, Isaan area.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/393638-boxer-puppies/

[Limbo]

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.

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.

Sorry Jantje, it's not my intention to hijack your thread,

but as it is about animals I thought you might forgive me.

Three days ago, driving from Chiang Khong to Chiang Saen we

saw a little kitten aside of the road.

And yes, stupid us, we did what one shouldn't do: Overwhelmed

by sympathic feelings towards this little helpless creature we

let our Samaritan out and thus stopped, feeded it (with the

finest sala poa you can get in Chiang Khong)), gave it water

and offered it a lift to good old Chiang Rai.

Our cat wasn't very happy to see the little one.

We thought, okay, we give it some days and things will change.

No, they didn't ...

So if anybody has a home for this little sweety, please send me a PM.

And now, still in animal terms, of to Big Gary's Kangeroo bar

for a San Miguel.

Thanks for your attention and apologies for being off-topic.

Limbo

. . . . . . . . . . . . .

[skybluestu]

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Sorry Jantje, it's not my intention to hijack your thread,

but as it is about animals I thought you might forgive me.

Three days ago, driving from Chiang Khong to Chiang Saen we

saw a little kitten aside of the road.

And yes, stupid us, we did what one shouldn't do: Overwhelmed

by sympathic feelings towards this little helpless creature we

let our Samaritan out and thus stopped, feeded it (with the

finest sala poa you can get in Chiang Khong)), gave it water

and offered it a lift to good old Chiang Rai.

Our cat wasn't very happy to see the little one.

We thought, okay, we give it some days and things will change.

No, they didn't ...

So if anybody has a home for this little sweety, please send me a PM.

And now, still in animal terms, of to Big Gary's Kangeroo bar

for a San Miguel.

Thanks for your attention and apologies for being off-topic.

Limbo

. . . . . . . . . . . . .

My dear Limbo, the cat seems to be wearing a plastic bag?!

[jubby]

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.

.

.

Sorry Jantje, it's not my intention to hijack your thread,

but as it is about animals I thought you might forgive me.

Three days ago, driving from Chiang Khong to Chiang Saen we

saw a little kitten aside of the road.

And yes, stupid us, we did what one shouldn't do: Overwhelmed

by sympathic feelings towards this little helpless creature we

let our Samaritan out and thus stopped, feeded it (with the

finest sala poa you can get in Chiang Khong)), gave it water

and offered it a lift to good old Chiang Rai.

Our cat wasn't very happy to see the little one.

We thought, okay, we give it some days and things will change.

No, they didn't ...

So if anybody has a home for this little sweety, please send me a PM.

And now, still in animal terms, of to Big Gary's Kangeroo bar

for a San Miguel.

Thanks for your attention and apologies for being off-topic.

Limbo

. . . . . . . . . . . . .

My dear Limbo, the cat seems to be wearing a plastic bag?!

Its a Rain Suit Stu. surely you can see that. cats dont like water , ........... or maybe .... nah... Dont want to upset the Cat lovers

[Limbo]

My dear Limbo, the cat seems to be wearing a plastic bag?!

A very good observation Skykluestu, very good indeed, keep them coming!

The ability to observe things the way they are is a gift from above!

And as we regularly notice here in this forum-turned-chatbox not everybody

has the luck to be blessed with it.

As Jubby noticed: it could have been a rain coat if it hadn't been a

plastic bag. A matter of carma so to say. So also Jubby earns some

valuable points here and will go on to the next round.

Originally it (the plastic bag) contained the sala pao, the delicious sala pao

I should say. The delicious sala pao from Chiang Khong to be more precise.

I suppose we all enjoy a sala pao once in a while, these big or

small white balls of rice meal with on top a little spot indicating

the specific character of the hidden content that otherwise would remain

a surprise untill after the first bite.

It's only after that first bite that you really taste, smell and even

visually can register what's inside.

It can be an egg, meat but also sweet substances that suddenly enter the

confrontation with your palate.

So don't forget to look at the spot on top, make perhaps a crib note with

the different colours and the corresponding contents:

Nothing is more disturbing than taking a bite expecting a nice strong

flavoured minced meat mix and ending up with some cloyingly sweet

substance inbetween your theeth.

But back to the bag!

Wrapped in paper the sala pao came out of the bag and went for a great

part into the cat.

As we didn't know at what speed it would pass through the alimentary

canal of the animal, whe put it (the cat), complete with the parts of

the sala pao it had consumed, in the bag.

This to contain things in a way that would prevent harm to the interior

of the car and also for safety reasons, namely to prevent the animal from

seating under the brake pedal. It worked. We all came home in good shape.

There it immediatly shit on the bed in the guestroom ...

So, time for breakfast: Pizza from Bluesky, for gourmets the Best in Town,

though for those that grew up on tomato ketchup covered derivates probably

not the first choice.

Have a nice weekend gentlemen!

Limbo

Anyhow: Nothing above a raw herring with chopped onions!

. . . . . . . . . . .

[cmjantje]

In CM forum there is a long thread about taking cats to your house, especially one of the thousands that live at a certain Wat. You are also encouraged to feed them too. Result? Within 3 months the number of cats was at least doubled. one of my former neighbors took about 5 to 10 of these cats. her present neighbors are So happy with all the shit these cats leave in Their garden. Why we farang have to take care of the mistakes Thai make e.g. not sterilizing their dogs and cats? Oh BTW here where I live we don't have these problems... people simply eat them

Edited August 28, 2010 by cmjantje

[jubby]

I've just this morning taken a dislike to a Cat we had previously rescued. I guess I'm stuck with it too. better get her nutered.

And as for Chat Limbo, I'm still not sure wether you approve or disapprove but one things certain ; We are amatuers compared to you . :jap:

Edited August 28, 2010 by jubby

[scorpio1945]

[in CM forum there is a long thread about taking cats to your house, especially one of the thousands that live at a certain Wat.

Pardon the chat. Where is the Wat with the thousand??? cats.

[cmjantje]

[in CM forum there is a long thread about taking cats to your house, especially one of the thousands that live at a certain Wat.

Pardon the chat. Where is the Wat with the thousand??? cats.

Sorry, the thead about the cats is in Finally Happy..... My mistake... Getting old I think

[cmjantje]

It was in a Dutch newspaper:

http://news.sky.com/...201009215724722

All the comments of the Dutch people were... NEVER leave children and a dog alone in one room.... Also not when he/she is Soo sweet...

Just look at the pictures, and what people write also... Grandpa and Grandma... how do they feel..... Too sad for words

Edited September 13, 2010 by cmjantje

[TyGrr]

My Rott is about to give pups. I have no idea who the father is but if there is interest let me know. Thanks.

[jubby]

My Rott is about to give pups. I have no idea who the father is but if there is interest let me know. Thanks.

I hope the father was a Rottweiler or you could have an interesting mix

"devil Dogs" to be sure !

I visited Skyblustu last week and his "devil Dog" insisted on chewing my favourite Pakama, cum kneckerchief , cum general sweat rag. I don't know what the attraction was , She left the thing with a decidedly doggy smell

Its a Travesty, I paid over 30 baht for it 3 years ago

[sceadugenga]

I don't think you can call yourself a true Chiang Rai expat until you've been slobbered over by skyblustu's dog.

[jubby]

I don't think you can call yourself a true Chiang Rai expat until you've been slobbered over by skyblustu's dog.

'Slobbered' Scea. !!! . ......... Thats not the picture I was trying to paint .

Wheres VF when I need him; We need a word befitting of a 'Devil Dog', any Dog can slobber

[sceadugenga]

Yoyo the wonder dog don't slobber.....

Edited October 18, 2010 by sceadugenga

[harsu]

I don't think you can call yourself a true Chiang Rai expat until you've been slobbered over by skyblustu's dog.

'Slobbered' Scea. !!! . ......... Thats not the picture I was trying to paint .

Wheres VF when I need him; We need a word befitting of a 'Devil Dog', any Dog can slobber

'an affa sliverin beastie', said in your best Scots accent ,perhaps?

[jubby]

I don't think you can call yourself a true Chiang Rai expat until you've been slobbered over by skyblustu's dog.

'Slobbered' Scea. !!! . ......... Thats not the picture I was trying to paint .

Wheres VF when I need him; We need a word befitting of a 'Devil Dog', any Dog can slobber

'an affa sliverin beastie', said in your best Scots accent ,perhaps?

I don't have a best Scots accent .... Affa's not in my vocabulary . Its not the F word is it