Thailand To Shed 'Sex Tourism' Tag Soon

[LTGTR]

The title of this thread is hilarious.It will NEVER change.

[nikster]

Maybe if they bulldozer Pattaya...

One thing's for sure though with the rise of Asia tourism in general is going to be Asian, and it's going to be very different from western tourism. For one, dark ladies do nothing for Asian gentlemen.

But that's just an aside - Asian tourists are prone to come in large groups and do weird group-toury-things. That's miles away from backpackers or sexpats or even Euro families. It's a completely different market. And it's going to be the biggest growth sector in Thai tourism for years to come. Simply because Chinese and to some extent other Asians are becoming more wealthy, and it's close, and it's a great tourism country.

A Chinese friend of mine who was born in California but now moved to Shanghai went on a tour group to Thailand. He's a normal dude, I can only assume he became very Chinese to go on a tour group in the first place. But anyway, he told me they went to Pattaya and he thought all the girls are really ugly.

All in all Thai tourism is changing, I am with @tlansford: It's a case of taking your flag and getting in front of the parade.

[chivo]

Or could just reduce it to start... Like the sale of alcohol law.. No prostitution between 2 and 5 pm...

[phuketrichard]

A recent World Health Organisation (WHO) report has pegged the number of female prostitutes in the country at 2 lakh.

can someone enlighten me? how much is 2 lakh.?

thaisabai

I was wondering the same - but chickened out about asking in case it was obvious and I was being ignorant or stupid in enquiring when everyone else knew what it means !!!!

200,000 and i would say thats a very conservative estimate. when the US Navy is in Pattaya they probaly get 1/2 a lakh!!

[rubl]

I think it's worth noting that not once did the quoted Thai diplomat refer to sex, the sex industry, sex tourism or anything else remotely sexual to do with Thailand or anywhere else. That all came from the author of the article.

The diplomat did refer to Thailand's reputation and the fact that making it more amenable to visiting families is on the agenda, but that isn't necessarily the same as saying anything at all concerned with sex. Maybe he was referring to improved safety and activities for families within the Thai tourism industry.

Oh well, whatever gets people chatting.....

Put emphasize on diplomat. Those who know how to tell you to go to hell with you not being offended and actually looking forward to go there

'We are slowly changing the perception of Thailand' from non-family oriented to family oriented. We have set up a commission which will investigate how scam artists can make the transition without too much difficulty. In a few months time we expect to be able to set up training sessions to help maximising profits by emphasizing attention on the junior members of families, those who influence both spending pattern and level

[paulian]

All joking aside, I was told something this morning that really pee'd me off. A girl from our village who regularly visited our shop with her friends has just been packed off to Pattaya while her ' responsible ' parents lounge around at home jobless drinking 40 degrees Thai whisky and gambling away what baht they have. What's wrong with that did I hear someone say ? Well, she's JUST had her fourteenth birthday -- that's what's wrong. As long as people like this send a schoolgirl to ' work ' in Pattaya, how will Thailand shed it's seedy image ?

The Thai's have been sending there 8-18 year old's to the city for as long as I can remember back to 1968. Not saying it's right, just saying it will never change here or in any other country with poor economic conditions for the majority of it's population. It's not good to try and judge another Countries culture and mores when there are so many things you think you know, but really, you can never understand unless your in their shoes. We are just visitors here. What appears to is happening at their homes with there families, probably isn't. Sometimes you have to do what's wrong to get good. Nothing gives us the right to judge them, unless you've lived a perfect life, which few people are able to in these times.

Edited August 20, 2011 by paulian

[moe666]

Actually the world doesn't revolve around Soi 4 in Bangkok, walking street in pattaya, and what ever beach in Phuket. The western folks are not the ones coming so much anymore. It is the chinese and Indians as well as other asians.

In 1998 my first trip back in 25 years soi 4 was packed wall to wall with punters even early in the morning now night time is like morning use to be. Many girls setting around with out customers. Went into Hillary Beer Bar to shoot pool only 4 punters and that was in january high season.

Years back Bangkok Post did a great story about the working girls of Thailand and at that time about 10 years ago they estimated 60,000girls working Thai on Thai and 30,000 working Thai on falange, this was country wide. This would have been during one of the busiest periods of Thai tourism

Edited August 20, 2011 by moe666

[Basil B]

Which first?

Hell Freeze Over

Pigs Will Fly

Thailand shed it "Sex Tourism" Tag

or Thaksin to come home and serve his punishment

[paulian]

Which first?

Hell Freeze Over

Pigs Will Fly

Thailand shed it "Sex Tourism" Tag

or Thaksin to come home and serve his punishment

Not Fair ! This is a trick question ...... I say B. Pigs will fly.

[kraplung]

Soon? That's a bit ambitious!

I think you can file this krap in the same bin as 'I can cure Bangkok's traffic problems in six months' and 'No more drugs in Thailand in three months'. Can't wait to hear how quickly they will stop Thais gambling.

[OzMick]

Pattaya is the place that has given Thailand the bad reputation as the sex capital of the world. Why don't they start by bulldozing and cleaning that place up. Start arresting and charging the bargirls working in prostitution and thier clients send out a very clear and positive message to the sex tourists that this illegal act will no longer be tolerated. The sex tourists will stop comming after they starting spending time in the BKK Hilton. (Prostitution is after all illegal)

"Arresting and charging" is usually performed by the police, and that is unlikely to happen in Patts while the BIB enjoy much of their income from the girls and the bars where they are found. So you are really talking about a major cultural change about on par with cleaning the Augean stables (best add that I am NOT comparing the residents of Pattaya with horse excrement).

It would be a far simpler task to simply move yourself to somewhere that suits your requirements; but the choice is yours.

[edko]

I took my two boys (7 & 11 years old at the time) to Thailand for two months a couple years back, and they loved it. In addition to the family fun like elephant treks etc., we all got massages every day (no happy endings for the boys obviously), played pool in many a beer bar and hung out with lots of friendly professional ladies. Without exception, the ladies loved the boys as if they were their own, buying them food and drinks etc. One of the best aspects of the LOS in my view is the lack of differentiation between what is "adult" and what is "family." Within certain common-sense boundaries, of course, (I would no more want my kids exposed to pornography or violence than any other father), one of the nicest things about Thailand is its tolerant, accepting attitude to the realities of sexuality and not labeling it as "bad." It would be a shame to see that actually threatened.

I believe that the majority of the posters who seem to believe that 'sex tourists' constitute the majority of the tourist traffic to Thailand are themselves so biased and isolated that they can only see Thailand through their own small prism of what is their own jaded reality. If they were to speak to normal people outside of Thailand they might find that there are tremendous numbers of tourists who have been to Thailand who have a completely different perception of the LOS and found it to be one of the most delightful places in the world due primarily to the hospitality of the Thai people. It is a very long flight from the USA to Thailand, yet older couples in their 50's and on up that I know personally have traveled to Thailand and find it a place they would like to visit again and not one of them ever broached the topic of sex tourism as they were the type of people who were totally ignorant of it.

I have a Vietnamese friend who works as a hospitality trainer to several 5 star hotels in Vietnam who just yesterday told me about reciprocal tourist arrangements where a Vietnamese can fly to BKK from Saigon and stay 5 nights in 5 star hotels for US $200 and that the more well to do Vietnamese who want plastic surgery go to Thailand for their procedures. He told me that the hotels that he works for have so many Thai tourists that they consciously have added a huge selection of Thai dishes to the menus in their restaurants.

On the last 2 trips I made to Thailand, I saw very few single males in the cabin on my flight. On the first flight, the majority of the passengers were Asian families with small children and couples and of the Caucasians, there were groups of youths and adults traveling to do missionary work. On the second trip I sat next to a Thai lady traveling back to visit relatives in Udonthani and in our conversations never once made an aspersion that I might be traveling to BKK only to experience the sex trade (which has never been my motivation for acquiring a retirement visa).

Believe it or not, there really are tremendous numbers of normal people who find a ride on an elephant a memorable life experience on the magnitude of a trip to, and preferable to a western theme park like Disneyland. There really are tremendous numbers of foreign couples who want to experience the exotic culture, but mostly, the well deserved reputation of Thailand as having probably the most friendly and helpful people of any people they have experienced. One couple I know in their 50's fell in love with a young lady in Chiang Mai who worked in their hotel restaurant and offered to sponsor her, live with them, and even pay for her tuition and these people are not swingers and the young lady was not offering sexual favors.

There really are more people who see Thailand through a positive prism than so many of the misreble posters to this forum who have such negative impressions and evidently see all Thai women as scheming hos from Issan.

[starkey_rich]

Just don't let the families use a jet ski or a tuk tuk in Phuket.They may get more than they bargained for.

[Johpa]

Anyway, I came to realize that the place that cater to foreign sexpats are usually run by foreigners.

So lets get rid of these first, then we see what's left

As others have noted, the vast majority of the "trade", about 90%, caters to the domestic and regional market although the foreign market is the most visible. Locals are not willing to be seen in public flirting with hookers and the signage outside the locally oriented establishments are rather subtle but clear to those in the know, which is clearly not the ex-pat community.

But nothing will change as long as local politics is based upon the generation and distribution of cash and that leaves those in control of illegal cash operations such as, and I borrow the phrase from Achaan Pasuk, "Guns, Girls, Gambling, Ganja", as well as smuggling. These are the industries that year after year generate the politics in Thailand.

[Gillespie]

A recent World Health Organisation (WHO) report has pegged the number of female prostitutes in the country at 2 lakh.

can someone enlighten me? how much is 2 lakh.?

thaisabai

2 lakh = 200,000

[moto77]

Here is a free tip for Thailand. In Las Vegas , Nevada, the city " leaders" decided they did not want the reputation for the city to be sin and gambling. They then tried to redo all publicity to push for family tourism. Revenues fell WAY off, they came to their senses, and the new promotion became" what goes on in Vegas stays in Vegas". Thailand can certainly do whatever it wants, but if it kills off the sex trade just be sure to have regular jobs for all the girls from Issan...... This kind of government social engineering is made all the more funny by the fact that 80 to 90 percent of the sex trade is for the benefit of and used by Thai men. But I suppose that segment will not be going away.

On a side note, if they really do want family tourism, the government is going to have to do something about the endless scams. Those do not go well with families. Kids watching their dad get beaten up by jet ski thugs could have a detrimental effect on future families visiting......

That's not entirely correct.

First, while family tourism never took off in Vegas, gambling tourism never declined. Profitability from gaming actually increased throughout the 90s, hence all of the building that occurred during that period.

Second, prostitution is NOT legal in Las Vegas, and the laws are enforced rather strictly. Prostitution IS legal just outside Reno, yet comparatively few tourists go there.

Third, Las Vegas is a gambling town and Bangkok, Phuket, etc. are not. While we all know Thailand has a few casinos, few tourists know about them, let alone venture inside. It's hard to make a gaming town into a family destination.

Fourth, good point about the scams. They need to hide some undercover farang officers to act as tourists and run a few stings.

[meelousee]

Bad mistake. But TOT never thinks before they dive in

[Thakkar]

All joking aside, I was told something this morning that really pee'd me off. A girl from our village who regularly visited our shop with her friends has just been packed off to Pattaya while her ' responsible ' parents lounge around at home jobless drinking 40 degrees Thai whisky and gambling away what baht they have. What's wrong with that did I hear someone say ? Well, she's JUST had her fourteenth birthday -- that's what's wrong. As long as people like this send a schoolgirl to ' work ' in Pattaya, how will Thailand shed it's seedy image ?

The Thai's have been sending there 8-18 year old's to the city for as long as I can remember back to 1968. Not saying it's right, just saying it will never change here or in any other country with poor economic conditions for the majority of it's population. It's not good to try and judge another Countries culture and mores when there are so many things you think you know, but really, you can never understand unless your in their shoes. We are just visitors here. What appears to is happening at their homes with there families, probably isn't. Sometimes you have to do what's wrong to get good. Nothing gives us the right to judge them, unless you've lived a perfect life, which few people are able to in these times.

In Thai culture, sending a 14-year-old to work in the sex trade is wrong and illegal. Hell, taking 14-year-old out of school is wrong and illegal. A 14-year-old cannot vote, get a driver's license, or marry (without parental AND court consent).

So parents sending their 14-year-old to work in the sex trade *must* be judged and condemned. Cultural relativism does not apply.

T

[kraplung]

I may be family man now but I am no innocent abroad either. You find 'fun towns' all over the world but Pattaya is beyond the pale..... a complete toilet with no redeeming features at all.

[meelousee]

Here is a free tip for Thailand. In Las Vegas , Nevada, the city " leaders" decided they did not want the reputation for the city to be sin and gambling. They then tried to redo all publicity to push for family tourism. Revenues fell WAY off, they came to their senses, and the new promotion became" what goes on in Vegas stays in Vegas". Thailand can certainly do whatever it wants, but if it kills off the sex trade just be sure to have regular jobs for all the girls from Issan...... This kind of government social engineering is made all the more funny by the fact that 80 to 90 percent of the sex trade is for the benefit of and used by Thai men. But I suppose that segment will not be going away.

On a side note, if they really do want family tourism, the government is going to have to do something about the endless scams. Those do not go well with families. Kids watching their dad get beaten up by jet ski thugs could have a detrimental effect on future families visiting......

It is called Prozac ask your doctor soon

That's not entirely correct.

First, while family tourism never took off in Vegas, gambling tourism never declined. Profitability from gaming actually increased throughout the 90s, hence all of the building that occurred during that period.

Second, prostitution is NOT legal in Las Vegas, and the laws are enforced rather strictly. Prostitution IS legal just outside Reno, yet comparatively few tourists go there.

Third, Las Vegas is a gambling town and Bangkok, Phuket, etc. are not. While we all know Thailand has a few casinos, few tourists know about them, let alone venture inside. It's hard to make a gaming town into a family destination.

Fourth, good point about the scams. They need to hide some undercover farang officers to act as tourists and run a few stings.

[khaowong1]

Kids watching their dad get beaten up by jet ski thugs could have a detrimental effect on future families visiting......

[Sparkles]

Hold on what's wrong with a family day at the local massage parlour ?

[jimky]

I took my two boys (7 & 11 years old at the time) to Thailand for two months a couple years back, and they loved it. In addition to the family fun like elephant treks etc., we all got massages every day (no happy endings for the boys obviously), played pool in many a beer bar and hung out with lots of friendly professional ladies. Without exception, the ladies loved the boys as if they were their own, buying them food and drinks etc. One of the best aspects of the LOS in my view is the lack of differentiation between what is "adult" and what is "family." Within certain common-sense boundaries, of course, (I would no more want my kids exposed to pornography or violence than any other father), one of the nicest things about Thailand is its tolerant, accepting attitude to the realities of sexuality and not labeling it as "bad." It would be a shame to see that actually threatened.

I believe that the majority of the posters who seem to believe that 'sex tourists' constitute the majority of the tourist traffic to Thailand are themselves so biased and isolated that they can only see Thailand through their own small prism of what is their own jaded reality. If they were to speak to normal people outside of Thailand they might find that there are tremendous numbers of tourists who have been to Thailand who have a completely different perception of the LOS and found it to be one of the most delightful places in the world due primarily to the hospitality of the Thai people. It is a very long flight from the USA to Thailand, yet older couples in their 50's and on up that I know personally have traveled to Thailand and find it a place they would like to visit again and not one of them ever broached the topic of sex tourism as they were the type of people who were totally ignorant of it.

I have a Vietnamese friend who works as a hospitality trainer to several 5 star hotels in Vietnam who just yesterday told me about reciprocal tourist arrangements where a Vietnamese can fly to BKK from Saigon and stay 5 nights in 5 star hotels for US $200 and that the more well to do Vietnamese who want plastic surgery go to Thailand for their procedures. He told me that the hotels that he works for have so many Thai tourists that they consciously have added a huge selection of Thai dishes to the menus in their restaurants.

On the last 2 trips I made to Thailand, I saw very few single males in the cabin on my flight. On the first flight, the majority of the passengers were Asian families with small children and couples and of the Caucasians, there were groups of youths and adults traveling to do missionary work. On the second trip I sat next to a Thai lady traveling back to visit relatives in Udonthani and in our conversations never once made an aspersion that I might be traveling to BKK only to experience the sex trade (which has never been my motivation for acquiring a retirement visa).

Believe it or not, there really are tremendous numbers of normal people who find a ride on an elephant a memorable life experience on the magnitude of a trip to, and preferable to a western theme park like Disneyland. There really are tremendous numbers of foreign couples who want to experience the exotic culture, but mostly, the well deserved reputation of Thailand as having probably the most friendly and helpful people of any people they have experienced. One couple I know in their 50's fell in love with a young lady in Chiang Mai who worked in their hotel restaurant and offered to sponsor her, live with them, and even pay for her tuition and these people are not swingers and the young lady was not offering sexual favors.

There really are more people who see Thailand through a positive prism than so many of the misreble posters to this forum who have such negative impressions and evidently see all Thai women as scheming hos from Issan.

Great post. I've experienced pretty much the same the same thing. I've just spent the past month touring Thailand with my three kinds 6 month baby, 11 year, old, 12 year old and we had an awesome time. I watched Elephants paint (good paintings), read a ton of ton Thai history, visited temples, relaxed on awesome beaches, it was incredible experiance and we were all over the place. Kallasin, Khon Kaen, Udon Thani, Nong Khai, Bangkok, Chiang Mai, Phuket 5 fights and dozens hours in a rented van. This is awesome country for families to visit. I've lived here for two years and can honestly say imo Thailand is the greatest country in the world and I've never been in a bar girl or paid sex before so that's certainly has nothing to do with. As far as some earlier posts about what Thailand offers to family tourist: man SOOO much, sad for anyone living here that is blind enough not to notice what an awesome country this is.

[Grove]

A recent World Health Organisation (WHO) report has pegged the number of female prostitutes in the country at 2 lakh.

can someone enlighten me? how much is 2 lakh.?

thaisabai

Spelling mistake I guess. I Think it should be La'an. That is 2 Mil. Another mistake I would say is that you can dubble that figure.

[wlcart]

All joking aside, I was told something this morning that really pee'd me off. A girl from our village who regularly visited our shop with her friends has just been packed off to Pattaya while her ' responsible ' parents lounge around at home jobless drinking 40 degrees Thai whisky and gambling away what baht they have. What's wrong with that did I hear someone say ? Well, she's JUST had her fourteenth birthday -- that's what's wrong. As long as people like this send a schoolgirl to ' work ' in Pattaya, how will Thailand shed it's seedy image ?

The Thai's have been sending there 8-18 year old's to the city for as long as I can remember back to 1968. Not saying it's right, just saying it will never change here or in any other country with poor economic conditions for the majority of it's population. It's not good to try and judge another Countries culture and mores when there are so many things you think you know, but really, you can never understand unless your in their shoes. We are just visitors here. What appears to is happening at their homes with there families, probably isn't. Sometimes you have to do what's wrong to get good. Nothing gives us the right to judge them, unless you've lived a perfect life, which few people are able to in these times.

Not judging anyone, but sending minors to work in the sex industry is not a good thing. My wife's family is Issan and as poor as they come and they would never dream of sending one of their girls to work on their back.

I totally agree that we should not judge, and walking in other's shoes is always an important consideration, i just want to emphasize that the poor have the same ability as the rich to do the right thing.

Poor or not, a parent's fundamental responsibility is to protect their children and certainly not exploit them.

[harrycallahan]

Another nail in the coffin....

:-)

[kraplung]

Hold on what's wrong with a family day at the local massage parlour ?

I'm sure Thailand's new deputy leader would agree with you!

[kenmackie]

A recent World Health Organisation (WHO) report has pegged the number of female prostitutes in the country at 2 lakh.

can someone enlighten me? how much is 2 lakh.?

thaisabai

"A lakh (play /ˈlæk/ lak or /ˈlɑːk/ lahk; also lac) is a unit in the Indian numbering system equal to one hundred thousand (100,000; 105). It is widely used both in official and other contexts in Bangladesh, India, Maldives, Nepal, Sri Lanka, Myanmar and Pakistan, and is often used in Indian English."

Why would the thr "WHO" in their infinite wisdom, report currency in lakh?? 2 lahk sounds a little too much like tee luk.I'll call bs on this breaking news story

[balo]

So many Russian families visiting Pattaya these days that I almost forget its a sex city.....

Family vacation or sex vacation . Who cares as long as Thais will make a profit from it. .

[SICHONSTEVE]

I took my two boys (7 & 11 years old at the time) to Thailand for two months a couple years back, and they loved it. In addition to the family fun like elephant treks etc., we all got massages every day (no happy endings for the boys obviously), played pool in many a beer bar and hung out with lots of friendly professional ladies. Without exception, the ladies loved the boys as if they were their own, buying them food and drinks etc. One of the best aspects of the LOS in my view is the lack of differentiation between what is "adult" and what is "family." Within certain common-sense boundaries, of course, (I would no more want my kids exposed to pornography or violence than any other father), one of the nicest things about Thailand is its tolerant, accepting attitude to the realities of sexuality and not labeling it as "bad." It would be a shame to see that actually threatened.

I believe that the majority of the posters who seem to believe that 'sex tourists' constitute the majority of the tourist traffic to Thailand are themselves so biased and isolated that they can only see Thailand through their own small prism of what is their own jaded reality. If they were to speak to normal people outside of Thailand they might find that there are tremendous numbers of tourists who have been to Thailand who have a completely different perception of the LOS and found it to be one of the most delightful places in the world due primarily to the hospitality of the Thai people. It is a very long flight from the USA to Thailand, yet older couples in their 50's and on up that I know personally have traveled to Thailand and find it a place they would like to visit again and not one of them ever broached the topic of sex tourism as they were the type of people who were totally ignorant of it.

I have a Vietnamese friend who works as a hospitality trainer to several 5 star hotels in Vietnam who just yesterday told me about reciprocal tourist arrangements where a Vietnamese can fly to BKK from Saigon and stay 5 nights in 5 star hotels for US $200 and that the more well to do Vietnamese who want plastic surgery go to Thailand for their procedures. He told me that the hotels that he works for have so many Thai tourists that they consciously have added a huge selection of Thai dishes to the menus in their restaurants.

On the last 2 trips I made to Thailand, I saw very few single males in the cabin on my flight. On the first flight, the majority of the passengers were Asian families with small children and couples and of the Caucasians, there were groups of youths and adults traveling to do missionary work. On the second trip I sat next to a Thai lady traveling back to visit relatives in Udonthani and in our conversations never once made an aspersion that I might be traveling to BKK only to experience the sex trade (which has never been my motivation for acquiring a retirement visa).

Believe it or not, there really are tremendous numbers of normal people who find a ride on an elephant a memorable life experience on the magnitude of a trip to, and preferable to a western theme park like Disneyland. There really are tremendous numbers of foreign couples who want to experience the exotic culture, but mostly, the well deserved reputation of Thailand as having probably the most friendly and helpful people of any people they have experienced. One couple I know in their 50's fell in love with a young lady in Chiang Mai who worked in their hotel restaurant and offered to sponsor her, live with them, and even pay for her tuition and these people are not swingers and the young lady was not offering sexual favors.

There really are more people who see Thailand through a positive prism than so many of the misreble posters to this forum who have such negative impressions and evidently see all Thai women as scheming hos from Issan.

Great post. I've experienced pretty much the same the same thing. I've just spent the past month touring Thailand with my three kinds 6 month baby, 11 year, old, 12 year old and we had an awesome time. I watched Elephants paint (good paintings), read a ton of ton Thai history, visited temples, relaxed on awesome beaches, it was incredible experiance and we were all over the place. Kallasin, Khon Kaen, Udon Thani, Nong Khai, Bangkok, Chiang Mai, Phuket 5 fights and dozens hours in a rented van. This is awesome country for families to visit. I've lived here for two years and can honestly say imo Thailand is the greatest country in the world and I've never been in a bar girl or paid sex before so that's certainly has nothing to do with. As far as some earlier posts about what Thailand offers to family tourist: man SOOO much, sad for anyone living here that is blind enough not to notice what an awesome country this is.

Maybe!!! but this thread is about Pattaya (not specifically admitted, but it IS the capital of the sex-trade in Thailand) and unless you have been there you wouldn't have seen the seedier side of Thailand!!!!

Edited August 20, 2011 by SICHONSTEVE