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Norwegian Stein Dokset Accused Of Murder Refuses To Give Testimony: Phuket


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It is outrageous that a man on trial for his life cannot be given the services of a properly qualified interpreter. How can he get a fair hearing there is any doubt in anybody's mind about what is actually being said in court?

What steps are being taken by Denmark to ensure one of their nationals is treated as equitably as a Thai person before a Danish court would?

Thailand's record on human rights is not a proud one and this case should be taken, if necessary, to the International Court of Human Rights to ensure a fair outcome.

More outrageous that there is an assumption that the interpreter isn't qualified when the court, the prosecutors and the defendant's 3 lawyers have no problem with her and the only one who does is a guy who doesn't speak or understand fluent Thai that killed his girlfriend and kept her body in the house for years.

If he doesn't like the court appointed and paid for interpreter than he should hire his own... or better yet just not kill your girlfriend and stick her in a box and shuffle her corpse around the house for years.

You're getting a bit ahead of yourself here. At this stage it is only alleged that he killed his girlfriend. That's what courtrooms are for - to save ourselves from people like you who can't comprehend the concept of presumption of innocence. You'd have been right at home during the witch burning era.

Edited by tropo
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It is outrageous that a man on trial for his life cannot be given the services of a properly qualified interpreter. How can he get a fair hearing there is any doubt in anybody's mind about what is actually being said in court?

What steps are being taken by Denmark to ensure one of their nationals is treated as equitably as a Thai person before a Danish court would?

Thailand's record on human rights is not a proud one and this case should be taken, if necessary, to the International Court of Human Rights to ensure a fair outcome.

More outrageous that there is an assumption that the interpreter isn't qualified when the court, the prosecutors and the defendant's 3 lawyers have no problem with her and the only one who does is a guy who doesn't speak or understand fluent Thai that killed his girlfriend and kept her body in the house for years.

If he doesn't like the court appointed and paid for interpreter than he should hire his own... or better yet just not kill your girlfriend and stick her in a box and shuffle her corpse around the house for years.

You're getting a bit ahead of yourself here. At this stage it is only alleged that he killed his girlfriend. That's what courtrooms are for - to save ourselves from people like you who can't comprehend the concept of presumption of innocence. You'd have been right at home during the witch burning era.
This is not a case of if he killed her but the circumstances under which he killed her. The guy has admitted he killed his girlfriend during a fight and has admitted to hiding the body for years in his home.

Presumed innocence is simply a legal term (for the court rooms) which means a defendant shouldn't have to prove his innocence but rather the state needs to prove his guilt. Presumed innocence also only applies to those actually judging the accused including judges, all over the world, who often hold these "innocent" people in jail before and during trial.

Can you imagine telling a loved one, such a daughter that has been raped, that they have to believe their attacker is innocent unless the judge says otherwise?

I could be wrong but when people bring up presumed innocence and try to act as though it applies to people expressing opinions outside of court, such as on a discussion forum, I think they know better and for whatever reason just don't want to believe in the person's guilt but for whatever reason are incapable or unwilling to share their reasons for this desired belief. I think maybe most of us have played this card at one time or another when for whatever reason we just didn't want to believe in somebody's guilt despite overwhelming information saying differently.

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This is not a case of if he killed her but the circumstances under which he killed her. The guy has admitted he killed his girlfriend during a fight and has admitted to hiding the body for years in his home.

Presumed innocence is simply a legal term (for the court rooms) which means a defendant shouldn't have to prove his innocence but rather the state needs to prove his guilt. Presumed innocence also only applies to those actually judging the accused including judges, all over the world, who often hold these "innocent" people in jail before and during trial.

Can you imagine telling a loved one, such a daughter that has been raped, that they have to believe their attacker is innocent unless the judge says otherwise?

I could be wrong but when people bring up presumed innocence and try to act as though it applies to people expressing opinions outside of court, such as on a discussion forum, I think they know better and for whatever reason just don't want to believe in the person's guilt but for whatever reason are incapable or unwilling to share their reasons for this desired belief. I think maybe most of us have played this card at one time or another when for whatever reason we just didn't want to believe in somebody's guilt despite overwhelming information saying differently.

I think you missed this from the OP:

"When he was arrested by the Thai federal police last year, Dokset explained that June had died accidentally during a scuffle in which she hit her head on the wall and fallen down the stairs."

Accidental killing? Manslaughter? Premeditated murder?

I'm not playing any cards. I don't want to believe anything. I would be interested only in the truth.

You guys aren't interested in the truth as you cling to your beliefs. Your belief is that he must have killed her because of the way he disposed of the body. There will never be any physical evidence to prove it one way or the other so there is reasonable doubt, isn't there?

Edited by tropo
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This is not a case of if he killed her but the circumstances under which he killed her. The guy has admitted he killed his girlfriend during a fight and has admitted to hiding the body for years in his home.

Presumed innocence is simply a legal term (for the court rooms) which means a defendant shouldn't have to prove his innocence but rather the state needs to prove his guilt. Presumed innocence also only applies to those actually judging the accused including judges, all over the world, who often hold these "innocent" people in jail before and during trial.

Can you imagine telling a loved one, such a daughter that has been raped, that they have to believe their attacker is innocent unless the judge says otherwise?

I could be wrong but when people bring up presumed innocence and try to act as though it applies to people expressing opinions outside of court, such as on a discussion forum, I think they know better and for whatever reason just don't want to believe in the person's guilt but for whatever reason are incapable or unwilling to share their reasons for this desired belief. I think maybe most of us have played this card at one time or another when for whatever reason we just didn't want to believe in somebody's guilt despite overwhelming information saying differently.

I think you missed this from the OP:

"When he was arrested by the Thai federal police last year, Dokset explained that June had died accidentally during a scuffle in which she hit her head on the wall and fallen down the stairs."

Accidental killing? Manslaughter? Premeditated murder?

I'm not playing any cards. I don't want to believe anything. I would be interested only in the truth.

You guys aren't interested in the truth as you cling to your beliefs.

What do you think I missed? As I said, he has admitted to killing her during a fight and also admitted to hiding the body for years. As I stated in the first line of my post "This is not a case of if he killed her but the circumstances under which he killed her."

So, I am not really sure what you think I missed because what you are quoting only confirms what I wrote.

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It is outrageous that a man on trial for his life cannot be given the services of a properly qualified interpreter. How can he get a fair hearing there is any doubt in anybody's mind about what is actually being said in court?

What steps are being taken by Denmark to ensure one of their nationals is treated as equitably as a Thai person before a Danish court would?

Thailand's record on human rights is not a proud one and this case should be taken, if necessary, to the International Court of Human Rights to ensure a fair outcome.

More outrageous that there is an assumption that the interpreter isn't qualified when the court, the prosecutors and the defendant's 3 lawyers have no problem with her and the only one who does is a guy who doesn't speak or understand fluent Thai that killed his girlfriend and kept her body in the house for years.

If he doesn't like the court appointed and paid for interpreter than he should hire his own... or better yet just not kill your girlfriend and stick her in a box and shuffle her corpse around the house for years.

You're getting a bit ahead of yourself here. At this stage it is only alleged that he killed his girlfriend. That's what courtrooms are for - to save ourselves from people like you who can't comprehend the concept of presumption of innocence. You'd have been right at home during the witch burning era.
This is not a case of if he killed her but the circumstances under which he killed her. The guy has admitted he killed his girlfriend during a fight and has admitted to hiding the body for years in his home.

Presumed innocence is simply a legal term (for the court rooms) which means a defendant shouldn't have to prove his innocence but rather the state needs to prove his guilt. Presumed innocence also only applies to those actually judging the accused including judges, all over the world, who often hold these "innocent" people in jail before and during trial.

Can you imagine telling a loved one, such a daughter that has been raped, that they have to believe their attacker is innocent unless the judge says otherwise?

I could be wrong but when people bring up presumed innocence and try to act as though it applies to people expressing opinions outside of court, such as on a discussion forum, I think they know better and for whatever reason just don't want to believe in the person's guilt but for whatever reason are incapable or unwilling to share their reasons for this desired belief. I think maybe most of us have played this card at one time or another when for whatever reason we just didn't want to believe in somebody's guilt despite overwhelming information saying differently.

Presumed innocent is a court phrase ! Not that I believe that this guy is innocent, but he has yet not been proven guilty!! If I go home with a girl and she go to the police the next day claiming I raped her, it doesn't make me neither guilty nor innocent. But if I didn't rape her I am not guilty of rape, I might be guilty because I have a wife!!! - slightly off topic, but this guy is not guilty no matter if your daughter say he is!!! - I have two sons myself, and I know where your emotions are placed, if someone "killed" my son by accident it would be hard for me to accept -someone- innocent. Make no asumptions, this guy might be guilty, but who say he is? you are, without knowing anything but what you read on the internet!!!

Edited by Kripe
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Three lawyers and they can't get the right translator? What is missing here?

For the lawyers the woman seemed Ok.

Maybe they had not enough conversation what Dokset believes is ok.

He probably feared she would spilling gossip later in the newspaper. Or,he did not like, what she or the newspaper wrote about him beforehand.

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This is Thailand. Guilty or not, does anyone blame this guy for being quiet? I hope not.

I certainly don't. It is his right not to testify.

But here in the realm with it's xenophobic disposition they hate farang with a vengeance.

As for human rights, thay is not in their dictionary.

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This is not a case of if he killed her but the circumstances under which he killed her. The guy has admitted he killed his girlfriend during a fight and has admitted to hiding the body for years in his home.

Presumed innocence is simply a legal term (for the court rooms) which means a defendant shouldn't have to prove his innocence but rather the state needs to prove his guilt. Presumed innocence also only applies to those actually judging the accused including judges, all over the world, who often hold these "innocent" people in jail before and during trial.

Can you imagine telling a loved one, such a daughter that has been raped, that they have to believe their attacker is innocent unless the judge says otherwise?

I could be wrong but when people bring up presumed innocence and try to act as though it applies to people expressing opinions outside of court, such as on a discussion forum, I think they know better and for whatever reason just don't want to believe in the person's guilt but for whatever reason are incapable or unwilling to share their reasons for this desired belief. I think maybe most of us have played this card at one time or another when for whatever reason we just didn't want to believe in somebody's guilt despite overwhelming information saying differently.

I think you missed this from the OP:

"When he was arrested by the Thai federal police last year, Dokset explained that June had died accidentally during a scuffle in which she hit her head on the wall and fallen down the stairs."

There will never be any physical evidence to prove it one way or the other so there is reasonable doubt, isn't there?

So, his wrongdoing, hiding the body, lying about all and not inform the authorities, servers him now well,

if the circumstances of the death had not been so innocent as he is stating? rolleyes.gif

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It is outrageous that a man on trial for his life cannot be given the services of a properly qualified interpreter. How can he get a fair hearing there is any doubt in anybody's mind about what is actually being said in court?

What steps are being taken by Denmark to ensure one of their nationals is treated as equitably as a Thai person before a Danish court would?

Thailand's record on human rights is not a proud one and this case should be taken, if necessary, to the International Court of Human Rights to ensure a fair outcome.

Danish ???coffee1.gif Read the report again...He Is NORWEGIAN by all other reports.sad.png

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Do Thai courts have recognised interpreters, or are they accepting anybody who claims to speak the Thai and English?

There is / was an interpreter in a Pattaya court who is Danish yet is accepted as an English interpreter. One of his claims to fame is that many years ago he was the only foreigner invited to Kamnan Poh's birthday party !

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Dokset murder trial postponed for want of a translator
Phuket Gazette

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The murder trial of Stein Havard Dokset has been postponed until August 22. Photo: Atchaa Khamlo

PHUKET: -- The murder trial of Stein Havard Dokset was due to continue today but was postponed until August 22 after it was discovered that no court translator was available.

Mr Dokset, accused of murdering his ex-girlfriend Rungnapa Suktong and leaving her remains in a trash bin for months, appeared at Phuket Provincial Court today at 9am (story here).

After a six-hour wait, the judge informed the court that an English-Thai translator was not available.

A Phuket reporter volunteered to be the translator, but Mr Dokset refused, saying he wanted to use the court translator.

“We have had a heavy caseload and neglected to book a translator in advance. We tried to find one this afternoon, but could not,” the judge said.

“The case is postponed to August 22, at which time the case investigators will be called in to give their statements in court again,” he added.

Source: http://www.phuketgazette.net/phuket_news/2013/Dokset-murder-trial-postponed-for-want-of-a-translator-20441.html

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-- Phuket Gazette 2013-03-09

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It is outrageous that a man on trial for his life cannot be given the services of a properly qualified interpreter. How can he get a fair hearing there is any doubt in anybody's mind about what is actually being said in court?

What steps are being taken by Denmark to ensure one of their nationals is treated as equitably as a Thai person before a Danish court would?

Thailand's record on human rights is not a proud one and this case should be taken, if necessary, to the International Court of Human Rights to ensure a fair outcome.

Yes the man should be given a fair hearing whether he turns out to be guilty or not. It is unconscionable that a case of this magnitude is not transparently fair - just picking up any old mucker from the street and trying to persuade their acceptance is just not on. But then again it is Thai culture and its not Chinese New Year anymore. This smells worse than his house. It seems they just want to get the conviction, take the photos and cobblers to justice. Thai style!

How does anybody know this translator is not recognised/certified?

Ah, posy 58 answers this.

In that case, yes, I understand his refusal, I'd want to be guaranteed my words are translated correctly, and not be dependent on somebody who is kind of enough to try to help out but who is not trained for this.

Edited by stevenl
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