US government shuts down as Congress misses deadline

[Jingthing]

Tea party people, why don't they just start a third party and get it over with? The tea-publicans now want to impeach Obama. How can we impeach Ted Cruz? Think of what his ambitious antics have cost the American people already ... literally.

[NeverSure]

And that is the problem is it. You blokes don't believe that funding the health coverage of people who have never had it as a 'vital priority'.

Medicare - a form of socialised medicine for yourselves - yep, fund that.

Social security for yourselves - yep why not.

But health insurance for the first time for someone who has never had it or can't afford it - well, don't be silly....

Uh Huh. I paid all of my life into my Medicare and Social Security accounts. They are actual accounts in my name. When I was employed, my employer paid 1/2 of it. When I was self employed, I paid it all.

It worked out to about 14% of my gross income. All of my life. I paid for it.

How the hell is that "socialized?"

Do you ever have a clue what you are talking about?

[Jingthing]

Of course it's socialized. Think of the millions of people who paid all their life and died before they get benefits. Don't kid yourself. That's by design. Also of course you do not "own" those accounts. They aren't transferable. They aren't assets you can give to heirs. Case closed. Socialism that right wingers like. Now anyway. When the late great FDR was passing his wonderful NEW DEAL of course the same type of right wing reactionaries were objecting to those programs as socialist.

Edited October 16, 2013 by Jingthing

[NeverSure]

ObamaCare remains fully intact.

The Republican effort in the House to try to couple a defunding of ObamaCare with a shutdown of the US government is a 100% failure, a crackpot idea to begin with, a loser idea from its inception.

The House Republicans got nothing out of Prez Obama, who stood his ground, not budging an inch.

Texas Confederate Sen Ted Cruz is totally discredited except among the mooners of the tea party right.

The one thing the Republican shutdown of the US government got the United States is the statement by Fitch Credit Rating Agency that the US government is on a "negative credit watch" which means Fitch will reduce its highest credit rating, AAA, of the United States, by at least one notch. Congratulations to the fiscally irresponsible Republicans of the House.

And congratulations to the Republican party in Washington for causing 75% of all Americans to blame them for all the huge chaos and commotion of the past two weeks' government shutdown.

And a further sincere congratulations to the House Republicans for making ObamaCare more popular than it had been before the House Republicans' harebrained coupling scheme to try to defund and shutdown.

Appomattox Courthouse II.

GAME ALMOST OVER: Boehner To Let The Senate Debt Ceiling Deal Come To The Floor

The 2013 debt ceiling crisis and federal government shutdown are almost over.

House Speaker John Boehner has agreed to take up the Senate's plan to raise the nation's borrowing limit and reopen the government, National Review's Robert Costa reports.

Boehner will allow the bill to pass with mostly Democratic votes.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/debt-ceiling-senate-deal-plan-reid-mcconnell-boehner-house-vote-shutdown-2013-10#ixzz2hu1frBQM

You missed something BIG. Originally Reid of the Senate and Obama said they wouldn't negotiate at all and they didn't. But they couldn't bluff the House or Boehner.

NOW the Senate has gotten off its butt and proposed a compromise because Boehner holds all of the cards. This story is about the Senate caving in.

This is ONLY a vote on temporarily raising the debt ceiling. It hardly gets everything Obama wants. No one wants the government in a position to not pay its bills, so the SENATE CAVED. The Senate blinked first.

It's only a temporary stopgap measure, good through Feb 7, 2014. IF it passes. It also sets up a Senate budget conference, as there has been no budget for 3 years!

"Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid and Minority Leader Mitch McConnell are close to a deal that would fund the government through mid-January and raise the debt ceiling through Feb. 7. It also will set up a budget conference that would end no later than Dec. 13."

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/debt-ceiling-senate-deal-plan-reid-mcconnell-boehner-house-vote-shutdown-2013-10#ixzz2hu9AXtmU

Edited October 17, 2013 by Scott

[Jingthing]

The insane destructive tea party wants to continue to terrorize the country with their threats. No, they aren't through yet. The people must kick them out in 2014.

[Publicus]

ObamaCare remains fully intact.

The Republican effort in the House to try to couple a defunding of ObamaCare with a shutdown of the US government is a 100% failure, a crackpot idea to begin with, a loser idea from its inception.

The House Republicans got nothing out of Prez Obama, who stood his ground, not budging an inch.

Texas Confederate Sen Ted Cruz is totally discredited except among the mooners of the tea party right.

The one thing the Republican shutdown of the US government got the United States is the statement by Fitch Credit Rating Agency that the US government is on a "negative credit watch" which means Fitch will reduce its highest credit rating, AAA, of the United States, by at least one notch. Congratulations to the fiscally irresponsible Republicans of the House.

And congratulations to the Republican party in Washington for causing 75% of all Americans to blame them for all the huge chaos and commotion of the past two weeks' government shutdown.

And a further sincere congratulations to the House Republicans for making ObamaCare more popular than it had been before the House Republicans' harebrained coupling scheme to try to defund and shutdown.

Appomattox Courthouse II.

GAME ALMOST OVER: Boehner To Let The Senate Debt Ceiling Deal Come To The Floor

The 2013 debt ceiling crisis and federal government shutdown are almost over.

House Speaker John Boehner has agreed to take up the Senate's plan to raise the nation's borrowing limit and reopen the government, National Review's Robert Costa reports.

Boehner will allow the bill to pass with mostly Democratic votes.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/debt-ceiling-senate-deal-plan-reid-mcconnell-boehner-house-vote-shutdown-2013-10#ixzz2hu1frBQM

You missed something BIG. Originally Reid of the Senate and Obama said they wouldn't negotiate at all and they didn't. But they couldn't bluff the House or Boehner.

NOW the Senate has gotten off its butt and proposed a compromise because Boehner holds all of the cards. This story is about the Senate caving in.

This is ONLY a vote on temporarily raising the debt ceiling. It hardly gets everything Obama wants. No one wants the government in a position to not pay its bills, so the SENATE CAVED. The Senate blinked first.

It's only a temporary stopgap measure, good through Feb 7, 2014. IF it passes.

"Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid and Minority Leader Mitch McConnell are close to a deal that would fund the government through mid-January and raise the debt ceiling through Feb. 7. It also will set up a budget conference that would end no later than Dec. 13."

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/debt-ceiling-senate-deal-plan-reid-mcconnell-boehner-house-vote-shutdown-2013-10#ixzz2hu9AXtmU

More tea party written home schooling Civics lessons.

[NeverSure]

Of course it's socialized. Think of the millions of people who paid all their life and died before they get benefits. Don't kid yourself. That's by design. Also of course you do not "own" those accounts. They aren't transferable. They aren't assets you can give to heirs. Case closed. Socialism that right wingers like. Now anyway. When the late great FDR was passing his wonderful NEW DEAL of course the same type of right wing reactionaries were objecting to those programs as socialist.

Yes. It's like buying insurance. Some collect and some don't but at least if you collect you paid the premiums yourself.

Do you consider buying insurance socialism? Do you ever think these things through, to understand that some of us paid all of our lives, and others want in who didn't ever pay?

BTW, Social Security is the worst investment I ever made. With the magic of compound interest, do you realize how much money I'd have if I had been allowed, or even forced, to put 15% of my gross earnings just in a savings account all of my life? I started paying in when I was 16 years old. That imaginary account would run into the $millions, and it would belong to me and my heirs.

Edited October 16, 2013 by NeverSure

[Publicus]

The Republicans in Washington got nothing out of all this, nothing - absolutely nothing..

ObamaCare is 100% intact.

The government will reopen.

The debt ceiling is being increased.

The Republicans got nothing.

The only thing that actually happened is that we the people got shafted by the Republicans for the past two weeks.

And, yes, the tea party will be back.

Prez Obama is giving them all the rope they'll take.

[NeverSure]

The Republicans in Washington got nothing out of all this, nothing - absolutely nothing..

ObamaCare is 100% intact.

The government will reopen.

The debt ceiling is being increased.

The Republicans got nothing.

The only thing that actually happened is that we the people got shafted by the Republicans for the past two weeks.

And, yes, the tea party will be back.

Prez Obama is giving them all the rope they'll take.

You don't get it. Read the article again. Reid of the Senate, and Obama said from the beginning that they wouldn't negotiate. NOW this negotiation is all Senate among itself, with Reid and the Senate Minority leader hammering out a deal to propose to the House.

Nothing has been voted on and it's not guaranteed to pass either the Senate or the House.

At best it's begging for a few more weeks, when the whole issue comes up again. The House hasn't promised to pass it, although they probably will since it nowhere near gives Obama everything he wants, and is extremely temporary. It Just kicks the can down the road for about 3 months.

Your pretty Obama boys in the Senate caved and are desperately working by themselves to try to formulate a deal that the House "might" pass.

Your Senate and beloved Obama blinked. Get over it.

[Baloo22]

Tea party people, why don't they just start a third party and get it over with? The tea-publicans now want to impeach Obama. How can we impeach Ted Cruz? Think of what his ambitious antics have cost the American people already ... literally.

We need more of them in the existing two major political parties. The fiscal sanity that they strive to impart to the federal government is much more important than starting a third party. We need more of that and a lot less of the petulant and vindictive antics of the Obama regime. We need more fiscal discipline in our federal government and less out-of-control debt-fueled spending of the Obama regime and the Democrat Party.

It was not and is not any "ambitious antics" of Senator Ted Cruz that cost the American people during the Obama-Reid shutdown. Truly repulsive was the spiteful and childish behavior of the zero-integrity Obama and his politically inspired "closures". Obama's selective closures and "Make the People feel the Pain" policy was truly embarrassing.

For the future citizens who will have to suffer with and pay off this enormous federal debt, we must elect more "Tea-Party" people into Congress. More people willing to stand up to and fight against Obama. Then we may have a chance to becoming an economic invalid like Greece.

[Publicus]

You initiated the presumptuous assertion that those of us who prefer the Affordable Care Act to the previous financial and medical anarchy are "EuroLibs" who "wholly subscribe to the EuroLib thinking," so the presumptive burden is on you to say what that is, and to pronounce to me exactly how you see that I fit into your conception of whatever it is.

You're arbitrarily throwing around terminologies and summarily consigning people into some new and unknown category, according to your own ideologies, biases, prejudices.

Don't you see?!

You need to explain yourself no matter.

[Publicus]

Tea party people, why don't they just start a third party and get it over with? The tea-publicans now want to impeach Obama. How can we impeach Ted Cruz? Think of what his ambitious antics have cost the American people already ... literally.

We need more of them in the existing two major political parties. The fiscal sanity that they strive to impart to the federal government is much more important than starting a third party. We need more of that and a lot less of the petulant and vindictive antics of the Obama regime. We need more fiscal discipline in our federal government and less out-of-control debt-fueled spending of the Obama regime and the Democrat Party.

It was not and is not any "ambitious antics" of Senator Ted Cruz that cost the American people during the Obama-Reid shutdown. Truly repulsive was the spiteful and childish behavior of the zero-integrity Obama and his politically inspired "closures". Obama's selective closures and "Make the People feel the Pain" policy was truly embarrassing.

For the future citizens who will have to suffer with and pay off this enormous federal debt, we must elect more "Tea-Party" people into Congress. More people willing to stand up to and fight against Obama. Then we may have a chance to becoming an economic invalid like Greece.

Your side lost.

That's principally because everything you say is not accurate.

Present day Republicans in the House are fiscally and monetarily irresponsible and, moreover, reckless.

This coupling of ObamaCare and shutting down the government was a Plan 9 From Outer Space.

It never had any possibilities. It was and remains a complete fantasy that cost taxpayers and the United States dearly.

Republican fiscal insanity.

Republican party claims to govern are now forfeit.

Edited October 16, 2013 by Publicus

[Jingthing]

Yes, the republicans need to be put on long term time out. They are the crying babies of parties. The democrats aren't perfect but they are adults and not INSANE.

[StevieH]

Of course it's socialized. Think of the millions of people who paid all their life and died before they get benefits. Don't kid yourself. That's by design. Also of course you do not "own" those accounts. They aren't transferable. They aren't assets you can give to heirs. Case closed. Socialism that right wingers like. Now anyway. When the late great FDR was passing his wonderful NEW DEAL of course the same type of right wing reactionaries were objecting to those programs as socialist.

Yes. It's like buying insurance. Some collect and some don't but at least if you collect you paid the premiums yourself.

Do you consider buying insurance socialism? Do you ever think these things through, to understand that some of us paid all of our lives, and others want in who didn't ever pay?

BTW, Social Security is the worst investment I ever made. With the magic of compound interest, do you realize how much money I'd have if I had been allowed, or even forced, to put 15% of my gross earnings just in a savings account all of my life? I started paying in when I was 16 years old. That imaginary account would run into the $millions, and it would belong to me and my heirs.

I started paying when I was 17 and stopped when I was 70. How about them illiegal immigrants that are getting it after paying NOTHING...or the millions that have gone on Social Security disability after failing to find gainful employment during Obama's longest recovery in the history of the US?

This is just phase one of the defunding of Obamacare. It will implode on its own in the end. The cost will be in the Trillions.

*Deleted post edited out*

the thing is though, we do get it. that's the point. that all those other countries that have far more socialised healthcare than obamacare just get along fine. and look after the poorest and most vulnerable of their 'societies'. it's about being nice to people you'll never meet. something republicans simply don't seem to understand.

[StevieH]

Yes, the republicans need to be put on long term time out. They are the crying babies of parties. The democrats aren't perfect but they are adults and not INSANE.

yes, they're far from perfect but they at least aren't fundamentalists. they are prepared to accept that times change, people change, nations change and you have to adjust to deal with that or you don't survive. it's called time passing. it's sort of like believing in evolution. so back again to the whole republican self-defeating stuck in another century what don't change can't learn thing again.

[Baloo22]

Yes, the republicans need to be put on long term time out. They are the crying babies of parties. The democrats aren't perfect but they are adults and not INSANE.

No, it is the adults, the Republicans, that need to cut-up the credit card. We need those adults to control the insane debt-fueled spending of the democrats. They are the spoiled infants without any fiscal discipline. Otherwise we will end up an economic basket case like Greece.

[Baloo22]

Tea party people, why don't they just start a third party and get it over with? The tea-publicans now want to impeach Obama. How can we impeach Ted Cruz? Think of what his ambitious antics have cost the American people already ... literally.

We need more of them in the existing two major political parties. The fiscal sanity that they strive to impart to the federal government is much more important than starting a third party. We need more of that and a lot less of the petulant and vindictive antics of the Obama regime. We need more fiscal discipline in our federal government and less out-of-control debt-fueled spending of the Obama regime and the Democrat Party.

It was not and is not any "ambitious antics" of Senator Ted Cruz that cost the American people during the Obama-Reid shutdown. Truly repulsive was the spiteful and childish behavior of the zero-integrity Obama and his politically inspired "closures". Obama's selective closures and "Make the People feel the Pain" policy was truly embarrassing.

For the future citizens who will have to suffer with and pay off this enormous federal debt, we must elect more "Tea-Party" people into Congress. More people willing to stand up to and fight against Obama. Then we may have a chance to becoming an economic invalid like Greece.

Your side lost. That's principally because everything you say is not accurate. Present day Republicans in the House are fiscally and monetarily irresponsible and, moreover, reckless. This coupling of ObamaCare and shutting down the government was a Plan 9 From Outer Space.

It never had any possibilities. It was and remains a complete fantasy that cost taxpayers and the United States dearly. Republican fiscal insanity. Republican party claims to govern are now forfeit.

You fit right in with the democrats and the petulant man-child obama. You and they care far more about political ploys and polls than the future of the United States. It is the obama and the democrats that are the out-of-control spenders without any fiscal discipline or self-control.

The "Plan 9 From Outer Space" is the spend/charge-it, spend/charge-it, spend/charge-it of the democrat party. They will cost the taxpayers and the United States dearly. Democrat fiscal insanity!

We need the adults, the Republicans, to cut up the credit card and get fiscal control limits on the spoiled children of the democrat party.

[StevieH]

Yes, the republicans need to be put on long term time out. They are the crying babies of parties. The democrats aren't perfect but they are adults and not INSANE.

No, it is the adults, the Republicans, that need to cut-up the credit card. We need those adults to control the insane debt-fueled spending of the democrats. They are the spoiled infants without any fiscal discipline. Otherwise we will end up an economic basket case like Greece.

but countries are debt-fueled entities. that's what they do and how the whole thing works. greece is an extreme example and america will simply never end up like greece, it's impossible. do you honestly think that america would actually work and function if it had to break even or, as republicans think that everything should, 'make a profit'? it's beyond unrealistic and pure lunacy. some government initiatives lose money, like the NHS in the UK. that does not mean by definition that it is 'a bad thing'.

incidentally america could be so, so much better off tomorrow by halving its 'defense' budget. stop having unnecessary wars in places you've never heard of and you can fund every domestic program going and give everyone free ice-cream in a heartbeat.

[Publicus]

Yes, the republicans need to be put on long term time out. They are the crying babies of parties. The democrats aren't perfect but they are adults and not INSANE.

No, it is the adults, the Republicans, that need to cut-up the credit card. We need those adults to control the insane debt-fueled spending of the democrats. They are the spoiled infants without any fiscal discipline. Otherwise we will end up an economic basket case like Greece.

House Republicans failed while trying their best to turn the United States into another Greece right now.

In fact, the House Republican Plan 9 From Outer Space would have left Greece looking sane and fiscally sound.

It's the House Republicans who just tried to collapse the United States into another Greece.

But we stopped you, the American people overwhelmingly stopped you, because we are in the political center-middle while you guys are out in space trying to redirect a meteor to crash into the United States.

Republican fiscal insanity. The US body politic now recognizes that it cannot entrust governing to the newly radical Republican party.

It's curtains for you guys, and rightfully so.

[notmyself]

Prez Obama is giving them all the rope they'll take.

Should have given them a cross to nail themselves to.

The shutdown was never really about the ACA really as something else would have been picked instead.

All this has stopped real news from being broadcast such as the war on Christmas.

[Baloo22]

Yes, the republicans need to be put on long term time out. They are the crying babies of parties. The democrats aren't perfect but they are adults and not INSANE.

No, it is the adults, the Republicans, that need to cut-up the credit card. We need those adults to control the insane debt-fueled spending of the democrats. They are the spoiled infants without any fiscal discipline. Otherwise we will end up an economic basket case like Greece.

but countries are debt-fueled entities. that's what they do and how the whole thing works. greece is an extreme example and america will simply never end up like greece, it's impossible. do you honestly think that america would actually work and function if it had to break even or, as republicans think that everything should, 'make a profit'? it's beyond unrealistic and pure lunacy. some government initiatives lose money, like the NHS in the UK. that does not mean by definition that it is 'a bad thing'.

incidentally america could be so, so much better off tomorrow by halving its 'defense' budget. stop having unnecessary wars in places you've never heard of and you can fund every domestic program going and give everyone free ice-cream in a heartbeat.

You sound like someone in Greece in 2007; "Don't worry Korolos. Countries are debt-fueled entities. That's what they do and how the whole thing works. Greece will never end up having to beg and grovel for money from a country like Germany. Never happen! Don't worry about it!"

Now we have foolish people saying "America will simply never end up like Greece, it's impossible." Actually, yes, it could happen if we continue to spend-spend-spend on that unlimited federal government charge card.

As for your advocacy of reducing military spending; it's not the military that's the problem. It's the politicians of both parties that go by the policy of "reduce the military, just not in my district!" A prime and recent example of that was the obstruction of Sen. Jim Webb when faced with any reduction of military facilities or spending in Virginia. Do your research! Do your homework! Learn something!

For decades the military had tried to close unneeded bases and facilities. But they were always faced with the "not in my district" policy of the politicians. It wasn't until the "Base Realignment and Closure Commission (BRAC)" that the military was able to overcome the politicians crass political morals.

[F430murci]

Yes, the republicans need to be put on long term time out. They are the crying babies of parties. The democrats aren't perfect but they are adults and not INSANE.

No, it is the adults, the Republicans, that need to cut-up the credit card. We need those adults to control the insane debt-fueled spending of the democrats. They are the spoiled infants without any fiscal discipline. Otherwise we will end up an economic basket case like Greece.

but countries are debt-fueled entities. that's what they do and how the whole thing works. greece is an extreme example and america will simply never end up like greece, it's impossible. do you honestly think that america would actually work and function if it had to break even or, as republicans think that everything should, 'make a profit'? it's beyond unrealistic and pure lunacy. some government initiatives lose money, like the NHS in the UK. that does not mean by definition that it is 'a bad thing'.

incidentally america could be so, so much better off tomorrow by halving its 'defense' budget. stop having unnecessary wars in places you've never heard of and you can fund every domestic program going and give everyone free ice-cream in a heartbeat.

You sound like someone in Greece in 2007; "Don't worry Korolos. Countries are debt-fueled entities. That's what they do and how the whole thing works. Greece will never end up having to beg and grovel for money from a country like Germany. Never happen! Don't worry about it!"

Now we have foolish people saying "America will simply never end up like Greece, it's impossible." Actually, yes, it could happen if we continue to spend-spend-spend on that unlimited federal government charge card.

As for your advocacy of reducing military spending; it's not the military that's the problem. It's the politicians of both parties that go by the policy of "reduce the military, just not in my district!" A prime and recent example of that was the obstruction of Sen. Jim Webb when faced with any reduction of military facilities or spending in Virginia. Do your research! Do your homework! Learn something!

For decades the military had tried to close unneeded bases and facilities. But they were always faced with the "not in my district" policy of the politicians. It wasn't until the "Base Realignment and Closure Commission (BRAC)" that the military was able to overcome the politicians crass political morals.

OMG, you know nothing about Greece, financial or debt structure in US or marco and micro economics. Zero! . . ., but debate all you want . . .

On another note, this pretty much sums it up:

-----

"We fought the good fight. We just didn't win," he said on WLW radio in Ohio.

Boehner additionally confirmed that he would "absolutely" allow the whole House to vote on a plan introduced on Wednesday in the Senate. That bipartisan plan, unveiled by Senate leaders, would fund the government through mid-January and raise the debt ceiling until early February.

The speaker conducted the interview shortly before heading into a closed-door meeting with fellow Republicans, who might be reluctant to support the deal because it extracts few concessions from Democrats and does very little to undo Obamacare.

But Boehner said he'd encourage his colleagues to vote in favor of the agreement, which he said would reopen the government as soon as Thursday.

"There's no good reason for our members to vote 'no,'"

http://firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/16/20993759-boehner-we-fought-the-good-fight

[notmyself]

"We fought the good fight. We just didn't win,"

Not the only one to say it.

[notmyself]

Heroic Broken Sewage Pipe Floods Congress With Human Waste

WASHINGTONCalling the busted cylinder a national hero, sources confirmed Wednesday that a sewer pipe in the U.S. Capitol building valiantly burst open, pouring more than 1.5 million gallons of raw sewage into Congress and flooding the Senate and House of Representatives with human excrement, sludge, and wastewater. Someone or something had to step up and fight for the American people, and when I heard that explosion and then saw congressman after congressman get swept up by a massive wave of feces and urine, I knew that sewage pipe had done something truly brave and extraordinary, said one congressional source, adding the pipes heroics were evident from the outset when the initial explosion splattered Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX) with wadded-up toilet paper, sanitary napkins, vomit, and cholera-containing pathogens. Harry Reid must have guzzled down at least three thermosfuls of this brownish slop, and John Boehner was covered in human offal.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/heroic-broken-sewage-pipe-floods-congress-with-hum,34237/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=Status:2:Default

Edited October 17, 2013 by Scott
Color

[Scott]

Posts deleted including those inflammatory remarks and names. Replies to those posts have also been deleted. Please stay on topic.

[boomerangutang]

<quote> They (Europeans) don't have the manufacturing base or the modern technological inventions to sustain an economy like the US does.</quote>

Not quite true. The US of the 40's, 50's, 60's had manufacturing base and tech innovations, but that's been lessening as the decades roll by, except for silicon valley and fracking oil. Increasing numbers of Americans are producing nothing tangible of value. That includes all bureaucrats, Wall St. (and other) money manipulators, overvalued websites, and hordes of Americans on the dole.

I paid all of my life into my Medicare and Social Security accounts. They are actual accounts in my name. When I was employed, my employer paid 1/2 of it. When I was self employed, I paid it all.

It worked out to about 14% of my gross income. All of my life. I paid for it. How the hell is that "socialized?" Do you ever have a clue what you are talking about?

It's commendable that you paid in to the system. For that, you're probably now getting some decent pay-back. I was always self-employed, struggling to make ends meet, in the US. No one informed me, or recommended I pay in to SS voluntarily, but I figured it out, and made efforts to pay, even though I was v. low income (chimney sweep, firewood cutter, etc.). As soon as I started going straight and paying taxes, IRS demanded (unfairly) some comparatively big payments from me (I didn't know what they were, because I'm not an accountant), so it took the wind out of my sails. I paid the penalties, then dropped out again, and haven't paid taxes or SS since. Edited October 17, 2013 by boomerangutang

[boomerangutang]

Here is the tiniest tip of the iceberg on why medical procedures are outlandishly expensive in the US;

It is well known that hospitals charge for medical supplies far in

excess of what the products would cost at drug stores, but an August

New York Times investigation of "saline drips" vividly

demonstrated the disconnect. Though Medicare reimburses $1.07

for a 1-liter plastic bag of salt water (supplied by a subsidiary of

Morton Salt), White Plains (N.Y.) Hospital charged patients'

insurance companies like Aetna and United Healthcare $91 per bag.

Other hospitals decline to charge per-bag, listing only "IV therapy"

of, for example, $393.50 for hooking up the drip.

- New York Times, 8-27-2013

[webfact]

please continue:

US Senate votes to raise debt cap, reopen government

Full story: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/675149-us-senate-votes-to-raise-debt-cap-reopen-government/

//CLOSED//