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maidu

University And College Education Over-Rated

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We were not discussing slackards Scott. You basically pointed to teachers who were grumbly about their surroundings and ever-changing circumstances, they theoretically could be the BEST teachers in the lot.

If the salary were commensurate with the expectations and a respectable wage, then the pool of qualified teachers would increase.

So, in other words....YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR! thumbsup.gifcheesy.gif

Maybe you out to have gone for the Philosophy degree Scott. Analytical thinking obviously not your strong suit. ED not strong in analytical skills but great for teaching children for LESS MONEY than working @ McD's - no doubt.

There is no worse degree, a degree that prepares one for absolutely nothing save for teaching children - than the ED degree. What is worse, a person that gets an MA / Ed. In the US the only purpose for this is Elementary School (K-8) administration. Leave that environment and you too will be asking - Fries with that??!

Edited by bangkokburning

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No, I haven't read all the books you've read,

Beside the point. Only the essential works relating to the topic you're expounding would be sufficient.

Well DUH-uh, what you're left with then, arguing a topic with such momentous global implications, is merely--hot air. Nothin' like knockin' back a few Changs and lettin' it rip, eh?

and you haven't read all the books I've read.

You mean, like, Bart Simpson's Guide To Life? Heh.

I've read a few dozen hyper-intellectual books - yet most go through me like beer through a barfly.

Because you innately KNOW already. Of course you do. Just born that way, fortunately. Rest of us should just take your word for it. University educations are useless!

Good ol' barefoot philosophy--all one needs really.

IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH



--1984

Edited by JSixpack

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We were not discussing slackards Scott. You basically pointed to teachers who were grumbly about their surroundings and ever-changing circumstances, they theoretically could be the BEST teachers in the lot.

If the salary were commensurate with the expectations and a respectable wage, then the pool of qualified teachers would increase.

So, in other words....YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR! thumbsup.gifcheesy.gif

Maybe you out to have gone for the Philosophy degree Scott. Analytical thinking obviously not your strong suit. ED not strong in analytical skills but great for teaching children for LESS MONEY than working @ McD's - no doubt.

There is no worse degree, a degree that prepares one for absolutely nothing save for teaching children - than the ED degree. What is worse, a person that gets an MA / Ed. In the US the only purpose for this is Elementary School (K-8) administration. Leave that environment and you too will be asking - Fries with that??!

"There is no worse degree, a degree that prepares one for absolutely nothing save for teaching children - than the ED degree. What is worse, a person that gets an MA / Ed. In the US the only purpose for this is Elementary School (K-8) administration. Leave that environment and you too will be asking - Fries with that??!" ---INCORRECT

With a Master's in Education, you can choose to teach primary (elementary school, K - 5) or secondary (middle/intermediate, 6 - 8 and/or high school 9 - 12). The salaries tend to be slightly higher on for secondary educators, and in some states, such as Hawaii, California, Michigan, New York, and others, someone with a Master's Degree in Education can earn anywhere between $45,000 USD to $70,000 USD per year. This is including three months off for summer, two weeks off for winter, one week off for fall break, one week off for spring break, and all state holidays--while still being paid regularly every 15 days. While these are not exorbitant amounts, I don't think anyone would have any trouble paying a mortgage, saving money, and traveling regularly with either end of this spectrum of income.

Edited by ivan96822

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"The non-University educated simply don't know that they don't know."

Very true. Many of the non-college people think of college as though it is prison. They don't understand that it opens up your mind to so many different ideas and philosophies.

Ignorance is bliss, I guess. For those who continue their education, kudos. For those who do not, I'm sure it is quite easy to criticize something that you have never officially ensconced yourself in.

It's like combat vets who tell eveyone else, "you can't comment on war, because you've never experienced it first hand." I resent that sort of argument. I can comment on all sorts of topics which I don't happen to have 1st hand experience at. You do it also, if you make a comment about Antarctica, Space travel, deep sea mining, paedophilia, or any of thousands of topics you've probably never experienced first hand.

Back on topic: I don't think of Universities and colleges as prisons. I see them largely as giant sucking machines - sucking up government grants and parents' money. In large part to perpetuate the myth that a diploma is essential - to get ahead in this world. Tell that to Steve Jobs or Bill Gates, neither of whom had a diploma.

Pray tell: you wish to avoid universities yourself, and you advocate that they are a waste of space/time/__________. So, in your opinion (not that it matters much), a high school graduate can hope to achieve $XXX,XXX income by doing................???

Selling things on Ebay? Playing a harmonica on a street corner? Working retail for minimum wage? Give me a break.

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I had to look back to page one of this thread to see what the topic was again. Seems to have gotten off track. It is true, there could be a lot of money saved if everyone didn't go to college and learned everything on the internet. However, there are many countries that ignore higher and lower education.

In fact, there are studies that show what countries place a lot of emphasis on higher education and which do not. Nationmaster.com has a chart. Please see the attached file.

Of the countries that are ignoring education, ask yourself...would you want to be a citizen of that country?

Tertiary enrollment statistics - countries compared - NationMaster Education.pdf

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We were not discussing slackards Scott. You basically pointed to teachers who were grumbly about their surroundings and ever-changing circumstances, they theoretically could be the BEST teachers in the lot.

If the salary were commensurate with the expectations and a respectable wage, then the pool of qualified teachers would increase.

So, in other words....YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR! thumbsup.gifcheesy.gif

Maybe you out to have gone for the Philosophy degree Scott. Analytical thinking obviously not your strong suit. ED not strong in analytical skills but great for teaching children for LESS MONEY than working @ McD's - no doubt.

There is no worse degree, a degree that prepares one for absolutely nothing save for teaching children - than the ED degree. What is worse, a person that gets an MA / Ed. In the US the only purpose for this is Elementary School (K-8) administration. Leave that environment and you too will be asking - Fries with that??!

"There is no worse degree, a degree that prepares one for absolutely nothing save for teaching children - than the ED degree. What is worse, a person that gets an MA / Ed. In the US the only purpose for this is Elementary School (K-8) administration. Leave that environment and you too will be asking - Fries with that??!" ---INCORRECT

With a Master's in Education, you can choose to teach primary (elementary school, K - 5) or secondary (middle/intermediate, 6 - 8 and/or high school 9 - 12). The salaries tend to be slightly higher on for secondary educators, and in some states, such as Hawaii, California, Michigan, New York, and others, someone with a Master's Degree in Education can earn anywhere between $45,000 USD to $70,000 USD per year. This is including three months off for summer, two weeks off for winter, one week off for fall break, one week off for spring break, and all state holidays--while still being paid regularly every 15 days. While these are not exorbitant amounts, I don't think anyone would have any trouble paying a mortgage, saving money, and traveling regularly with either end of this spectrum of income.

Very true, from what I know. One of my best friends got her Master's in Ed and then took a few extra courses relating to gifted children in particular. She makes about $70,000 and has a great situation.

I quite understand the disdain for Ed as an academic major and, me, I'd wash dishes before I'd study Ed, but, fact is, the gov't agencies have made it the union card. If you got it and you get experience and certifications, then you can also teach at international schools worldwide and the whole game changes. Then you deal w/ quality people, under good management, for good money. (Relatively speaking.)

So that's the way it. Otherwise, come to a poor Third World country and teach at a language school or public school or mom 'n' pop private school--what CAN you expect but a world of trouble? Highly unadvisable except for a lark. Far better to stay in your own Western country where you have good health care, pensions, rule of law, and career and investment prospects.

Edited by JSixpack

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In Thailand you cannot simply walk away from these jobs as your visa is tied to them

Yes you can. The only possible question would be that of overstay.

You won't need that Thai visa in your home country, pal.

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I've watched a few documentaries on the financial meltdowns in the US and elsewhere. Most recently, the Enron debacle. Flocks of highly educated young men and women, and nearly all busy scamming. They even had all the top banks and investment firms scamming along with them. Some of the players knew it was scamming, some were genuinely hoodwinked and wound up plowing tens of billions of their, their company's, and other peoples' money in to a black hole. All the big shot players must have had impressive U degrees. Of course, a University can't teach wisdom or street-smarts, it can only just teach.

I guess the big question is: are people with U degrees more likely to be rip-offs than people without degrees? Are PhD's better at scamming than regular folks? I think people in general are readily inclined to being rip-offs (U degree or not), and the main difference is; people with U degrees usually play a higher stakes game. Obviously, Universities cannot instill decency or morality in their students.

So, as you and I get ripped off on a weekly basis, keep in mind that it's the 'little people' without higher education that we're aware off (pick-pockets, jetski renters, etc.) and who wind up eliciting our anger. Concurrently, we're being ripped off by much greater amounts, by people with impressive U degrees, yet we're less aware of it.

Example: during California's 'energy crisis of early 2000's, CA ratepayers paid 50 billion $$'s more than they should have. That money went to Enron hot-shots with U degrees who manipulated the system which was earlier deregulated by others (republican lawmakers) with U degrees.

Edited by maidu

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Maidu - why is this posted in the Teaching forum ?

If it's not specific to a teaching job's required qualifications, why not post it in the General or 'Jobs' section?

Unless you have actually attended University how can you qualify the following statement ? : -

There are few, if any things, which can be learned at a U, which cannot be learned via the internet, books, and/or (preferably) directly from people skilled in those fields.

Try to reply without sarcasm if possible :)

Edited by chonabot

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I have to agree with some posters that this thread is probably not topical to this sub-forum.

//Closed//

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