BirdsandBooze Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Why complain about power figures??? We should be happy as pigs in shit... More big bikes are coming... Does anyone know the seat height of the new cbr? Can my go fit one? Yes she is a midget... And How high is that CBX? I like that one... All I know is that I was going to buy a kawasaki next year, thought z1000 but now, maybe keep the er6f and get the CBX... Hmm difficult, when will ducati release theirs? How difficult it is to choose... CBR and CB have 30.9 inch seat height. CBX has 31.9 inch seat height. I can't see the CBX costing more than the CBR which has a lot more plastic. Maybe it'll slot in mid way between the CBR and CB. With it's Crosstourer styling the matt black CBX looks like a winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyF Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 I'm certain it's crank, as most dyno videos i have seen have the stock bike running at around 66-67hp at the rear wheel. And yes this is going to be some stiff competition for the Ninja250/300 but i can't see this bike taking to many sales from the ER6 / Ninja 650. It certainly doesn't make much sense to buy the Ninja 250/300 anymore, unless you really like the styling and i for one love it! But that power the new Honda offers up is going to be hard to resist at only 10k more.... We'll have to wait for a review of the bike to see which bike handles better, i'm sure the new honda is the better bike for the city while the Ninja 250/300 would shine on a twisty track I'm also of the mind it won't take many sales (not that compared to Honda Kawi has many big bike sales) away from the 650 bikes, but Kawasaki's in a world of hurt for sure trying to offload their 250s. You can get a very comparable bike right now for 66% of the price or a much better bike for an estimated 133%. We'll see how the Ninjette compares on the track; from the professional racing series against the CBR250 it never acquitted itself all that well did it? I'd agree Dave, back in 2008 when I bought my Ninja it was the only legal option in Thailand unless you wanted to spend megabucks. Since then the price of the Ninja has gone up from the 137,xxx I paid and a lot more bikes have been released at sensible prices. If I was buying now and faced a decision between the Ninja at the current price (15x,xxx) or the CBR500 at 170k then I'd go for the Honda. That doesn't make the Honda a great bike IMO it is distinctly average, but it's far better value than the Ninja 250 at the moment. If Honda BigWing is selling this bike then that's another bonus as purchasers won't have to deal with the usual price gouging from the 'corner shop' Honda dealers. Servicing should be better as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdsandBooze Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Compare specs of all 3. CBR and CBF are identical apart from bodywork and CBR is 5lbs heavier than CBF. CBX has long travel suspension, more ground clearance, more degrees of rake and length of trail, longer wheelbase, higher seat, larger fuel tank, is 5lbs heavier than CBR and 10lbs heavier than CBF. CBF 420lbs fully fuelled and ready to ride, CBR 425lbs, CBX 430lbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_boo Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 I'd agree Dave, back in 2008 when I bought my Ninja it was the only legal option in Thailand unless you wanted to spend megabucks. Since then the price of the Ninja has gone up from the 137,xxx I paid and a lot more bikes have been released at sensible prices. If I was buying now and faced a decision between the Ninja at the current price (15x,xxx) or the CBR500 at 170k then I'd go for the Honda. That doesn't make the Honda a great bike IMO it is distinctly average, but it's far better value than the Ninja 250 at the moment. If Honda BigWing is selling this bike then that's another bonus as purchasers won't have to deal with the usual price gouging from the 'corner shop' Honda dealers. Servicing should be better as well. Unfortunately there are no great bikes that are a value in Thailand. All the sub-600 bikes you can buy from dealers are simply 'meh'. Even Kawasaki's 650 series, which are good values, don't stir the loins like supersports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loserlazer Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 If you want to buy a big bike in Thailand, do you really buy a kawa 650 with 25 percent more performance for 40 percent more price? How many buyers will fell the difference of 15 hp? tbf, I think the quality of parts on the N650's will be day and night over the cheap, budget made 500's. I haven't checked, but those forks look identical to the 250 ones, and they look skinny on that! kawa 650 parts most of them are from Thailand same as cbr500. Remember the common parts of cbr250 and ninja250 like shocks, tyres, arm etc. I do not think so there will be a big difference on quality. besides, cbr250 shocks are 37 and cbr500 has 41 mm, cbr500 has more suspension travel too! Yes, it is a cheap bike but not that cheap man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loserlazer Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) guys, anyone knows the exact cc of the bikes? one source says 470 cc and official honda website claims 500 cc? which one is true? i hope it is a 500 cc and what is this story like these bikes will be produced in Japan? I hope not man, i hope not. thanks. Edited November 13, 2012 by loserlazer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdsandBooze Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 guys, anyone knows the exact cc of the bikes? one source says 470 cc and official honda website claims 500 cc? which one is true? i hope it is a 500 cc and what is this story like these bikes will be produced in Japan? I hope not man, i hope not. thanks. Calculating using the bore and stroke on the spec sheet it is 471cc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowflake Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Who cares, it is new and legal here in Thailand, full warranty and service we can count on... if you want a big bike that flies, get the money first, if you want to have fun and enjoy life, use what we have here... If you don't like the bikes Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha, Suzuki, Ducati, Triumph and so on are selling here, tough shit, go to a grey importer where you will not get a book, it is cheaper and so nice to have... you enjoy that, but when it comes to legality, good luck.. Don't complain, be happy with what we have, even if it is not the same selection as back from the cave you came from, you might go back there soon if you are not able to enjoy anything... I remember when I first came here, no bikes for sale from either one... now, several, so I am happy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyF Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) Who cares, it is new and legal here in Thailand, full warranty and service we can count on... if you want a big bike that flies, get the money first, if you want to have fun and enjoy life, use what we have here... If you don't like the bikes Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha, Suzuki, Ducati, Triumph and so on are selling here, tough shit, go to a grey importer where you will not get a book, it is cheaper and so nice to have... you enjoy that, but when it comes to legality, good luck.. Don't complain, be happy with what we have, even if it is not the same selection as back from the cave you came from, you might go back there soon if you are not able to enjoy anything... I remember when I first came here, no bikes for sale from either one... now, several, so I am happy... I think people are just discussing the relative merits of the bike, and forums tend to be a good ummmm, 'forum' for discussion so there's no need to get bent out of shape if someone has a different opinion to yours. I think it's normal for some people to like it and other people to be less impressed. The nature of people is that we are all different. It's perfectly possible to get 100% legal books on imported bikes by the way, I have one on my gsxr and it's been checked multiple times by the DLT in both Bangkok and Chiang Mai and it's been confirmed as 100% legal every time because the correct tax has been paid and recorded in the book. I enjoy all my bikes by the way, Thai made and imported - they're all fun to me Edited November 13, 2012 by JonnyF 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowflake Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 I agree with you JonnyF but it is sometimes so annoying to see people complain that they don't get the perfect bike for them, they come with stuff like 'below average' and it might be, BUT they are at least selling big bikes now, for a reasonable price... I don't see anyone running to buy the cbr 1000, or the ducati 848, or the proper super bikes, you get what you pay for in this country... HONDA knows what will sell here, trust me, they do... This bike is for the masses... My guess is that they prefer to sell 2000 cbr 500 than 20 cbr 1000, and I am sure that they'd will sell that many, if not even more over time... Come with positive arguments and there is nothing wrong, sure a wish list of PROPPERcbr's might be in order, but this is our selection... So, as you said... Go to import a big bike, get the tax done, do the emission testing or what they want... But don't tell me that the cbr500 is not a good little bike before it is ridden!!! That is just plain silly... Bad plastic, low power, cheap parts, hmmm, I wonder how many of us have seen these bikes up close... My guess is that fit and finish will be very good... I have also enjoyed my bikes here in LOS, so keep up the good work Honda,Kawasaki, ducati, and to all the others out there that works to get bigger bikes to Thailand... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taninthai Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 ^ only problem is Honda have built this bike for world wide release not just for thailand,good for Thailand yes ,for the rest of the world well the cbr is disappointing the other 2 I think are not bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_boo Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 ^ only problem is Honda have built this bike for world wide release not just for thailand,good for Thailand yes ,for the rest of the world well the cbr is disappointing the other 2 I think are not bad In my opinion good for all the world. Whether people want to admit it or not, all manufacturers need a steady income stream to innovate and provide 'exciting' products. If you were to only look at outliers, such as Ducati (which in my opinion still has 'boring' bikes like the small Monsters and 848), it seems like they regularly need cash infusions to remain competitive. Designing and building cutting edge bikes costs money. If manufacturers were to charge an appropriate amount most potential buyers would balk at that and probably call it obscene profiteering. Thus they subside their highly desired bikes with 'lesser' bikes. Honda has decided that, in the name of ecological responsibility, to release several series of bikes that are not the most technologically advanced fire-breathing monsters but rather decent bikes at decent prices that use as little fuel as possible. Having bikes that are cost effective for the larger market only makes good sense. Snowflake touched on this; granted the build costs probably aren't 2x for the CBR1000 compared to the CBR500, but than again do you really suppose that reusing parts from other bikes entailed a large developmental cost? And if that product, even if it nets you less profit per unit, is available to 100x the potential purchasers which would bring in more money than a 'high profit' low sales bigger bike doesn't that allow you to sink some of that profit back into other models? Lastly, this bike would seem to be a pretty good tiered license bike for those countries (which do not have the cost concern issue that the rest of the world has). With the rules being the way they are; a supersport can not be bought and restricted down as there is too much stock power. The CB*500 line provides a way to get sales for a bike that will provide several years of enjoyment rather than buying an anemic 150 or 250 and possibly build brand loyalty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taninthai Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) When peas in the uk 7 years ago people were buying 600 cc bikes hornets,bandits ,gsxr and just buying the restricting kit for them so once they had done their time remove the kit and you have a full power bike believe a hornet is around 90 bhp this is what people seem to want in the real world not a 47 bhp machine that you would probably want to change within a year. Don't forget country's with tiered licesense laws are getting a 47 bhp version and if that's at the crank with the weight of this bike it's not that great or tempting for buyers that have a huge selection to choose from. Still as I say good for Thailand. Edited November 13, 2012 by taninthai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wantan Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Yawn ... why isn't there a notification function for "new interesting content"? Aren't you tired about telling other people that they will have no fun with their new bikes? Why should someone in Thailand have fun with the new CBR500 and in other countries not? This is nonsense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdsandBooze Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 When peas in the uk 7 years ago people were buying 600 cc bikes hornets,bandits ,gsxr and just buying the restricting kit for them so once they had done their time remove the kit and you have a full power bike believe a hornet is around 90 bhp this is what people seem to want in the real world not a 47 bhp machine that you would probably want to change within a year. Don't forget country's with tiered licesense laws are getting a 47 bhp version and if that's at the crank with the weight of this bike it's not that great or tempting for buyers that have a huge selection to choose from. Still as I say good for Thailand. According to Honda the tuned for torque 47bhp NC700X is faster to 75mph than the CB600F Hornet and gets nearly twice the mileage on a gallon of fuel. Of course it doesn't have the top end of the Hornet but Honda research shows that most riders spend their time below 70mph. Experienced riders in the UK are showing a lot of interest in Honda's new concept of economical, torquey bikes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taninthai Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Because if you were in another country with a full selection of reasonable priced bikes the cbr 500 wouldn't come into it you would just by the real thing. Are you stalking me wanton you have a habit of commenting useless trash towards anything I post get over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taninthai Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) When peas in the uk 7 years ago people were buying 600 cc bikes hornets,bandits ,gsxr and just buying the restricting kit for them so once they had done their time remove the kit and you have a full power bike believe a hornet is around 90 bhp this is what people seem to want in the real world not a 47 bhp machine that you would probably want to change within a year. Don't forget country's with tiered licesense laws are getting a 47 bhp version and if that's at the crank with the weight of this bike it's not that great or tempting for buyers that have a huge selection to choose from. Still as I say good for Thailand. According to Honda the tuned for torque 47bhp NC700X is faster to 75mph than the CB600F Hornet and gets nearly twice the mileage on a gallon of fuel. Of course it doesn't have the top end of the Hornet but Honda research shows that most riders spend their time below 70mph. Experienced riders in the UK are showing a lot of interest in Honda's new concept of economical, torquey bikes. I find that hard to believe and is more likely marketing bullshit the hornet engine Is a slightly detuned cbr 600rr engine 0- 60 mph in 4 seconds or less and revs up to 12-14000rpm Edited November 13, 2012 by taninthai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 If you want to buy a big bike in Thailand, do you really buy a kawa 650 with 25 percent more performance for 40 percent more price? How many buyers will fell the difference of 15 hp? tbf, I think the quality of parts on the N650's will be day and night over the cheap, budget made 500's. I haven't checked, but those forks look identical to the 250 ones, and they look skinny on that! kawa 650 parts most of them are from Thailand same as cbr500. Remember the common parts of cbr250 and ninja250 like shocks, tyres, arm etc. I do not think so there will be a big difference on quality. We'll have to disagree on what we expect. I expect the the parts to be the most economical, ie. the cheapest (poorest quality) they could possible get away with in order to shock everyone with how cheap it is, and hence sell bucket loads of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdsandBooze Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) When peas in the uk 7 years ago people were buying 600 cc bikes hornets,bandits ,gsxr and just buying the restricting kit for them so once they had done their time remove the kit and you have a full power bike believe a hornet is around 90 bhp this is what people seem to want in the real world not a 47 bhp machine that you would probably want to change within a year. Don't forget country's with tiered licesense laws are getting a 47 bhp version and if that's at the crank with the weight of this bike it's not that great or tempting for buyers that have a huge selection to choose from. Still as I say good for Thailand. According to Honda the tuned for torque 47bhp NC700X is faster to 75mph than the CB600F Hornet and gets nearly twice the mileage on a gallon of fuel. Of course it doesn't have the top end of the Hornet but Honda research shows that most riders spend their time below 70mph. Experienced riders in the UK are showing a lot of interest in Honda's new concept of economical, torquey bikes. I find that hard to believe and is more likely marketing bullshit the hornet engine Is a slightly detuned cbr 600rr engine 0- 60 mph in 4 seconds or less and revs up to 12-14000rpm http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/motorbikes/8848446/Honda-NC700X-review.html With respect, I think Honda know more about the bikes they build than you do. Sorry bad link, here is the info from Daily Telegraph review -'The NC700X is quicker to 75mph than the CBF too, though the lazy delivery means you’d never guess. You have to make the same mental switch riding this bike as you would changing from a petrol car to a diesel. It’s not like a diesel in any other respect, though. One of the team’s most difficult tasks was to endow the bike with a normal motorcycle’s response and feel'. Edited November 13, 2012 by BirdsandBooze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taninthai Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) ^ I think we are going way of topic bringing these 2 bikes into it,I do have a old model hornet in the uk and weighing only 60 kg I don't think the n700 would beat me but having never ridden the n700 hard to really comment,strange they are saying 75 mph they usually measure 0-60 mph in uk and 0-60mph is what I'm basing my views on. Just looked on you tube a nc700 owner had his measured at 5.6 secs 0-60 so no where near the hornet in acceleration as said marketing bullshit Edited November 13, 2012 by taninthai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard-BKK Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) The new Honda 500cc motorcycles are very likely not made in Thailand, and even if they were manufactured in Thailand they would probably cost more than a Kawasaki 650cc. Why is that? The Thailand government has no TAX or BOI benefits for manufacturers who produce a motorcycle with an engine bigger than 250cc and smaller than 500cc. The new Honda 500 line-up is officially 471cc so they don't have any Thai government/BOI benefits, nothing special. The second reason is that Honda has not the space to produce 3 global motorcycle models in Thailand, they just have no free production lines. Also investing in Thailand for the production of the CB500F, CB500X, and CBR500R in Thailand would be an investment difficult to earn back, 2013 is almost upon us and from 1 January 2013 the import duty from Japan will just be 22%, producing the motorcycle in Thailand without the Thai government benefits (BOI) it would cost more to produce them in Thailand.... So it's very likely that Honda will use the Japan-Thailand Economic Partnership Agreement to import the motorcycles into Thailand (if they decide to sell them in Thailand). Edited November 13, 2012 by Richard-BKK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taninthai Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 They are being made in Thailand Richard did you not see the first leaked pictures they had water bottles on the table that are only sold in Thailand ,Honda also done a press release months ago stating this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wantan Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Because if you were in another country with a full selection of reasonable priced bikes the cbr 500 wouldn't come into it you would just by the real thing. Are you stalking me wanton you have a habit of commenting useless trash towards anything I post get over it. IIRR i haven't quoted any post. Not yours, and not any other post. You are a bit paranoid if you think i was talking to you. IMO this endless discussion about how wonderful the other "more powerful, real" bikes are is boring. Thats all. Cool down Honda sure haven't made these bikes especially for Thailand. And they will sell a lot of them all over the world. And many people will have fun on them. So what is this stupid bickering about? Young men with too much time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 They are being made in Thailand Richard did you not see the first leaked pictures they had water bottles on the table that are only sold in Thailand ,Honda also done a press release months ago stating this Don't worry mate. Everyone knows that poster has green hair. A red plastic nose. And juggles for a living. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Not only is the new market for bigger bikes looking good, but in 2 - 3 years time there's going to be an array of perfectly legal, easily serviceable and affordable to most 'big bikes' here. In 3 years you'll probably be seeing used 09 Er-6's for 100k. 08-12 N250's and CBR250's at less than 60k. And if the price is inline with the States, these 500's for probably 120k. Compared to recently enough when it was a barrage through dodgy, cooked 20 yr old 400's for that type of money, it's great. And will likely encourage more Thais in to the market as it grows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wantan Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 cbrer, are you stalking me? Your smiley in #385 is looking at my post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Can you ladies try to keep your tampon-throwing fights elsewhere? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wantan Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) OK, lets go on with a serious discussion about "What is a real bike?" and the question "Is the new CBR500 a real bike?". And of course the most fascinating topic: Is it possible to have fun with one of the new 500cc Honda bikes? Have fun Edited November 13, 2012 by wantan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard-BKK Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) They are being made in Thailand Richard did you not see the first leaked pictures they had water bottles on the table that are only sold in Thailand ,Honda also done a press release months ago stating this Water bottles with pink caps as evidence, the truth is that Honda Thailand has a contract with Sprinkle Water (which supplies them with big water tanks and bottled water) http://www.sprinkle-...duct_type_1.php and the Honda/Sprinkle water bottles come with blue bottle caps.... So I'm not sure where the water bottles in the original picture, posted by a person who is now banned from this forum came from... But not forget me wrong, I really would like it if it came to Thailand.... Would love it to be true... Edited November 13, 2012 by Richard-BKK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) I suppose the good thing is that all your future BS will be written off with the link to your above posts. Every cloud... Edited November 13, 2012 by cbrer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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