Pajero Vs Fortuner

[Thailaw]

Having looked at a Pajero and a Fortuner last week, I am inclined to go for a Pajero. The prices are almost the same (B1,179,000), but the Toyota dealer will give free insurance for the first year and the Mitsubishi dealer will give a B20,000 discount. The Fortuner styling looks old and dated. I expect that it will go through a major face lift soon. The dealer said that the Pajero is a new model, but I am not sure when it came out. Toyota's seem to hold their value better, so a purchase of the Pajero would need to be a long term (5 years or more) commitment. The Pajero's interior is much nicer than the Fortuner's. Any thoughts on the relative value, quality, appeal of these two "cars" would be appreciated, especially from someone that owns or has owned either one. I expect to buy one of the two in about a month, and would like to make an "informed" purchase, to the extent possible. Thanks,

[Thailaw]

Loads of stuff on your question on the forum, take a look at my topic ....'OK, so you have spent your hard earned cash on a truck or SUV ' , the idea was for any guys to report ups and downs of their new purchase, you will learn a bit there. Also you can ask particular questions to the guy who posted about his ride.

Transam, thanks. I went to your thread, which I had not seen before. I waded through the first two pages of stuff on Vigos and NVs and cup holders. I did see some information on the Pajero which was useful. I have already narrowed my choices to the Pajero and the Fortuner, and have excluded Nissan and Honda and all others that offer an SUV type vechile, and would under no conditions buy a truck -- jamais, jamais, jamais! So, I would really like to hear about these two vehicles and not about trucks, etc. Some times a very focused thread can help save alot of time and effort, and still provide very useful information to the readers. If I had to guess, I would think that the Fortuner, the Pajero and the CRV capture 90% of the SUV market, and focusing on these cars only would be what most buyers want/need to know. So, I do hope that people will respond to my OP and not assume that the topic has been covered adequately elsewhere.

[Forethat]

It is now 5 months since I picked up my 3.2 GT and I can now start to summarize the first impressions:

There is one thing that I am missing: Trip Computer.

There WAS one thing missing: No multi-function for the sound system in the steering wheel. This can be easily corrected (links available here on TV!). I corrected this at the cost of ~4000 baht.

The way the 2nd row backseats folds away in the floor makes me smile every time I load my Pajero with golf bags, baby strollers and bags. It would have been impossible with the Fortuner. This feature alone makes the Pajero superior. The thought of living with the sloppy solution in the Fortuner is inconceivable.

Suspension is awesome.

Service and support from Mitsubishi is nothing but outstanding. Need to service your car? Easy: no need to book, just drive in to Mitsubishi and it's like a freaking F1 pit stop while you have a coffee. There are people running around the car like crazy, changing oil and checking stuff that should be checked. I serviced mine today and counted to SIX mechanics working on the car. All done in less than 20 min. Class!

Things that could be improved: The diesel is a little noisy compared to the Fortuner. I have heard rumors that you can add extra sound insulation and make the Pajero much quieter. Don't know for sure though.

If the Pajero (Diesel) was a little quieter, had a trip computer and a multi-function steering wheel, it would be an absolute smash hit. I am still VERY happy with mine.

Edited September 1, 2010 by Forethat

[MoonRiverOasis]

Having looked at a Pajero and a Fortuner last week, I am inclined to go for a Pajero. The prices are almost the same (B1,179,000), but the Toyota dealer will give free insurance for the first year and the Mitsubishi dealer will give a B20,000 discount

There are similar price-points, yes, but the nearest equivelant model Fortuner is always more expensive than the Pajero Sport. You can do a LOT better deal than what you've been offered on the Pajero Sport - I know for a fact that there's 70K of discount "play" in the car, so would suggest shopping that quote around some more

The Fortuner styling looks old and dated. I expect that it will go through a major face lift soon. The dealer said that the Pajero is a new model, but I am not sure when it came out

Fortuner was first released in November 2004, and most recently updated in August 2008 (new front-end styling, added VSC, changed line-up).

Pajero Sport was first released in August 2008, and most recently updated in October 2009 (new front grille, added cruise control, back row seats changed slightly)

The next generation Fortuner is currently scheduled for release in 2014-15. No solid sources on when the next-gen Pajero Sport will arrive, but 2013-14 would be the earliest. Fortuner has recently released some nano-changes (Sportivo III, Aperto II), and both brands are expected to produce at least one more minor change before the next generation arrives.

Toyota's seem to hold their value better, so a purchase of the Pajero would need to be a long term (5 years or more) commitment.

The Pajero Sport has picked up a huge amount of the new SUV market share this year (it almost equalled total Fortuner sales in May and July in fact), and used prices are going up as a result of it's increasing popularity and lack of 2nd hand supply. Conversely, as the used Fortuner fleet is aging there's a ton of supply in the 2nd hand market and it's dragging down the resale values of the entire range as a result.

Toyota will always have the absolute best resale within the first 12 months from new, but after that it quickly levels out. At the 2-year mark Fortuner will (currently) acheive ~50k Baht better resale than the equivelant Pajero Sport model (not enough to offset Fortuner's higher purchase price), and indications are that both will pretty much equalize beyond that point (based on current projections).

The Pajero's interior is much nicer than the Fortuner's. Any thoughts on the relative value, quality, appeal of these two "cars" would be appreciated, especially from someone that owns or has owned either one. I expect to buy one of the two in about a month, and would like to make an "informed" purchase, to the extent possible. Thanks

Both are great vehicles

Fortuner's 3.0L diesel is a sweet engine - quiet (for a diesel) and with a wide usable torque range. The Totota 2.7L Petrol is to be absolutely avoided, and the 2.5L diesel, while being a nice engine, is only available with a manual transmission which is not a smart choice in this style of vehicle (from both and ownership a resale standpoint).

Mitsubishi's diesels are both also nice engines - neither is quite as refined as the Toyota 3.0L, but both are easily comparable to the 2.5L Toyota diesel. Both vehicles have the same grade of materials and construction quality - i.e. not exotic materials, but not cheap and tacky, and both have excellent build quality.

I purchased a Pajero Sport GT in April and have since done 15,000KM in it - I'm happy to report not having any buyer's remorse - it's a great car. My wife hugely prefers driving it to her (soon to be replaced) Yaris too, hence the KM's travelled

On a different day with the wind coming from another direction I could have just as easily bought a Fortuner though

Edited September 2, 2010 by MoonRiverOasis

[katabeachbum]

yepp, their both great SUVs at incredibly low prices compared to cars in LOS, due to tax reasons

Pajeros 3rd row seat fold better.

Fortuners 3,0 is a very sweet diesel for a 4 pot japs/LOS engine, smooth, quiet and long powerband

In the low end I would choose a Pajero 2,5 auto 2wd

High end it would be Fortuner 3,0 full time 4wd

No doubt on either of them

Toyota has a very strong dealership. Quality may vary, but still among the best in LOS

Mitsubishi seem to have some excellent dealers, but in some towns they are crap, and in some towns they have closed down past year

No matter what SUV you choose, its not going to be better than the aftermarket service. Find out how many dealers each brand has within acceptable driving distance, and take this into consideration.

Good luck

and oh, forget the CRV. Overprised for what you get, thirsty, useless offroad. Used to have one. Used to have a Fortuner 3,0 auto 4x4 too.

[MoonRiverOasis]

In the low end I would choose a Pajero 2,5 auto 2wd

High end it would be Fortuner 3,0 full time 4wd

Yes, I would agree with that.

The gray area is in the middle range - at that money it's a really difficult choice - for me it was too hard to choose a winner there, so the end decision for me was just whether to spend less or spend more

Edited September 2, 2010 by MoonRiverOasis

[grabue]

Mitsubishi Pajero Sport can be a really good car - but only if you don't park close to the sea or drive near the sea.

On the photo you can see my rusty new Pajero after 4 month.

and the comment of the investigation report from Mitsubishi Thailand:

Summary: after investigation, the problem does not concern with product quality but the problem occured by the customer parked the car close to the sea

[MoonRiverOasis]

Mitsubishi Pajero Sport can be a really good car - but only if you don't park close to the sea or drive near the sea.

On the photo you can see my rusty new Pajero after 4 month.

and the comment of the investigation report from Mitsubishi Thailand:

Summary: after investigation, the problem does not concern with product quality but the problem occured by the customer parked the car close to the sea

Same alloys/metals used in them all (same suppliers even) - I'd say this hasn't been parked close to the sea, but rather it's been in the sea or beach-driven. In which case they'd all do the same.

Edited September 2, 2010 by MoonRiverOasis

[angiud]

What about the anti-rust bottom treatment Toyota and Isuzu give when you buy a new car?

[Forethat]

What about the anti-rust bottom treatment Toyota and Isuzu give when you buy a new car?

You get one when you buy a Pajero as well. I dont buy the "parked close to the sea" argument. I have spent long periods of time in Hua-Hin, Cha-Am and Ko Chang and I have no rust on my car. I have even driven mine on the beach. I have no rust on mine.

[Forethat]

Mitsubishi Pajero Sport can be a really good car - but only if you don't park close to the sea or drive near the sea.

On the photo you can see my rusty new Pajero after 4 month.

and the comment of the investigation report from Mitsubishi Thailand:

Summary: after investigation, the problem does not concern with product quality but the problem occured by the customer parked the car close to the sea

Ouch. That's really disturbing. Did you get the rust treatment for free when you bought it? I heard rumours it was introduced due to problems with rust?

Sorry about your car, man, that really sucks!

[grabue]

thank you guys for offer your condolences,

first, sorry for my bad english, but I'm not a native speaker

Same alloys/metals used in them all (same suppliers even) - I'd say this hasn't been parked close to the sea, but rather it's been in the sea or beach-driven. In which case they'd all do the same.

I'm sure, I never drove in the sea , even never on the beach!

THAT is an horrendous photo. Very disturbing. and the Mitsu comment is just as bad. Whats the rest of the undercarriage like ?

The rust affects the whole chassis and also the brakelines and this was 4 months after the first licening

What about the anti-rust bottom treatment Toyota and Isuzu give when you buy a new car?

that's really disturbing. Did you get the rust treatment for free when you bought it?

They never offered me a additional anti-rust treatment, neither for free nor for buying.

You get one when you buy a Pajero as well. I dont buy the "parked close to the sea" argument. I have spent long periods of time in Hua-Hin, Cha-Am and Ko Chang and I have no rust on my car. I have even driven mine on the beach. I have no rust on mine.

no other car in our carpark has rust and they are all years older than mine

and one more joke: Mitsu told me, the warranty expired at this moment, when I

discovered the rust. I thought I understand wrong, but Mr. ....

repeated after inquire, again!!

Further they told me, that all mitsubishi cars have no standard undercover

rustprotection. They will only do, if the customer ask for!

If you like, I have a lot of more jokes, from the Mitsubishi experts.

Grabue

[Forethat]

Grabue, when did you purchase your Pajero? Which month and year?

[angiud]

I suggest you to write to complain how Mitsubishi Thailand care about you and your car directly to the Japanese direction, or the PR Office, Press Office, whatever, noting that you wrote your story already on this forum and that you will follow to write your complaints on the web.

Usually works.

[fullcave]

If you are driving on the beach be sure to rinse the undercarriage, wheel wells and bottom of doors with fresh water. Motorbikes also should not be driven on the beach either for the same reason. You should apply an undercoat as the rust is only superficial at this point.

[Thailaw]

That is an appalling story and l hope you tell all your heartache. My own topic ' So you spent you hard earned cash etc ' would love to hear about your story for future buyers and how to avoid it, l don't mean don't buy it but to get the under body protection., please.

Thanks to everyone. The information is very helpful. Grabue, your story and pictures are really a shame but a good alert. By reporting it here, others (including me) will be sure to have the undercarriage rust protected. I'd go ballastic if my 4 month old car rusted like that!

[Forethat]

Thanks to everyone. The information is very helpful. Grabue, your story and pictures are really a shame but a good alert. By reporting it here, others (including me) will be sure to have the undercarriage rust protected. I'd go ballastic if my 4 month old car rusted like that!

Ballistic is only the first name....and I thought I had a couple of sleepless nights when my Pajero was covered in limescale....

[grabue]

Grabue, when did you purchase your Pajero? Which month and year?

I bought the Pajero in Mai 2009. I did a test drive and I liked this car. But I wanted to purchase a white car and the dealer told me they don't sell white Pajero in Thailand.

After a few days he phoned me, that he will get a white Pajero – and I think now, this was a stock car.

When I got the car, I didn't look beneath.

At 5000 km inspection on 7.9.09 I saw rust damage on the whole underside, also parts of the chassis and axle. That means this kind of rust cannot completely be removed.

People from the Mitsubishi Headquater in Bangkok came to give their expert advice.

Mitsubishi Thailand claims that I'm responsible for the damage because our house in Pattaya is close to the sea!! Mitsubishi is not responsible for this case!

So I had had a second meeting with Mitsubishi Thailand.

They suggested to remove the rust ( it is not possible to remove completely in my opinion) and do undercover anti-rust protection. ( now the car was 7 months old) But Mitsubishi will not extend the waranty on the repaired parts.

We meet again. They had no acceptable solution. They suggested that I

should sell the rusty car to another private person. After this I could buy a new Mitsubishi for trader condition.

This was not acceptable for me, because in my opinion it's a deceit.

The only solution I will accept is that Mitsubishi take back (buy back) this car and I will make an extra and fair payment for a new, similar car.

We had the next meeting at the consumer department in Chonburi.

The engineer Mitsubishi obviously does not know a reason for the severe rust, therefore he accused me of driving in salty water or chemicals. As I disagree with this case, they told that a big wave, probably a tsunami splashed over the car park (as told by the fisherman who lives opposite our condo). He repeated this nonsense two times after my enquiry.

They also told me that undercover anti-rust protection will only be done if the customer ask for it.

And the warranty expired at this moment, when I discovered the rust.

Mitsubishi Thailand suggested that I should go to a garage, repair there the car. After this I should ask in a letter to mitsubishi for paying this rust removement and I should also sign a paper, that this was no fault in the material.

This was no acceptable solution for me.

I suggest you to write to complain how Mitsubishi Thailand care about you and your car directly to the Japanese direction, or the PR Office, Press Office, whatever, noting that you wrote your story already on this forum and that you will follow to write your complaints on the web.

I already wrote to Japan, see what they replied:

We have reviewed your mail. It is unfortunate that you and MMTh still have

disagreements in many areas.

As to your questions to us, we would like these to be handled by MMTh, who

we think has already covered....... Further, as we explained to you, our

distributor has the responsibility and authority to handle the case.

But thanks for the good idea – today I have send them the link to this forum.

Thank you all, for your interest. I will keep you informed

Edited September 3, 2010 by grabue

[Forethat]

Again, this is a very sad story.

I have to give it to MMTh, because when I look at the pictures (mind you, I'm not an expert by any means) the rust appears to cover entire areas as if the car had been completely soaked or severely sprayed with something that caused the rust. Even so, I can’t imagine metal surfaces corroding so severely other than they were unpainted from the start (bare metal surfaces), and I still wonder if it could happen with plain water - Thailand is a humid country but the car actually dries in minutes due to the heat. The water freakin' vaporizes.

I find it hard to understand why there’s so much rust on your car, and MMTh is probably making a case for similar reasons. What they are doing is providing you with reasonable explanations to the amount of rust, and who can blame them, park a car next to the ocean for 4 months and the entire car is covered in rust – unheard of.

So what are you going to do? If the rust was potentially caused by driving through chemicals; why cant this be covered by the insurance?

[katabeachbum]

Mitsubishi Pajero Sport can be a really good car - but only if you don't park close to the sea or drive near the sea.

On the photo you can see my rusty new Pajero after 4 month.

and the comment of the investigation report from Mitsubishi Thailand:

Summary: after investigation, the problem does not concern with product quality but the problem occured by the customer parked the car close to the sea

I live few hundred meters from the beach. Even stainless steel rusts. Chromed mirrors on motorbikes are brown within 2 months. Combo of temp, airhumidity and sea is mortal.

Mitsubishi used to be very popular among the locals, but they went brown really fast. ALL, yes ALL locals have changed to Toyota and Honda past 2 years. Less rust. Except one Pajero white and one red Triton. Both brown within 2 months from new.

My own car gets an initial treatment when delivered new, and a new complete spray before one year age. In addition its waxed every 3 months, and its parked inside tiled garage very well vented in the walls not facing ocean

[katabeachbum]

Again, this is a very sad story.

I have to give it to MMTh, because when I look at the pictures (mind you, I'm not an expert by any means) the rust appears to cover entire areas as if the car had been completely soaked or severely sprayed with something that caused the rust. Even so, I can't imagine metal surfaces corroding so severely other than they were unpainted from the start (bare metal surfaces), and I still wonder if it could happen with plain water - Thailand is a humid country but the car actually dries in minutes due to the heat. The water freakin' vaporizes.

I find it hard to understand why there's so much rust on your car, and MMTh is probably making a case for similar reasons. What they are doing is providing you with reasonable explanations to the amount of rust, and who can blame them, park a car next to the ocean for 4 months and the entire car is covered in rust – unheard of.

So what are you going to do? If the rust was potentially caused by driving through chemicals; why cant this be covered by the insurance?

Most new cars are parked close to the ocean for months. Most new car to be transported from manufactorer wait for sea transport close to docks. Then they spend 2-5 weeks on a ro-ro ship. On arrival to destiny country, most are stored on docks until sold. shipped to dealer. On occasions these storage areas are flooded, and cars are wright offs (or sold to africa).

I suspect this particular Pajero has been flooded in seawater before sold, BUT STILL SHOULDNT LOOK THIS BAD.

The beach boys here in Kata Beach all drive their Vigos and DMax daily on the beach. None of them look like this within 3 years

[Forethat]

Again, this is a very sad story.

I have to give it to MMTh, because when I look at the pictures (mind you, I'm not an expert by any means) the rust appears to cover entire areas as if the car had been completely soaked or severely sprayed with something that caused the rust. Even so, I can't imagine metal surfaces corroding so severely other than they were unpainted from the start (bare metal surfaces), and I still wonder if it could happen with plain water - Thailand is a humid country but the car actually dries in minutes due to the heat. The water freakin' vaporizes.

I find it hard to understand why there's so much rust on your car, and MMTh is probably making a case for similar reasons. What they are doing is providing you with reasonable explanations to the amount of rust, and who can blame them, park a car next to the ocean for 4 months and the entire car is covered in rust – unheard of.

So what are you going to do? If the rust was potentially caused by driving through chemicals; why cant this be covered by the insurance?

Most new cars are parked close to the ocean for months. Most new car to be transported from manufactorer wait for sea transport close to docks. Then they spend 2-5 weeks on a ro-ro ship. On arrival to destiny country, most are stored on docks until sold. shipped to dealer. On occasions these storage areas are flooded, and cars are wright offs (or sold to africa).

I suspect this particular Pajero has been flooded in seawater before sold, BUT STILL SHOULDNT LOOK THIS BAD.

The beach boys here in Kata Beach all drive their Vigos and DMax daily on the beach. None of them look like this within 3 years

Pajeros are built in Laem Chabang, Pattaya....

[katabeachbum]

Again, this is a very sad story.

I have to give it to MMTh, because when I look at the pictures (mind you, I'm not an expert by any means) the rust appears to cover entire areas as if the car had been completely soaked or severely sprayed with something that caused the rust. Even so, I can't imagine metal surfaces corroding so severely other than they were unpainted from the start (bare metal surfaces), and I still wonder if it could happen with plain water - Thailand is a humid country but the car actually dries in minutes due to the heat. The water freakin' vaporizes.

I find it hard to understand why there's so much rust on your car, and MMTh is probably making a case for similar reasons. What they are doing is providing you with reasonable explanations to the amount of rust, and who can blame them, park a car next to the ocean for 4 months and the entire car is covered in rust – unheard of.

So what are you going to do? If the rust was potentially caused by driving through chemicals; why cant this be covered by the insurance?

Most new cars are parked close to the ocean for months. Most new car to be transported from manufactorer wait for sea transport close to docks. Then they spend 2-5 weeks on a ro-ro ship. On arrival to destiny country, most are stored on docks until sold. shipped to dealer. On occasions these storage areas are flooded, and cars are wright offs (or sold to africa).

I suspect this particular Pajero has been flooded in seawater before sold, BUT STILL SHOULDNT LOOK THIS BAD.

The beach boys here in Kata Beach all drive their Vigos and DMax daily on the beach. None of them look like this within 3 years

Pajeros are built in Laem Chabang, Pattaya....

yes, and Mitsu says its damaged cause its been parked close to the sea

I d say its damaged cause its not been properly build AND have been in the sea frequently

[Forethat]

Pajeros are built in Laem Chabang, Pattaya....

yes, and Mitsu says its damaged cause its been parked close to the sea

I d say its damaged cause its not been properly build AND have been in the sea frequently

That's my point - Pattaya is close to the sea...

I wonder if it would be possible to get the complete history of the car; exactly when was it built...? Where has it been? Does Mitsubishi have a lot somewhere in Pattay where they park manufactured cars, perhaps close to the sea..?

I also believe the extra rust treatment was introduced in 2010, meaning OP couldn't even request his..?

[taninthai]

i had a vigo for 7 months last year drove down beach 2 or 3 times everyday and was parked about 30 meters from the sea with no protection every day and night and it didnt look like that ,this was a 2005 so i doubt it had underboby protection ,it s got to be chemical damage or actually been sitting in the sea..

[katabeachbum]

I think we must all remember that the rusted parts and body did have paint from factory which should hold back rust unless it is very thin and metal can be attacked, does suggest lack of coats. The upper body has no rust so why should the underside. If the underside had enough paint covering it it would never rust in such a short time. We know if you put a bit of tin outside wet, it will rust in minutes but painted, no rust. I dread to think whats happening with stuff you cannot see.

since even the brake lines are rusted, this vehicle must have been exposed to much more than a few trips on the beach

if body/floor, frame and bolted on parts are all affected, they come from different makers and paintjobs

[John 1]

Grabue, can you provide some more photo's other side also exhaust system as something doesn't ad up here. I have a 11 year old Mitsubishi 4x4 nearly all the time on Samui and on and off on the ferry mine doesn't look like that.

[fredob43]

To return to the OP P.Vs.F I put a post in some week's ago on handling of Pejero most peep's told me it it handle's well but you have to cange the wheel's/tyre's ect another cost strate away. May I sugest that you follow one down the road and see how much it lean's on corner's the local lad's now call the Pejero the Pizza because it's like the tower. In a strate line it's great, nice car, have a test drive in both and see how you feel. It's realy a 50/50 choice.

[grabue]

I never drove through salty water or chemicals.

The car was washed in a normal car wash, nothing special. And I drove 90 % on asphalt streets.

here you can see more pictures:

http://s754.photobucket.com/albums/xx182/grabue/mitsu/

(passwort: mitsu)

I suppose this is a car from an old stock and I don't know, what Mitsubishi did with this car, before sold.

Never forget: to look beneath a brandnew car!

[SantiSuk]

I'm the guy that Transam referred to as having comments on the ride (of my Fortuner TDV Sportivo). It is now 10 months old and has done 20,000 km.

The ride has finally settled down - still slightly firm for my liking but its my own fault for buying an off road vehicle and using it almost entirely like an on-road saloon.

I'm very happy with it. It's a robust monster that has given no problems. My trip computer shows 11.1 km/litre for the first 20,000 but you will get substantially less than that the more you cruise above 110kph. Like the Pajero, servicing is a dream. Toyota also have a drive up no-appointments system at their spanking new dealerships here in Isaan and my 10k and 20k services cost about 1,700 baht and take less than 30 minutes if I go in before 9:00am (Thais are too lazy to go in early in the boondocks). Got a free car wash thrown in at 20k. Servicing costs like this are unheard of in the Western world!!

The downsides are reported or alluded to here. The back seat stowage absorbs a lot of cabin stowage space (but you can take the seats out quite easily I'm told). There is no USB connection for an i-Pod or other MP3 player. Crazy on a modern 1.4m baht car when 100k baht of that seems to be for media players. I am told I could use a bluetooth MP3 player.

You will be a happy owner of a Fortuner, but I have no experience of a Pajero so cannot comment comparatively.