Northern Bangkok Under Threat

[Lite Beer]

Northern Bangkok under threat

The Nation on Sunday

Urgent plan to extend khlong as huge volume of water flows down from Ayutthaya; Nava Nakorn estate readies defences

Pathum Thani province and the northern part of Bangkok are now at risk of flooding as a huge amount of water from the Chao Phraya River and run-off from Ayutthaya and other flooded provinces flows southward.

The Nava Nakorn Industrial Estate and Rangsit area could be inundated if the huge amount of water is not properly diverted.

As a result, the Flood Relief Operations Command (FROC) has suggested there should be an urgent move to dig Klong Rapipat (South), covering a length of 3.5 km, to divert the water into the sea.

Pracha Promnok, the FROC chairman, said Public Health Minister Wittaya Buranasiri had been assigned to talk with villagers in Ayutthaya's Wang Noi district about this urgent measure so as to properly drain off an estimated 200 million cubic metres of floodwater.

Meanwhile, the Bang Pa-In Industrial Estate in Ayutthaya was flooded yesterday. It is the fourth industrial park to be hit by massive flooding.

Bang Pa-In industrial estate has a total of 90 factories and 40,000 workers.

However, it is smaller than the Nava Nakorn Industrial Estate in Pathum Thani province, which is one of Thailand's largest industrial parks.

Nava Nakorn is home to 227 factories covering a combined area of 8,000 rai. A total of 180,000 workers are employed at this sprawling industrial park whose combined investment is estimated to top Bt100 billion.

In addition, there are more than 30,000 households with over 100,000 residents around the Nava Nakorn estate.

Gen Prayuth Chan-ocha, the Army commander-in-chief, and Lerk-kiat Kaew-srichan, the deputy governor of Pathum Thani, yesterday joined the top management of Nava Nakorn to map out plans to help the industrial park avoid inundation as a massive amount of flood water flows downstream from Ayutthaya.

In Ayutthaya, Rojana, High-Tech (Bang Wa), Saharattana and Bang Pa-in industrial parks have already been swamped due to the unprecedented amount of water released from overloaded dams.

To try to prevent the Nava Nakorn estate from being inundated, officials yesterday reinforced the industrial park's northern area with more piling as the protection wall is at risk of being breached if the water rises by another 30cm.

They also reinforced the park's western and southern areas with an additional 100,000 sandbags.

Gen Prayuth said authorities had earlier faced a big challenge in preventing Rojana, High-Tech and Saharattana industrial estates going under the water largely because the amount of flood water was enormous.

"Nava Nakorn is next but this industrial estate is very well-prepared and if it succeeds in withstanding the force of the water it would be a good example [on how to cope with this kind of critical situation]."

"The government has focussed on helping big industrial parks because tens of thousands of people work in those places. If they are out of work for six to seven months, it would be a big problem due to the lack of income for their families," he said.

The government has been following HM the King's initiatives on flood water management. It was doing the utmost to discharge the water into the Gulf of Thailand as quickly as possible to alleviate hardship as more than 14 provinces in the Central region had been flooded, Gen Prayuth said.

Nipit Arunvongse Na Ayudhya, managing director of estate operator Nava Nakorn Plc, said yesterday that the park was located on the highest ground in Pathum Thani.

If the estate was flooded, the whole province would be flooded. The estate also had barriers that were 5 metres to 5.5 metres high.

Of the 270 firms in the park, 20 per cent have suspended operations, as suppliers in the flooded industrial zones cannot get components to them. The other 80 per cent were operating as usual. Major investors in the estate include Toshiba, which has a hard-disk drive plant, plus Kubota, Nestle and Oishi.

-- The Nation 2011-10-16

[KKvampire]

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

[RichardinBKK]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

[Credo]

When Man vs. Mother Nature, Man loses. The question is how much or how little is lost.

[Pomthai]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Tethering of boats to the river banks with their engines running & supposedly speeding it up. Hmm clever and frankly working

[EvilDrSomkid]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Well said.

NO preparation? Not true. A joke? No, look at the hundreds of people going to flooded areas to help.

Although the authorities could have done more to prevent flooding, I am actually surprised they have been holding up this well. Keep in mind that 16 BILLION CBM of water is on the way South. The effort required to deal with that amount of water is a major challenge for any country.

I am from Norway, but have lived in Holland for most of my life. I have seen a little of what it takes to deal with massive amounts of water.

[wallswod]

PomThai: "Tethering of boats to the river banks with their engines running & supposedly speeding it up. Hmm clever and frankly working "

Hi 5 !!!!!! The funniest thing about that was that the authorities were serous.

Why didn't the science minister just move the moon so there are no large tides this week?

ThaiVisa news updates said: "PM presides over launch of 1,028 boats helping to speed up water drainage out to sea at Phra Nangklao Bridge at 10am/ TAN_Network " This from 10mins ago !!!!

Edited October 16, 2011 by wallswod

[Scott]

One post with altered quote has been removed. If you are quoting another post, please make your remarks outside the quote.

Please use the standard fonts and colors and stay on-topic.

[chinook]

Ah, I see the forum hostilities have started on this fine Sunday morning! What is it with some of you guys? I swear, sometimes it's like reading transcripts of conversations between grumpy old men in a care home!

<br>I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country*  Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view.  In <font face="sans-serif"><font size="2"><b>Hurricane Katrina</b></font></font> <font face="sans-serif"><font size="2">1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded </font></font><font face="sans-serif"><font size="2">$81 billion.  Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf.  Perhaps the UK?  OMG...where to begin?</font></font><br><font face="sans-serif"><font size="2"><br></font></font><br><font face="sans-serif"><font size="2">The question is, "Who are you to judge?"  By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about.  Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?</font></font><br><br><br>

<br>The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent<br>

<br><br><br><br>

<br><br><br> Edited October 16, 2011 by chinook

[siampolee]

Let's see if this works.

Come all of you the cabinet needs to observe the Science minister and the implementation of his power in the upcoming ritual.

Ooop's , we seem to have failed.

[rojack45]

Bravo! Richard in BKK. Excellent response to a typical uninformed, ego-centric poster. Your sarcasm in this sentence is perfect! "Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view"

I am a retired Canadian living in BKK for the past 8 months and I am amused and dismayed daily by some of the self-righteous judgements and criticisms posted in this and other forums.

Thank you

Rojack - Happy in Bangkok

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

[qualtrough]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Well said.

NO preparation? Not true. A joke? No, look at the hundreds of people going to flooded areas to help.

Although the authorities could have done more to prevent flooding, I am actually surprised they have been holding up this well. Keep in mind that 16 BILLION CBM of water is on the way South. The effort required to deal with that amount of water is a major challenge for any country.

I am from Norway, but have lived in Holland for most of my life. I have seen a little of what it takes to deal with massive amounts of water.

The critics here just hate the new government and undoubtedly feel that Thaksin is somehow ultimately responsible. It would not matter if Yingluck was able to walk across the troubled waters and make them evaporate, heal the lame and halt, and change water into wine, they would still complain that her brother told her to do that for some nefarious reason, and anyway Mark would have been able to do all that much earlier. For some unknown reason, the percentage of foaming-at-the-mouth Thaksin haters is far, far higher among TV members than it is amongst the Thai population. I suspect that where that horrific, evil monster Mr. T got off on the wrong foot with them is the early bar closings.

/ I Was not at all a fan of Thaksin while he was in power, but feel a certain amount of sympathy for him the more I learn about his enemies.

Edited October 16, 2011 by qualtrough

[saengsureeya]

I'm from Holland and the Dutch seem to be the experts on water management. The Crown Prince is Holland's top water-manager; however.........after protecting Holland from the powers of the North Sea by building the Delta-works, the country was flooded 2 times over the last 10 years by water from............yes the rivers Rhine and Maas transporting water from Switzerland, France and Germany. The water-defense wasn't working!!

[EvilDrSomkid]

I'm from Holland and the Dutch seem to be the experts on water management. The Crown Prince is Holland's top water-manager; however.........after protecting Holland from the powers of the North Sea by building the Delta-works, the country was flooded 2 times over the last 10 years by water from............yes the rivers Rhine and Maas transporting water from Switzerland, France and Germany. The water-defense wasn't working!!

Not quite true. They worked for a while, but were breached. Since the Christmas flooding in 1995/96, they have invested heavily to try to prevent this happening again.

[philw]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Well said.

NO preparation? Not true. A joke? No, look at the hundreds of people going to flooded areas to help.

Although the authorities could have done more to prevent flooding, I am actually surprised they have been holding up this well. Keep in mind that 16 BILLION CBM of water is on the way South. The effort required to deal with that amount of water is a major challenge for any country.

I am from Norway, but have lived in Holland for most of my life. I have seen a little of what it takes to deal with massive amounts of water.

The critics here just hate the new government and undoubtedly feel that Thaksin is somehow ultimately responsible. It would not matter if Yingluck was able to walk across the troubled waters and make them evaporate, heal the lame and halt, and change water into wine, they would still complain that her brother told her to do that for some nefarious reason, and anyway Mark would have been able to do all that much earlier. For some unknown reason, the percentage of foaming-at-the-mouth Thaksin haters is far, far higher among TV members than it is amongst the Thai population. I suspect that where that horrific, evil monster Mr. T got off on the wrong foot with them is the early bar closings.

/ I Was not at all a fan of Thaksin while he was in power, but feel a certain amount of sympathy for him the more I learn about his enemies.

Well said

[robblok]

I'm from Holland and the Dutch seem to be the experts on water management. The Crown Prince is Holland's top water-manager; however.........after protecting Holland from the powers of the North Sea by building the Delta-works, the country was flooded 2 times over the last 10 years by water from............yes the rivers Rhine and Maas transporting water from Switzerland, France and Germany. The water-defense wasn't working!!

Not quite true. They worked for a while, but were breached. Since the Christmas flooding in 1995/96, they have invested heavily to try to prevent this happening again.

You cannot even compare the Dutch floods with these. The Dutch were prepared, only like in Thailand they let ppl live in the wrong places. The government reacted decisive, people who knew where in place. Not cronies like here in Thailand.

[Bkkorupcountry]

Bravo! Richard in BKK. Excellent response to a typical uninformed, ego-centric poster. Your sarcasm in this sentence is perfect! "Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view"

I am a retired Canadian living in BKK for the past 8 months and I am amused and dismayed daily by some of the self-righteous judgements and criticisms posted in this and other forums.

Thank you

Rojack - Happy in Bangkok

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Welcome rojack, and good first post. Unfortunately, you are going to be more than just dismayed after reading the posts of the anti Govt posters here. As another poster mentioned, "the percentage of foaming-at-the-mouth Thaksin haters is far, far higher among TV members than it is amongst the Thai population." I actually suspect that this is not the case, but instead, these posters have nothing better to do with their time, being retired and bored out of their little minds, unable to properly integrate into the Thai society and thus spend the whole day digging up material to support their anti-Govt stance. A large proportion of TV members (myself included) could not be bothered to rise to the bait or to respond to their trolling posts.

[hanuman1]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Well said.

NO preparation? Not true. A joke? No, look at the hundreds of people going to flooded areas to help.

Although the authorities could have done more to prevent flooding, I am actually surprised they have been holding up this well. Keep in mind that 16 BILLION CBM of water is on the way South. The effort required to deal with that amount of water is a major challenge for any country.

I am from Norway, but have lived in Holland for most of my life. I have seen a little of what it takes to deal with massive amounts of water.

The critics here just hate the new government and undoubtedly feel that Thaksin is somehow ultimately responsible. It would not matter if Yingluck was able to walk across the troubled waters and make them evaporate, heal the lame and halt, and change water into wine, they would still complain that her brother told her to do that for some nefarious reason, and anyway Mark would have been able to do all that much earlier. For some unknown reason, the percentage of foaming-at-the-mouth Thaksin haters is far, far higher among TV members than it is amongst the Thai population. I suspect that where that horrific, evil monster Mr. T got off on the wrong foot with them is the early bar closings.

/ I Was not at all a fan of Thaksin while he was in power, but feel a certain amount of sympathy for him the more I learn about his enemies.

Well said indeed.

[backtonormal]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Well said.

NO preparation? Not true. A joke? No, look at the hundreds of people going to flooded areas to help.

Although the authorities could have done more to prevent flooding, I am actually surprised they have been holding up this well. Keep in mind that 16 BILLION CBM of water is on the way South. The effort required to deal with that amount of water is a major challenge for any country.

I am from Norway, but have lived in Holland for most of my life. I have seen a little of what it takes to deal with massive amounts of water.

The critics here just hate the new government and undoubtedly feel that Thaksin is somehow ultimately responsible. It would not matter if Yingluck was able to walk across the troubled waters and make them evaporate, heal the lame and halt, and change water into wine, they would still complain that her brother told her to do that for some nefarious reason, and anyway Mark would have been able to do all that much earlier. For some unknown reason, the percentage of foaming-at-the-mouth Thaksin haters is far, far higher among TV members than it is amongst the Thai population. I suspect that where that horrific, evil monster Mr. T got off on the wrong foot with them is the early bar closings.

/ I Was not at all a fan of Thaksin while he was in power, but feel a certain amount of sympathy for him the more I learn about his enemies.

+1 it often seems like a scripted campaign to turn every thread, yes every thread, into a turkey shoot on Thaksin. Its as if somebody is funding the campaign of hatred. Most posters have seen thru this but I dont think the offenders have. Whatever anti Thaksin tripe is posted here what must be understood is that we cannot influence Thais as proved by the amount of times he keeps getting re-elected (regardless of convictions under a military, invisible hand controlled judiciary))

A few out of touch posters dont realise that the world and his dog want to be at Thaksins table, Every serious trading nation as sent somebody in unofficial or official capacity to meet the man yet many on here villify him, maybe its only a few posters with multiple id's, who knows.

How many elections has this man won maybe averaging 20,000,000 votes per time and yet people on here link Thaksin to red-to burning buildings-to corruption then the same people try to justify coups and the deaths of 90+ Thais. Well the guilty for the deaths have had a reprieve but only until the floods recede then you can bet when the truth is known we will still have the same people trying to twist it to Thaksin and defend the people who gave the orders. Makes for a fun day[/color]

Edited October 16, 2011 by metisdead
Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes.

[backtonormal]

Bravo! Richard in BKK. Excellent response to a typical uninformed, ego-centric poster. Your sarcasm in this sentence is perfect! "Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view"

I am a retired Canadian living in BKK for the past 8 months and I am amused and dismayed daily by some of the self-righteous judgements and criticisms posted in this and other forums.

Thank you

Rojack - Happy in Bangkok

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Welcome rojack, and good first post. Unfortunately, you are going to be more than just dismayed after reading the posts of the anti Govt posters here. As another poster mentioned, "the percentage of foaming-at-the-mouth Thaksin haters is far, far higher among TV members than it is amongst the Thai population." I actually suspect that this is not the case, but instead, these posters have nothing better to do with their time, being retired and bored out of their little minds, unable to properly integrate into the Thai society and thus spend the whole day digging up material to support their anti-Govt stance. A large proportion of TV members (myself included) could not be bothered to rise to the bait or to respond to their trolling posts.

Ver true bkkorupcountry. I wish I could believe it was only socially inept farangs posting anti gov rubbish but I suspect there maybe some well educated locals chipping in

Edited October 16, 2011 by metisdead
Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes.

[Microwave]

The flooding is sad. Just seeing the photos of people battling the water or who have already lost their battle with the rising waters is heartwrenching. I will be curious to see what actions are taken after this flooding episode is eventually over, and how quickly these actions are implemented, to try and alleviate the suffering which the flood waters have already caused. I will also be keen to see what measures will be taken, and how quickly these measures are implemented, to prevent these floods from happening again (if this is possible).

Edited October 16, 2011 by Microwave

[OzMick]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Well said.

NO preparation? Not true. A joke? No, look at the hundreds of people going to flooded areas to help.

Although the authorities could have done more to prevent flooding, I am actually surprised they have been holding up this well. Keep in mind that 16 BILLION CBM of water is on the way South. The effort required to deal with that amount of water is a major challenge for any country.

I am from Norway, but have lived in Holland for most of my life. I have seen a little of what it takes to deal with massive amounts of water.

The critics here just hate the new government and undoubtedly feel that Thaksin is somehow ultimately responsible. It would not matter if Yingluck was able to walk across the troubled waters and make them evaporate, heal the lame and halt, and change water into wine, they would still complain that her brother told her to do that for some nefarious reason, and anyway Mark would have been able to do all that much earlier. For some unknown reason, the percentage of foaming-at-the-mouth Thaksin haters is far, far higher among TV members than it is amongst the Thai population. I suspect that where that horrific, evil monster Mr. T got off on the wrong foot with them is the early bar closings.

/ I Was not at all a fan of Thaksin while he was in power, but feel a certain amount of sympathy for him the more I learn about his enemies.

Your opinion of a known criminal (the nicest way that I could describe the man) changes because of his enemies?

If you will forgive a religious parallel, would you warm to Judas Iscarriot because of the number of horrible people who managed to become Pope?

[serenitynow]

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Well said.

NO preparation? Not true. A joke? No, look at the hundreds of people going to flooded areas to help.

Although the authorities could have done more to prevent flooding, I am actually surprised they have been holding up this well. Keep in mind that 16 BILLION CBM of water is on the way South. The effort required to deal with that amount of water is a major challenge for any country.

I am from Norway, but have lived in Holland for most of my life. I have seen a little of what it takes to deal with massive amounts of water.

The critics here just hate the new government and undoubtedly feel that Thaksin is somehow ultimately responsible. It would not matter if Yingluck was able to walk across the troubled waters and make them evaporate, heal the lame and halt, and change water into wine, they would still complain that her brother told her to do that for some nefarious reason, and anyway Mark would have been able to do all that much earlier. For some unknown reason, the percentage of foaming-at-the-mouth Thaksin haters is far, far higher among TV members than it is amongst the Thai population. I suspect that where that horrific, evil monster Mr. T got off on the wrong foot with them is the early bar closings.

/ I Was not at all a fan of Thaksin while he was in power, but feel a certain amount of sympathy for him the more I learn about his enemies.

+1 it often seems like a scripted campaign to turn every thread, yes every thread, into a turkey shoot on Thaksin. Its as if somebody is funding the campaign of hatred. Most posters have seen thru this but I dont think the offenders have. Whatever anti Thaksin tripe is posted here what must be understood is that we cannot influence Thais as proved by the amount of times he keeps getting re-elected (regardless of convictions under a military, invisible hand controlled judiciary))

A few out of touch posters dont realise that the world and his dog want to be at Thaksins table, Every serious trading nation as sent somebody in unofficial or official capacity to meet the man yet many on here villify him, maybe its only a few posters with multiple id's, who knows.

How many elections has this man won maybe averaging 20,000,000 votes per time and yet people on here link Thaksin to red-to burning buildings-to corruption then the same people try to justify coups and the deaths of 90+ Thais. Well the guilty for the deaths have had a reprieve but only until the floods recede then you can bet when the truth is known we will still have the same people trying to twist it to Thaksin and defend the people who gave the orders. Makes for a fun day[/color]

This is interesting. Not much to say about Thaksin during this recent flooding episode. I think most people critical of the government's response lay the blame squarely at the feet of Yingluck and her assortment of hand picked ministers. Thaksin's name comes up only when criticizing this Yingluck administration for spending the first month of the flooding working for the benefit of her fugitive brother rather than focusing on the needs of the country that was already flooding even then. I think that's a pretty fair criticism given the fact that millions have suffered and hundreds have died from that lack of a prompt and comprehensive response. One cannot know with any accuracy how much less the death and suffering might have been if competent, well organized officials had tackled this situation earlier, but it's not hard to imagine it would/should have been much less.

[Estrada]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Sorry you are incorrect. My friend Kritsada Arunvongse na Ayuthaya was Governor of Bangkok at the time of the 1995 floods. I discussed the plans with him at the time. For all strategic locations where considerable damage could be done in the event of a flood, a 1 in 1,000 year flood level should be considered especially as Bangkok is built on land that was reclaimed from the sea at the mouth of the river Chaophraya. At that time we realised that the 2.5metre flood walls would not prevent flooding in the future. He therefore put forward the schemes that you mentioned. The scheme was to raise the flood walls to 5.2metres high along the Chaopraya River and form a ring around Bangkok together with major diversion canals and pumping systems. This scheme was stopped by Banharn as he was PM at the time and from a different political party (i.e. no benefit seen). The Government scheme that went ahead at only 2.5metres high has not worked, otherwise we would not have seen so many Industrial Estates under water as well as parts of Bangkok already. As long as the flood walls remain at 2.5metres there is a real chance of it being breached at the high tide.

Many of the Industrial Estates have been built on cheap land next to the river with flood walls of only around 2.5metres high, most of these Industrial estates such as Hi-Tech and Bang Pa in (where I have worked), have been flooded. On the other hand, Navanakorn Industrial Estate, thanks to Kritsada's foresight; has a flood defence of 5.2metres. Kritsada died last year, however Nipit Arunvongse Na Ayuthya is now Managing Director of Navanakorn.

Currently they are hastily trying to raise the flood wall around Bangkok above 2.5metres high with sand bags, however Bangkok still runs the risk of floods since the October 30th high tide will be 2.3 metres (highest so far 2.19metres), plus the runoff from the north and from further rain. Whilst they are trying to blame younger politicians such as Yingluck and the Science Minister for being inexperienced, it was the older MPs that are still in Government, such as Banharn, that blocked the construction of the dykes to a height of 5.2metres that should be blamed.

Years ago, Bangkok was well drained as it was criss crossed by many drainage canals which were also the means of transport which was nearly all by boat. Bangkok was then known a "The Venice of the East". The politicians allowed most of the canals such as Sathorn to be filled in on advice from the Americans (who are being blamed by some for causing the floods). After filling the canals in, Bangkok was no longer known as the Venice of the East, but the "Land of Smiles", possibly after much money was made from building roads and erecting skyscrapers on what was drainage land. However little consideration appears to have been taken in mitigating the affect of turning the land, which would have absorbed the rains, to concrete. When the land is turned to concrete, the rains are not absorbed and it all has to flow through the greatly reduced capacity drainage system.

Edited October 16, 2011 by Estrada

[ryladie99]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Well said.

NO preparation? Not true. A joke? No, look at the hundreds of people going to flooded areas to help.

Although the authorities could have done more to prevent flooding, I am actually surprised they have been holding up this well. Keep in mind that 16 BILLION CBM of water is on the way South. The effort required to deal with that amount of water is a major challenge for any country.

I am from Norway, but have lived in Holland for most of my life. I have seen a little of what it takes to deal with massive amounts of water.

Disaster from Nature is not an easy task to deal with..the Thai has no resource and money to cope with. I would urge everyone to help donate money to the Thai Rad Cross...then the poor and hopeless people can survive this crisis...My heart and soul go with the Thai people...I myself already donate money to the Red Cross in America...and Hope everyone will lending his or her own hands.

[hanuman1]

This whole flood situation is a tough one for the government haters to make any hay out of.

First off, only more death and damage will increase the discontent against the government among the general population, and only the most degenerate among government haters would want to see that happen just to win political points.

On the other hand, if the waters recede without much further loss, the government will have dodged an environmental bullet (as far as BKK is concerned, anyway) and may even gain mild kudos for the existing anti-flood measures working as well as they did (ie not even worse).

Of course, the most entrenched government haters will always find reasons to perpetuate their habit, but they don't make a difference. Those that make the difference are the general population who tend not be fanatical one way or another and whose political opinions are shaped on more than rhetorical bile.

When people's lives are adversely enough effected, they will become more hostile towards the government. That is why the Dems got kicked out, and that will be the reason the PTP will eventually get kicked out.

In the meantime, a natural disaster like this - especially in a country where this kind of thing is not uncommon - is unlikely to garner the kind of discontent government haters dream of unless things get far far worse.

And no-one would want to see that happen, would they?

Edited October 16, 2011 by hanuman1

[WarpSpeed]

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Have you ever heard of the term "overwhelming"??

[whybother]

+1 it often seems like a scripted campaign to turn every thread, yes every thread, into a turkey shoot on Thaksin. Its as if somebody is funding the campaign of hatred. Most posters have seen thru this but I dont think the offenders have. Whatever anti Thaksin tripe is posted here what must be understood is that we cannot influence Thais as proved by the amount of times he keeps getting re-elected (regardless of convictions under a military, invisible hand controlled judiciary))

A few out of touch posters dont realise that the world and his dog want to be at Thaksins table, Every serious trading nation as sent somebody in unofficial or official capacity to meet the man yet many on here villify him, maybe its only a few posters with multiple id's, who knows.

How many elections has this man won maybe averaging 20,000,000 votes per time and yet people on here link Thaksin to red-to burning buildings-to corruption then the same people try to justify coups and the deaths of 90+ Thais. Well the guilty for the deaths have had a reprieve but only until the floods recede then you can bet when the truth is known we will still have the same people trying to twist it to Thaksin and defend the people who gave the orders. Makes for a fun day[/color]

"Its as if somebody is funding the campaign of hatred." ... are you accusing people of being paid to post?

"Most posters have seen thru this but I dont think the offenders have." ... read: most posters have seen through this, except for the ones that haven't.

"Every serious trading nation as sent somebody in unofficial or official capacity to meet the man" ... Cambodia, Montenegro, Dubai, Uganda ........

"How many elections has this man won maybe averaging 20,000,000 votes per time"

- 2001 - 11.6 million

- 2005 - 14 million

- 2006 - 15. 4 million

"Well the guilty for the deaths have had a reprieve but only until the floods recede then you can bet when the truth is known we will still have the same people trying to twist it to Thaksin and defend the people who gave the orders." ... yes, they're busy making a complete &lt;deleted&gt; of the flood management. When the floods are over, you can bet that the people like yourself will be continuing to defend the red shirt leaders-come MPs that gave orders to invade hospitals, shoot grenades and burn Bangkok.

Edited October 16, 2011 by whybother

[MaxYakov]

Ah, I see the forum hostilities have started on this fine Sunday morning! What is it with some of you guys? I swear, sometimes it's like reading transcripts of conversations between grumpy old men in a care home!

<br>I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country*  Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view.  In <font face="sans-serif"><font size="2"><b>Hurricane Katrina</b></font></font> <font face="sans-serif"><font size="2">1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded </font></font><font face="sans-serif"><font size="2">$81 billion.  Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf.  Perhaps the UK?  OMG...where to begin?</font></font><br><font face="sans-serif"><font size="2"><br></font></font><br><font face="sans-serif"><font size="2">The question is, "Who are you to judge?"  By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about.  Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?</font></font><br><br><br>

<br>The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent<br>

<br><br><br><br>

<br><br><br>

What makes you think you're not actually reading GOM in HC transcripts? I guess those wouldn't have as much exposed HTML ...

[EyesWideOpen]

I have to admit to being a bit confused over the flooding of these important industrial estates . Many many thousand jobs will be lost , inflicting long term losses even after the water recedes. I used to build houses in Western Alaska, near the mouth of the Yukon river. This area is a massive flood plain, and everyone knew it. So if you built a house, you would research the highest water level for the past 100 years, and build the house on stilts a foot above that mark. So no problems no matter what flood came. .... With these industrial estates, billions of dollars are at stake. I simply cannot believe the developers of these estates, knowing full well they are located in a flood plain, did not build strong walls all around them at a height above the 100 year flood mark. I suspect there will be a lot of Japanese factory managers asking the same questions, as they plan where to move their factory. I think this will be a case of penny wise dollar foolish, saving money by building low walls that were easily breeched.