Indian tourist punched and kicked outside South Pattaya shopping mall

[Tomtomtom69]

in Mongkok or Temple street Hong Kong yes.... but in pattaya without provocation ..herm??

I don't think so - Hong Kong people are decent and civil they wouldn't kick anyone without provocation that's only in Jackie Chan movies where you might see such things. Pattaya? maybe...me thinks that although few Thai vendors would act like this perhaps there's more to this story.

[Espen]

This is becoming a regularity in the 'land of smiles'. Very quickly replacing this slogan with "land of thieves, cheats, stupidity, scumbags" I now know of at least a dozen people who have said they will never return to Thailand again. In 10 years this country will be stuffed. Others around them are so much smarter

I completely disagree with you! In 8 years I have never been stolen from or cheated by stupid scumbags. Of course some people have bad experiences, that happens everywhere. But all in all I think Thailand is great. In 10 years Thailand will still be great, and maybe even have better internet.

[Tomtomtom69]

Which Thai PM once said: If you have an Indian on one side and a rattlesnake on the other side and you hold a stick in your hands, you will beat the Indian first?

Indians are disliked in Thailand, still till 20 years ago any self respecting condominium owner or business owner had Sikh security guards at his service and you could only make it over his death body. But the real reason for the dislike of Indians is of course that they form close communities, are with the Chinese controlling probably 80% of Thailand's wealth and they are known for holding their Thai employees in high regards.

That's interesting because I have never seen an Indian security guard in Thailand. I suspect there just aren't enough Indians in Thailand period - Thailand ain't Malaysia or Singapore.

[Tomtomtom69]

must asked for stupid discount

At Asiatique recently a middle aged Indian man tried to get a 1-Baht discount on an item that had a fixed price tag of 89 Baht. Whatever that item was (I didn't pay attention to it but must have been some cheap souvenir), trying to get it for 88 Baht was just a joke. My friends and I just walked past that man, laughing.

[Jingthing]

must asked for stupid discount

At Asiatique recently a middle aged Indian man tried to get a 1-Baht discount on an item that had a fixed price tag of 89 Baht. Whatever that item was (I didn't pay attention to it but must have been some cheap souvenir), trying to get it for 88 Baht was just a joke. My friends and I just walked past that man, laughing.

Even if that story is true, which I doubt, so what? I hope you are not suggesting we're supposed to draw conclusions about all Indian people based on that silly incident.

[Tomtomtom69]

Normally if one stall attendant is away eating or at the bathroom etc. the others take care of the stall for them but might not actually make the sale. They would most likely say that the vendor will be right back and try to keep them there. They don't care what race they are as long as it is money coming in and are generally not prejudice (or at least wouldn't show it).

In many years in Thailand I have never seen a Thai attack ANYONE unless it was provoked. Even if foreigners point at an item with their feet, they are tolerant as they know it is not our culture.

110% we will get a different story after the police have talked to the other vendors.

I would like to agree with you because I have never seen or encountered any unprovoked attacks in all my years coming here but browsing through stories on TV like the one where a young British tourist was attacked, seemingly out of nowhere seems to defy the whole "Thais don't attack anyone unless provoked" statement.

[gtm2k]

This is why Thailand is pushing for the quality tourist. This sort of thing tarnishes Thailand's reputation. If these people were quality tourists they wouldn't be shopping at market stalls they would be in Major Department stores shopping for designer items (made in India & Bangladesh). This incident would not have happened.

Mate,regardless,they shouldn't have been attacked by the mob.

quite true. I was using just a touch of sarcasm.

either ways : whatever you're saying - not at all cool !

Edited July 5, 2013 by gtm2k

[Espen]

must asked for stupid discount

Following that reasoning I would get kicked every day.

[Espen]

This is why Thailand is pushing for the quality tourist. This sort of thing tarnishes Thailand's reputation. If these people were quality tourists they wouldn't be shopping at market stalls they would be in Major Department stores shopping for designer items (made in India & Bangladesh). This incident would not have happened.

Mate,regardless,they shouldn't have been attacked by the mob.

quite true. I was using just a touch of sarcasm.

I wonder what is a snob like you doing on a free forum. Why dont you take ur utter non-sense to a paid only forum , where you will find more snobs and show-offs like yourself.

Looks like a lot of ppl didn`t get your post chooka.

[gtm2k]

Any tourist getting abused in any form, not acceptable at all !
But for anyone who has been in thailand for long - pattaya is the last place you want to go for anything but a "peaceful" outing. Folks are rough about everything and it takes a nano-second to pick a fight with almost anyone.

[Espen]

must asked for stupid discount

At Asiatique recently a middle aged Indian man tried to get a 1-Baht discount on an item that had a fixed price tag of 89 Baht. Whatever that item was (I didn't pay attention to it but must have been some cheap souvenir), trying to get it for 88 Baht was just a joke. My friends and I just walked past that man, laughing.

He probably started on a 70% discount a while before you got there.

http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/2007/12/11/how-to-negotiate-like-an-indian-7-rules/

Edited July 5, 2013 by Espen

[Tomtomtom69]

Qulification: I have lived in India; still vist thes, Bagladesh and Pakistan on e aregular basis and altough you cannot tar them all with the same brush, they are generally arrogant and bullish with anyobe who is deemed as a lower caste than them [street vendors and sales assistants for example]. I try to never be in a sales queue if one is ahead me. I was in Robinsons recently and watched one having a fit becouse he couldn't get a bigger discount the the 30% that was already on the lable. The assistant filanly got fed up and asked him to standing aside so she could serve other customers. He went ballastic, demading to see the store manager - who turned up with a coulpe of securtity guards and quietly lead him away. Have you witnessed them all at Subarnivum, with their SONY Bravias under their arms and all trying to get bargains/discounts and free gifts at the duty free shops!?! Lastly but not least - you must have witnessed them trying to take masses of bags through as carry-on. All that of course can be blamed on their culture - but surely, even in India, soap and deoderant is readily available!

I've been to India twice this year - to Kolkata and surrounding areas of West Bengal. I don't know the obsession with buying goods here that they can find over there in India, probably at lower prices - I found a good range of goods, just like here except shopping malls were a bit farther away from each other than here. OK so I haven't exactly compared the prices of electronic goods in India with Thailand, but for everything else where I have, India is substantially cheaper (food, taxis, accommodation, even many manufactured goods like shampoo and deodorant). This is not surprising given the lower cost of living in India compared to Thailand and the much larger domestic market hence they have larger economies of scale when they produce things in India compared to Thailand. If Indians really want to pick up bargains on electronic goods and the like, Singapore, Hong Kong and even the USA have a better range and much better prices than Thailand (particularly the USA).

[uptheos]

must asked for stupid discount

At Asiatique recently a middle aged Indian man tried to get a 1-Baht discount on an item that had a fixed price tag of 89 Baht. Whatever that item was (I didn't pay attention to it but must have been some cheap souvenir), trying to get it for 88 Baht was just a joke. My friends and I just walked past that man, laughing.

Even if that story is true, which I doubt, so what? I hope you are not suggesting we're supposed to draw conclusions about all Indian people based on that silly incident.

+1

Ridiculous story!

[Rimmer]

Some Inflammatory and racist posts removed

[Tomtomtom69]

must asked for stupid discount

At Asiatique recently a middle aged Indian man tried to get a 1-Baht discount on an item that had a fixed price tag of 89 Baht. Whatever that item was (I didn't pay attention to it but must have been some cheap souvenir), trying to get it for 88 Baht was just a joke. My friends and I just walked past that man, laughing.

Even if that story is true, which I doubt, so what? I hope you are not suggesting we're supposed to draw conclusions about all Indian people based on that silly incident.

Umm yes, duh I was standing near the Indian man and overheard this exact conversation - you weren't there so why would I come and lie on a forum like this to prove a point? However, in no way am I implying that they all negotiate like this man did - but he sure was making a fuss over one Baht.

[Robi Schwab]

I must say I am surprised that anyone would want to kick an Indian. Any business dealings I have had with Indians have been thoroughly professional, pleasant and fair. Uh hum!

You're lucky. . . .and how would anyone know. . . there is more to this story.

Indians can like anyone else be incredibly arrogant.

They come from a society with one of the most rigid class and caste systems anywhere in the world.

It is frequently difficult for some of them to forget where they are in the scheme of things when they leave their mother

country.

Wealthy middle class Indians have given me a lot of grief in many circumstances. So much I have actually started to avoid them.

I know this is wrong of me but it has happened. There are obviously beautiful people from there, however they can be

very judgemental and Thais demand respect. Fair enough.

Who know what happened.

You said it; thais demand respect whereas people from more civilozed places command respect

Sent from my GT-S5660 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

No my friend, I don't know where you're from but the place where I was born and bred we were raised to EARN respect. Something that very FEW people of our current day & age understands.

[chuang]

must asked for stupid discount

Yes that's true, i used to go to Pratunam and the way they bargain either make the vendors sick or good for a laugh....price 100 baht and they bargain to 20 baht. ...or they ask to look at almost every item but not buying at the end,,,,I am not saying every Indian does it but at Pratunam most do it..

[JO1973]

Next time punch back.

[Jingthing]

must asked for stupid discount

Yes that's true, i used to go to Pratunam and the way they bargain either make the vendors sick or good for a laugh....price 100 baht and they bargain to 20 baht. ...or they ask to look at almost every item but not buying at the end,,,,I am not saying every Indian does it but at Pratunam most do it..

Yes I can see how that would be annoying for vendors. If that happened to me, I might become rude, and confront them with a: are you going to buy something or not? Yes, chasing them away basically. Still not justified to violently attack them.

[uptheos]

must asked for stupid discount

Yes that's true, i used to go to Pratunam and the way they bargain either make the vendors sick or good for a laugh....price 100 baht and they bargain to 20 baht. ...or they ask to look at almost every item but not buying at the end,,,,I am not saying every Indian does it but at Pratunam most do it..

What would be your starting price, IF you were bargaining on a 100 baht item?

(Irrespective if you're a CC or moneybags)

[nachiket]

In general terms, Thais are very prejudice with dark skin people. This kind of behavior is not unusual when you compare it to some Western countries 50...100 years ago. Thais are constantly reminded that the "lighter the skin" the better you are in the social class. One cannot help but find whiteners in shower gels, soaps, face cleansers, creams--the list goes on. Then when you see the advertisements or actors on Thai TV, they are lilly white, (whiter than I am). Hopefully in the future an open discussion in Thai media will question this attitude and the media industry will start showing dark skin people in most of the movies and television programs. True, many Indians come off in Pattaya as rude or "clueless" --but this is a cultural difference. If anyone has visited India, they would notice how one crowds around a sale counter instead of lining up, or the loudest voice gets the attention. Ones space is not a choice where you live in one of the most populated countries, so it is common for an Indian to rub right against you when in an elevator or standing. I would doubt that this Indian father and mother with their two kids were doing anything uncommon. Many times I have had to look for the clerk at a stall or even at Central in order to purchase something. We can all relate to this. For a "mob reaction" to start fighting with this visitor is unacceptable. I feel India should tell their new travelors outside their country to avoid Pattaya. Jet ski scams and negative attitudes here are not worth the hassle.

The problem with our (Indian) people is;

1] Mostly our womens are dark, fat and covered. In Pattaya it's exactly opposite. No need to say EYE POPPING for Indians. (i.e. my country people.)

2] We have limited fancy goods or articles. Thailand's market is flooded with Chinese goods. Again, EYE POPPING.

3] We always try to grab attention by speaking loudly and speak with hands. This is very disguise for others.

4] We have unnecessary learn to bargain everywhere, this is annoying for others.

5] If vendor says item is not for sale, we will ask loudly, "Why"?

6] We try to check things, even though we don't want to purchase. That blocks next customer of the vendors. And indeed very annoying.

7] Spitting habit is at it's worse in India.

List is very long. Govt. and travel agent must make them aware before leaving India.

I too several time ask my fellow people to behave properly, and they argue with me, "What am I doing wrong"?

[hellodolly]

This is why Thailand is pushing for the quality tourist. This sort of thing tarnishes Thailand's reputation. If these people were quality tourists they wouldn't be shopping at market stalls they would be in Major Department stores shopping for designer items (made in India & Bangladesh). This incident would not have happened.

Sounds to me like you are putting down all market stall operators.

I for one would like to hear the whole story. I personally find it hard to believe all those other market vendors were no longer there.

[Jingthing]

I enjoy observing the diversity of the different cultural patterns of the visitors and residents in Pattaya. But I'm not a vendor. I think it's unrealistic to expect short term tourists in a tourist resort to radically change cultural behaviors that have been normal to them all their lives. It would be smarter of the vendors to adjust THEIR behaviors and attitudes to account for the diversity of cultures that they encounter everyday. Yes their job is the peddle tourist dreck but another part of their role is being part of the Thailand tourism brand. Hopefully not so thuggish as the story in the OP.

Edited July 5, 2013 by Jingthing

[Espen]

In general terms, Thais are very prejudice with dark skin people. This kind of behavior is not unusual when you compare it to some Western countries 50...100 years ago. Thais are constantly reminded that the "lighter the skin" the better you are in the social class. One cannot help but find whiteners in shower gels, soaps, face cleansers, creams--the list goes on. Then when you see the advertisements or actors on Thai TV, they are lilly white, (whiter than I am). Hopefully in the future an open discussion in Thai media will question this attitude and the media industry will start showing dark skin people in most of the movies and television programs. True, many Indians come off in Pattaya as rude or "clueless" --but this is a cultural difference. If anyone has visited India, they would notice how one crowds around a sale counter instead of lining up, or the loudest voice gets the attention. Ones space is not a choice where you live in one of the most populated countries, so it is common for an Indian to rub right against you when in an elevator or standing. I would doubt that this Indian father and mother with their two kids were doing anything uncommon. Many times I have had to look for the clerk at a stall or even at Central in order to purchase something. We can all relate to this. For a "mob reaction" to start fighting with this visitor is unacceptable. I feel India should tell their new travelors outside their country to avoid Pattaya. Jet ski scams and negative attitudes here are not worth the hassle.

The problem with our (Indian) people is;

1] Mostly our womens are dark, fat and covered. In Pattaya it's exactly opposite. No need to say EYE POPPING for Indians. (i.e. my country people.)

2] We have limited fancy goods or articles. Thailand's market is flooded with Chinese goods. Again, EYE POPPING.

3] We always try to grab attention by speaking loudly and speak with hands. This is very disguise for others.

4] We have unnecessary learn to bargain everywhere, this is annoying for others.

5] If vendor says item is not for sale, we will ask loudly, "Why"?

6] We try to check things, even though we don't want to purchase. That blocks next customer of the vendors. And indeed very annoying.

7] Spitting habit is at it's worse in India.

List is very long. Govt. and travel agent must make them aware before leaving India.

I too several time ask my fellow people to behave properly, and they argue with me, "What am I doing wrong"?

Thank you for that list. It gives us a bit of insight from an Indian point of view.

Do you also have a list of good things about Indians?

[kurnell]

I must say I am surprised that anyone would want to kick an Indian. Any business dealings I have had with Indians have been thoroughly professional, pleasant and fair. Uh hum!

Oh god racism is alive and well. Bet you would say the same if it was an Arab. There is no reason for violence anytime no excuse unless attacked yourself or one of your loved ones.

What on earth are you talking about???

[uptheos]

In general terms, Thais are very prejudice with dark skin people. This kind of behavior is not unusual when you compare it to some Western countries 50...100 years ago. Thais are constantly reminded that the "lighter the skin" the better you are in the social class. One cannot help but find whiteners in shower gels, soaps, face cleansers, creams--the list goes on. Then when you see the advertisements or actors on Thai TV, they are lilly white, (whiter than I am). Hopefully in the future an open discussion in Thai media will question this attitude and the media industry will start showing dark skin people in most of the movies and television programs. True, many Indians come off in Pattaya as rude or "clueless" --but this is a cultural difference. If anyone has visited India, they would notice how one crowds around a sale counter instead of lining up, or the loudest voice gets the attention. Ones space is not a choice where you live in one of the most populated countries, so it is common for an Indian to rub right against you when in an elevator or standing. I would doubt that this Indian father and mother with their two kids were doing anything uncommon. Many times I have had to look for the clerk at a stall or even at Central in order to purchase something. We can all relate to this. For a "mob reaction" to start fighting with this visitor is unacceptable. I feel India should tell their new travelors outside their country to avoid Pattaya. Jet ski scams and negative attitudes here are not worth the hassle.

The problem with our (Indian) people is;

1] Mostly our womens are dark, fat and covered. In Pattaya it's exactly opposite. No need to say EYE POPPING for Indians. (i.e. my country people.)

2] We have limited fancy goods or articles. Thailand's market is flooded with Chinese goods. Again, EYE POPPING.

3] We always try to grab attention by speaking loudly and speak with hands. This is very disguise for others.

4] We have unnecessary learn to bargain everywhere, this is annoying for others.

5] If vendor says item is not for sale, we will ask loudly, "Why"?

6] We try to check things, even though we don't want to purchase. That blocks next customer of the vendors. And indeed very annoying.

7] Spitting habit is at it's worse in India.

List is very long. Govt. and travel agent must make them aware before leaving India.

I too several time ask my fellow people to behave properly, and they argue with me, "What am I doing wrong"?

Sorry to say this, but I'm having doubts that you are actually Indian.

[nachiket]

In general terms, Thais are very prejudice with dark skin people. This kind of behavior is not unusual when you compare it to some Western countries 50...100 years ago. Thais are constantly reminded that the "lighter the skin" the better you are in the social class. One cannot help but find whiteners in shower gels, soaps, face cleansers, creams--the list goes on. Then when you see the advertisements or actors on Thai TV, they are lilly white, (whiter than I am). Hopefully in the future an open discussion in Thai media will question this attitude and the media industry will start showing dark skin people in most of the movies and television programs. True, many Indians come off in Pattaya as rude or "clueless" --but this is a cultural difference. If anyone has visited India, they would notice how one crowds around a sale counter instead of lining up, or the loudest voice gets the attention. Ones space is not a choice where you live in one of the most populated countries, so it is common for an Indian to rub right against you when in an elevator or standing. I would doubt that this Indian father and mother with their two kids were doing anything uncommon. Many times I have had to look for the clerk at a stall or even at Central in order to purchase something. We can all relate to this. For a "mob reaction" to start fighting with this visitor is unacceptable. I feel India should tell their new travelors outside their country to avoid Pattaya. Jet ski scams and negative attitudes here are not worth the hassle.

The problem with our (Indian) people is;

1] Mostly our womens are dark, fat and covered. In Pattaya it's exactly opposite. No need to say EYE POPPING for Indians. (i.e. my country people.)

2] We have limited fancy goods or articles. Thailand's market is flooded with Chinese goods. Again, EYE POPPING.

3] We always try to grab attention by speaking loudly and speak with hands. This is very disguise for others.

4] We have unnecessary learn to bargain everywhere, this is annoying for others.

5] If vendor says item is not for sale, we will ask loudly, "Why"?

6] We try to check things, even though we don't want to purchase. That blocks next customer of the vendors. And indeed very annoying.

7] Spitting habit is at it's worse in India.

List is very long. Govt. and travel agent must make them aware before leaving India.

I too several time ask my fellow people to behave properly, and they argue with me, "What am I doing wrong"?

Thank you for that list. It gives us a bit of insight from an Indian point of view.

Do you also have a list of good things about Indians?

Yeah.

If you are dealing with doctors, engineers or several well qualified people, you will get totally different experience.

You can have your own software company with really good software developers and programmers. And you can compete with world market.

Business community people and service community people are very different in India.

We are the biggest gold consumer in the world, this will help you if you are an exporter.

[nosatisfaction]

In any civilized society, when people start to fight. onlookers try to break it up, but mob mentality rules here,its proven time and time again.

HERE?????????????????????????????????????????

[gerrythepoet]

Nachiket raised the overall assumptions of Indians in the behavioural context.

The issue is unknown to what actually transpired however the poster that noted that he was watching the situation unfold has a pretty good idea. If the vendor has gone away the natural thing would be to ask another vendor about purchasing the item. The longer one has to wait the more irritable one may become and in a Thai context that is impolite for one's voice then gets louder demanding attention. Sure they wanted to buy it but were becoming impatient since no one is around. Whatever class of Indian they maybe for them time would certainly be a priority and other than that perhaps the discount. To get a discount is like getting a pat on the back even the case of 1baht. Sounds silly but it is the ethos of gettting a better deal than another. Sorry to note that the event turned out ugly but cultural differences tend to rear their ugly head when one has to argue or fight for something.

[Totster]

It's nothing a minibus, 6 male indians and an iron bar won't sort out.....

totster