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Scotland to become independent in March 2016 if referendum passes


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7x7 - There is no mechanism in place to deny Scottish residents that have paid into the NHS access to the NHS.

Your line about general taxation is a red herring - you know what the contract and obligation of NIC is. I believe at this moment in time you are kicking yourself in the realization that I'm right. It would be better that you admitted that the UK government will either have to honour the current agreement - or provide a lump sum to fund their obligation. There is no chance whatsoever of the UK government providing a lump sum, so they will have to grant access to the NHS for Scottish resident NI contributants.

Sometimes in life you have to put your hand up and admit that what you think should happen, and what will happen, are two totally different things.

No one pays into the NHS per se.

Scottish residents are the same as residents in all other parts of the UK. They pay taxes and NICs, if obliged to, part of which goes to fund the NHS.

NHS treatment is available to all UK residents, regardless of how much, or little, they may have paid in taxes and NICs.

An independent Scotland will not be part of the UK. Therefore residents in an independent Scotland will not be UK residents.

There is no logical nor fair reason why residents of an independent Scotland should be treated (no pun intended) in this or any other regard any differently to all other non UK residents. Including non UK residents who are British citizens.

But, of course, Yes supporters demand that they are given special treatment (again, no pun intended) in this and many other areas. Simply because you want independence for Scotland, yet want to retain all the rights and benefits of being part of the UK where that is to your advantage.

Sophistry - and this has nothing to do with yes voters.

Every Scottish resident that has paid into the UK NIC system is entitled to the benefits accrued. That includes the no voters. That includes the English born residents. Even those from Sussex.

I would imagine a line will be drawn under past NI payments. Scotland would inherit the hospitals, clinics, surgeries, dentists, equipment, staff, etc that is domiciled there and will have to fund it itself from then on. Likely an agreement will be made for cross charging (under E111? perhaps) for Scots in the UK and vice versa. I would suggest it will be a minor thing all in all compared to other considerations.

There's no way a line would drawn under past NI payments. The UK government will be obliged to fund/underwrite the NIC accrued benefits.

As for the assets - yes, this is what Salmond has said repeatedly. We will share the assets, and we will share the debts.

In the never-going-to-happen situation where the UK government denies Scotland it's fair share of assets, Salmond has stated that we will abrogate our share of the debt.

He was just being a cheeky b*gger when he said that. He knows the UK government are not that stupid.

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Both sides are posturing - what would you expect?

I personally feel that the Better Together campaign would have run a better campaign if they didn't posture. One example - re the fiscal union argument, instead of saying -

"There will never be a fiscal union," - they should have said, "of course you can join the sterling zone. You are very welcome - however we hope you realize that every decision we take will be in the interest of the UK economy. Sorry if that hurts your economy, not much we can do about that, old chum."

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Give us your money and we will give you the food banks...better together

give us your money and we will give you the bedroom tax better together

give us your money and the undemocratic House of lords can veto any bill they like better together

give us your money and we will trash you at all times unless its referendum posturing better together

give us your money and we will keep on perpetrating the myth that The Uk subsidizes Scotland better together

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<snip>

Every Scottish resident that has paid into the UK NIC system is entitled to the benefits accrued. That includes the no voters. That includes the English born residents. Even those from Sussex.

At the moment; yes.

While Scotland remains in the UK; yes.

But if Scotland leaves the UK; no.

You want it all; independence from the UK but retain the benefits of being part of the UK!

This is the core of your misunderstanding writ large.

I didn't say that all future Scottish residents would be entitled to full use of UK NIC related facilities. I said that the people who have paid in since 1947 and forward are entitled to see their NIC honoured. The UK government knows that.

So, for the purpose of clarity, if we get Independence in March 2016, a school leaver that year will only pay into the Scottish NIC pool. They will have no call on UK facilities. My point is clear - current contributions must be, and will be honoured.

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It will be a bog blow to the UK if the Scots bail out.

Toilets will never be in the equation........whistling.gif ....................laugh.png

Your tacking the p1$$...

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http://www.newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-opinion/9292-colonial-and-corrupt-times-up-for-bbc-scotland

THURSDAY, 05 JUNE 2014 22:22
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5d000e9463dea1cbf2d95e6c5575266e8c3a898a By G.A.Ponsonby

President Obama has spoken; the USA made a tragic mistake when it fought off colonial rule over 200 years ago. America wants to rejoin the self-styled 'greatest Union on earth'.

OK, not quite, but what an interesting question it would have been to the US President – why did they leave the UK when it was (then) a 100 year old success story?

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<snip>

Every Scottish resident that has paid into the UK NIC system is entitled to the benefits accrued. That includes the no voters. That includes the English born residents. Even those from Sussex.

At the moment; yes.

While Scotland remains in the UK; yes.

But if Scotland leaves the UK; no.

You want it all; independence from the UK but retain the benefits of being part of the UK!

This is the core of your misunderstanding writ large.

I didn't say that all future Scottish residents would be entitled to full use of UK NIC related facilities. I said that the people who have paid in since 1947 and forward are entitled to see their NIC honoured. The UK government knows that.

So, for the purpose of clarity, if we get Independence in March 2016, a school leaver that year will only pay into the Scottish NIC pool. They will have no call on UK facilities. My point is clear - current contributions must be, and will be honoured.

There is no point, as I have already said, in arguing this point any further with you or wigantojapanviagoogle.

Both of you are showing that you do not understand how the NI system works.

But I will ask you a question.

You say that anyone who has previously paid NICs since 1947 is entitled to 'see their NIC honoured.' Yet British citizens who have paid NICs for many years and now live outside the UK do not have full access to the NHS and are treated the same as all other non UK residents.

That is the situation now; why should residents of an independent Scotland, who will have chosen to leave the UK, be treated any differently to British citizens who have chosen to leave the UK and live abroad?

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<snip>

Every Scottish resident that has paid into the UK NIC system is entitled to the benefits accrued. That includes the no voters. That includes the English born residents. Even those from Sussex.

At the moment; yes.

While Scotland remains in the UK; yes.

But if Scotland leaves the UK; no.

You want it all; independence from the UK but retain the benefits of being part of the UK!

This is the core of your misunderstanding writ large.

I didn't say that all future Scottish residents would be entitled to full use of UK NIC related facilities. I said that the people who have paid in since 1947 and forward are entitled to see their NIC honoured. The UK government knows that.

So, for the purpose of clarity, if we get Independence in March 2016, a school leaver that year will only pay into the Scottish NIC pool. They will have no call on UK facilities. My point is clear - current contributions must be, and will be honoured.

There is no point, as I have already said, in arguing this point any further with you or wigantojapanviagoogle.

Both of you are showing that you do not understand how the NI system works.

But I will ask you a question.

You say that anyone who has previously paid NICs since 1947 is entitled to 'see their NIC honoured.' Yet British citizens who have paid NICs for many years and now live outside the UK do not have full access to the NHS and are treated the same as all other non UK residents.

That is the situation now; why should residents of an independent Scotland, who will have chosen to leave the UK, be treated any differently to British citizens who have chosen to leave the UK and live abroad?

Excuse me it is the sussex man yourself who changed the question and brought in the NIC

The original question was about NHS

You still clearly do not understand the basics of that no matter how many times i have told you

You have clearly stated the UKNHS

IS THERE A UK NHS NO

IS there a SCOTLAND NHS yes

Who pays for Scotland NHS Scottish parliament

Who pays for the Scottish residents treatment Scottish parliement.

does the English NHS pay for Scottish patients treatment NO

Do Scottish patients get free treatment in England No.

Now you have went onto another topic because you didnt want tosee the truth in the original question

Great ormond themselves said that as did the video link,,so you diversed onto the issue of non residents

Scottish citizens will still be citizens of Britain that has already been said by cabinet ministers in Westminister,,,They are not non resident..

Now you will tell me Britain and the Uk is the same and Scotland wanting all the benefits etcetc

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<snip>

Every Scottish resident that has paid into the UK NIC system is entitled to the benefits accrued. That includes the no voters. That includes the English born residents. Even those from Sussex.

At the moment; yes.

While Scotland remains in the UK; yes.

But if Scotland leaves the UK; no.

You want it all; independence from the UK but retain the benefits of being part of the UK!

This is the core of your misunderstanding writ large.

I didn't say that all future Scottish residents would be entitled to full use of UK NIC related facilities. I said that the people who have paid in since 1947 and forward are entitled to see their NIC honoured. The UK government knows that.

So, for the purpose of clarity, if we get Independence in March 2016, a school leaver that year will only pay into the Scottish NIC pool. They will have no call on UK facilities. My point is clear - current contributions must be, and will be honoured.

There is no point, as I have already said, in arguing this point any further with you or wigantojapanviagoogle.

Both of you are showing that you do not understand how the NI system works.

But I will ask you a question.

You say that anyone who has previously paid NICs since 1947 is entitled to 'see their NIC honoured.' Yet British citizens who have paid NICs for many years and now live outside the UK do not have full access to the NHS and are treated the same as all other non UK residents.

That is the situation now; why should residents of an independent Scotland, who will have chosen to leave the UK, be treated any differently to British citizens who have chosen to leave the UK and live abroad?

I know plenty of people who have their UK pension fully funded while living abroad. Nothing special in that.

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someone is mixing into the equation citizenship and residency and it certainly isnt me...the sussex man does have form about taking 2 completely different aspects and splicing them together as i stated before.

show me anywhere where it says NHS UK

you obviously like a lot of things have taken the NHS national to mean NHS UK

so i will ask you what does NHS mean?

also what does NHS Scotland mean?

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Pattszero,

British pensioners who live abroad do receive their state pensions; although many, including those living in Thailand, do not get the annual increases!

There is a long running thread on TV about the injustice of that.

However, we are talking about NHS treatment; not pensions.

You stated that should Scotland become independent then Scottish residents will still be entitled to NHS treatment in the UK as they have previously paid NICs.

I have a different view and asked why they should be treated any differently to all other non UK residents; including British citizens who have paid NICs but now live outside the UK.

Like the Google fan from Wigan, you have dodged the question, and I suspect will continue to do so because you know the answer and don't care for it.

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Pattszero,

British pensioners who live abroad do receive their state pensions; although many, including those living in Thailand, do not get the annual increases!

There is a long running thread on TV about the injustice of that.

However, we are talking about NHS treatment; not pensions.

You stated that should Scotland become independent then Scottish residents will still be entitled to NHS treatment in the UK as they have previously paid NICs.

I have a different view and asked why they should be treated any differently to all other non UK residents; including British citizens who have paid NICs but now live outside the UK.

Like the Google fan from Wigan, you have dodged the question, and I suspect will continue to do so because you know the answer and don't care for it.

First of all, Scotland is not Thailand.

Secondly - I clearly answered. I said that existing contributors from 1947 on will have a call on UK resources - I said that the school leaver of 2016 will not.

I could not have been any clearer.

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