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Egypt to open Gaza crossing permanently

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The vile pro Israel lobby that has raised it's ugly head on this forum, with absolutely no compassion whatsoever for the suffering of the Palestinians just reinforces my view of what should happen to the state of Israel. Unfortunately forum rules prevent me from posting those views.

The Palestinian Arabs stop declaring war and quit refusing peace deals, their suffering will be replaced by their own state.

"If the Arabs lay down their arms there will be no war. If Israel lays down its arms there will be no Israel"

That and The Palestinians cannot form a normal state. They cannot emigrate to Arab countries without accepting a catastrophic decline in living standards, and very few can emigrate to Western countries. The optimal solution for the Palestinians is to demand a state and blackmail Western and Arab donors with the threat of violence, but never actually get one.

"As long as all concerned understand that the comedy is not supposed to have an ending, the Palestinians can persist quite tolerably in their "intolerable" predicament. " Norman A Bailey

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The vile pro Israel lobby that has raised it's ugly head on this forum, with absolutely no compassion whatsoever for the suffering of the Palestinians just reinforces my view of what should happen to the state of Israel. Unfortunately forum rules prevent me from posting those views.

The Palestinian Arabs stop declaring war and quit refusing peace deals, their suffering will be replaced by their own state.

"If the Arabs lay down their arms there will be no war. If Israel lays down its arms there will be no Israel"

That and The Palestinians cannot form a normal state. They cannot emigrate to Arab countries without accepting a catastrophic decline in living standards, and very few can emigrate to Western countries. The optimal solution for the Palestinians is to demand a state and blackmail Western and Arab donors with the threat of violence, but never actually get one.

"As long as all concerned understand that the comedy is not supposed to have an ending, the Palestinians can persist quite tolerably in their "intolerable" predicament. " Norman A Bailey

And they have to keep crying wolf to the liberal lefties in order to keep their "intolerable" living standards courtesy of the highest per capita aid in the world. When the Rafah crossing opens I wouldn't be surprised if a wave of Egyptian economic refugees descend on Gaza, which coming to think of it was how the mess started in the first place with Arab economic migrants settling in the British mandate lands.

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The vile pro Israel lobby that has raised it's ugly head on this forum, with absolutely no compassion whatsoever for the suffering of the Palestinians just reinforces my view of what should happen to the state of Israel. Unfortunately forum rules prevent me from posting those views.

The Palestinian Arabs stop declaring war and quit refusing peace deals, their suffering will be replaced by their own state.

"If the Arabs lay down their arms there will be no war. If Israel lays down its arms there will be no Israel"

That and The Palestinians cannot form a normal state. They cannot emigrate to Arab countries without accepting a catastrophic decline in living standards, and very few can emigrate to Western countries. The optimal solution for the Palestinians is to demand a state and blackmail Western and Arab donors with the threat of violence, but never actually get one.

"As long as all concerned understand that the comedy is not supposed to have an ending, the Palestinians can persist quite tolerably in their "intolerable" predicament. " Norman A Bailey

And they have to keep crying wolf to the liberal lefties in order to keep their "intolerable" living standards courtesy of the highest per capita aid in the world. When the Rafah crossing opens I wouldn't be surprised if a wave of Egyptian economic refugees descend on Gaza, which coming to think of it was how the mess started in the first place with Arab economic migrants settling in the British mandate lands.

Just look at the facts, Westbank has had its independence for years and yet all they do is continue living of the aid and demand more and more and more. They are not capable even dealing with what they have but already want more.

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The award winning documentary Occupation 101 - Voices of the Silenced Majority shows the oppression the Palestinians have been under at the hands of the Israelis.

I'm watching this on youtube atm. Certainly interesting viewing and, at least in my case, time consuming as I frequently stop it to do some fact checking. Whilst I never thought for one minute that Israel was without fault in this conflict, as some posters would have us believe, this documentary has opened my eyes wider.

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Back to the border crossing. It is unfortunate some of the "experts: are clueless as to what goes on at the Egyptian border crossing. The Palestinian arabs are basically harassed and shaken down by both the Egyptians and Hamas. It is "normal" for the Palestinian arbas to have to bribe both Hamas and Egyptian guards & officials to obtain passage.

It seems that some have conveniently forgotten that when the Egyptian crossing was open, Hamas regularly forbade Palestinian arabs from crossing. This is no big secret and one can read the litany of complaints if one does a google search. The inflated prices charged for basics on the Egyptian side of the border makes the Thai approach to double pricing seem kind and generous in comparison.

Lost in the discussion is that the Palestinian arabs would prefer to use the Israeli crossing(s). The reason is that the passage while annoying and at times considered humiliating, operates more efficiently and without the worry and cost of bribery and extortion on the Israeli side. The only ones demanding bribes or stealing as an acceptable practice are on the arab side of the crossing. The burden of corruption on the typical Palestinian arab is unimaginable to those that have not experienced it first hand. Not every Gaza resident is a terrorist and some just want to get on with their lives. Unfortunately, they are trapped in a place where the crazies run free.

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I really don't care if people drumming up war in the Middle east take offense.

Then perhaps you would have a word with Obama & Hillary ;)

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The vile pro Israel lobby that has raised it's ugly head on this forum, with absolutely no compassion whatsoever for the suffering of the Palestinians just reinforces my view of what should happen to the state of Israel. Unfortunately forum rules prevent me from posting those views.

You know, you really DIDN'T need to announce that. Anyone paying attention to your obvious hatred of everything Israel figured out what you want to happen to Israel LONG AGO. Yes, Virginia, reading between the lines isn't exactly rocket science with a poster like you. Well, time will tell, but in the meantime I am thinking of that famous Lily Allen song ...

Edited by Jingthing

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The award winning documentary Occupation 101 - Voices of the Silenced Majority shows the oppression the Palestinians have been under at the hands of the Israelis.

I'm watching this on youtube atm. Certainly interesting viewing and, at least in my case, time consuming as I frequently stop it to do some fact checking. Whilst I never thought for one minute that Israel was without fault in this conflict, as some posters would have us believe, this documentary has opened my eyes wider.

It is a moving documentary. Here is a link to the trailer on you tube Occupation 101 - Trailer

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More B.S. from the usual characters. It is kind of interesting that he is using the Jewish and Zionist sources that he always rails against when anyone else uses them. However, as usual, he is using passages out of context to distort history.

When Israel achieved its independence on May 14, 1948, the Haganah became the de facto Israeli army. On that day, the country was invaded by the regular forces of Egypt, Lebanon, Iraq, and Syria. Eleven days later, Israel's provisional government issued an order that provided the legal framework for the country's armed forces. The order established the official name Zvah Haganah Le Yisrael and outlawed the existence of any other military force within Israel. The dissident Irgun and Stern Gang were reluctant to disband. Fighting between Irgun and regular military forces broke out on June 21 when the supply ship Altalena arrived at Tel Aviv with 900 men and a load of arms and ammunition for the Irgun. The army sank the ship, destroying the arms, and many members of the Irgun were arrested; both organizations disbanded shortly thereafter.

http://www.onwar.com/aced/data/india/israel1948.htm

Irgun attacks prompted a formal declaration from the World Zionist Congress in 1946, which strongly condemned "the shedding of innocent blood as a means of political warfare."[63]

The Israeli government, in September 1948, acting in response to the assassination of Count Folke Bernadotte, outlawed the Irgun and Lehi groups, declaring them terrorist organizations under the Prevention of Terrorism Ordinance.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irgun

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Back to the border crossing. It is unfortunate some of the "experts: are clueless as to what goes on at the Egyptian border crossing. The Palestinian arabs are basically harassed and shaken down by both the Egyptians and Hamas. It is "normal" for the Palestinian arbas to have to bribe both Hamas and Egyptian guards & officials to obtain passage.

It seems that some have conveniently forgotten that when the Egyptian crossing was open, Hamas regularly forbade Palestinian arabs from crossing. This is no big secret and one can read the litany of complaints if one does a google search. The inflated prices charged for basics on the Egyptian side of the border makes the Thai approach to double pricing seem kind and generous in comparison.

Lost in the discussion is that the Palestinian arabs would prefer to use the Israeli crossing(s). The reason is that the passage while annoying and at times considered humiliating, operates more efficiently and without the worry and cost of bribery and extortion on the Israeli side. The only ones demanding bribes or stealing as an acceptable practice are on the arab side of the crossing. The burden of corruption on the typical Palestinian arab is unimaginable to those that have not experienced it first hand. Not every Gaza resident is a terrorist and some just want to get on with their lives. Unfortunately, they are trapped in a place where the crazies run free.

You are forgetting that a much better standard of behaviour is expected demanded from the Israelis. The Egyptian border guards and suppliers are lining their own pockets in the accepted way for Arabs in positions of authority. Hamas are doing likewise. You really need to receive far more aid than would otherwise be needed in order to compensate for this reality.

Edited by Steely Dan

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Anyone who followed the uprising knew this would happen as solidarity with Palestinians was the single unifying factor of the divers groups. That is equally true across the whole Arab and wider Muslim world. The people (maybe not the unelected governments) sympathise with the Palestinians and the uprisings mean even those hard regimes that survive will have to take this into account. One difference now is the level of solidarity is starting to spread into non-Muslim countries. There is a momentum for the Palestinians to get something not on terms dictated by others. This is also what has driven Fatah-Hamas reproachment as even they are aware of the way things are going and they have to move with the feeling.

Perfectly said.:thumbsup:

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This thread is not about the Irgun or Jerusalem. It is about Egypt's decision to announce the reopening of a crossing into Gaza..

If the Egyptians sympathize with the Palestinian arabs they will put an end to the shakedowns and forced bribes at the border crossing. And they will stop the price gouging by merchants.

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Many of the other posts made here do not seem to address the topic at hand and posts have been deleted. Given that, and the fact that many posters just cannot seem to be able to moderate themselves when it comes to these topics, it is time to close this thread as it is surely to continue to go off topic.

CLOSED

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