MESmith Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Been here 7 yrs and this seems to be the worst year ever. Never before have my eyes watered or been red, never before has my wife coughed so much or even me. Before you could always make out Doi Suthep if you looked hard but now you can't. What happened to the law enforcement clamp downs they have been promising for 7 years, things are getting worse not better. Really? That is contrary to most reports / observations. Out in the countryside it's been hazy for nearly a month, but I would put this down as a good year. Relatively, though. IMHO it's cr@p at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chooka Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Been here 7 yrs and this seems to be the worst year ever. Never before have my eyes watered or been red, never before has my wife coughed so much or even me. Before you could always make out Doi Suthep if you looked hard but now you can't. What happened to the law enforcement clamp downs they have been promising for 7 years, things are getting worse not better. Really? That is contrary to most reports / observations. Out in the countryside it's been hazy for nearly a month, but I would put this down as a good year. Relatively, though. IMHO it's cr@p at the moment. Maybe I guess it comes down to which way the wind is blowing. Out Sansai, Sansainoi way it is hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfmuc Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Been here 7 yrs and this seems to be the worst year ever. Never before have my eyes watered or been red, never before has my wife coughed so much or even me. Before you could always make out Doi Suthep if you looked hard but now you can't. What happened to the law enforcement clamp downs they have been promising for 7 years, things are getting worse not better. Really? That is contrary to most reports / observations. Out in the countryside it's been hazy for nearly a month, but I would put this down as a good year. Relatively, though. IMHO it's cr@p at the moment. Maybe I guess it comes down to which way the wind is blowing. Out Sansai, Sansainoi way it is hell. I'm sure you're right with 'which way the wind is blowing'. It all depends to be at the right place, right time. In Phrae province it is really bad; never in my life I had problems breathing. Tonight I had to cancel 2 phone calls from friends, not enough air to speak. And really, this is neither joke nor hysteria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinnieTheKhwai Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 ^ Yeah, Phrae and Lampang don't look so good. Several days over the Thai unhealthy limit. That's not good news for Chiang Mai typically, as we get it a bit later. Of course Lampang typically shows worse values than Chiang Mai, so perhaps we'll be looking at moving into the 100-120 range next week. On the other hand, Chiang Rai and Mae Hong Son still show very good values, with Mae Hong Son also exceptionally clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MESmith Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Been here 7 yrs and this seems to be the worst year ever. Never before have my eyes watered or been red, never before has my wife coughed so much or even me. Before you could always make out Doi Suthep if you looked hard but now you can't. What happened to the law enforcement clamp downs they have been promising for 7 years, things are getting worse not better. Really? That is contrary to most reports / observations. Out in the countryside it's been hazy for nearly a month, but I would put this down as a good year. Relatively, though. IMHO it's cr@p at the moment. Maybe I guess it comes down to which way the wind is blowing. Out Sansai, Sansainoi way it is hell. Amazing how it changes around the valley. This morning, out east of San Kamphaeng it was awful. Yesterday, it was bad in the morning, but cleared up in the afternoon. There is a lot of construction going on in this area, very dusty. Also, very smokey at night (can smell it). Often a layer of smoke visible in the morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfmuc Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Interesting Chinese site: http://aqicn.org/city/beijing/ ...but the wind blew it away. We're going south tomorrow. Think it's better there. Take care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mapguy Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Incidentally, it is the Japanese who got furious with the Chinese (not just about property rights to rocks in the Sea of Japan or the East Sea (take your pick!) but wind-blown air pollution, The Japanese can't complain about jacksh1t, with all the radiation circulating the Pacific...... Yes, indeed, radioactivity is really a much more serious problem in some ways and not a problem to be solved in any way so easily as the general air pollution problem. And that is genuinely scary! But, in my view, your post is a cheap irrelevant shot. We are not chatting about the very,very serious radioactive issue in Japan, a very serious issue indeed; we are talking about something else, my friend. Why make such cheap points ?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mapguy Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Please remember that there are local neighborhood conditions, other less local conditions, not so local conditions, regional conditions, broader areal conditions and the whole frickin' planet atmospheric conditions to consider! Get real! What's the old saying from the '70s? "Think globally; act locally." A rather relevant slogan. Do what YOU can do. Yes, that is not much, probably, for people who post here (the most self-centered cyber-complaint postbox that I have ever known: "I need...!," "I want...!," Can you tell me where...?" "Can you help me...?!), but one thought might be to moderate our individual demanding selfish materialistic way of life which --- surprise, surprise! --- requires much more energy, such as electricity for our air cons or petrol to get to Promenada (or a demand for reliable shuttles to get to Promenada from city center when that is pure selfishness!) Really! "Think globally; act locally" is an expression of individual thoughtfulness and personal action that may indeed be part of a larger answer. Yes, my protestation here is lovably "naive," if you wish to wish it away in that way. We in Chiang Mai aren't going to save the world, but we can do our very small bit part. I have seen very, very, very little on this forum that concerns more than personal poster interests plus a lot of humor (?), ethnic and generally cheap shots. There is a lacuna very empty of considered thought. Isn't that more than a bit sad?! Sorry, I forgot pizzas, hamburgers and box wine! Sometimes, ThaiVisa Chiang Mai (probably true elsewhere in this well-devloped and marketed cyberspace, but I don't hang out) is very informative and helpful in general discourse (if you have the patience and wisdom to ignore the dross). ThaiVisa Chiang Mai can really be helpful (sometimes too often in ways it seems too many posters lack much capacity to help themselves) in some very practical ways. Unfortunately, it seems, in some ways, that is not always so. But we do have to remember that ThaiVisa is a commercial enterprise, and that poses problem from time to time for both ThaiVisa and those who post in it. Self-discipline more than moderator discipline is needed! The concern, ultimately, it sometimes seems, of ThaiVisa is with its broader legal liability, a valid concern in a culturally sticky environment. Lawyers are costly, in any case! I have obviously rambled on! But of no damage to anyone! And it is, after all, late! Sleep well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mapguy Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 You'll recall who bad it got yesterday, Friday,March 7. No wonder. Eleven more fires reported by FIRMS on that date. Remember that the eyes in the fires don't see it all. This screenshot reflects all reports so far this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinnieTheKhwai Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Good heavens we're blessed this year.. Normally I wouldn't even be outside when not absolutely necessary (or be in the North for that matter) when into the second week of March.. Now look at it.. (Ang Kaew) Now, this was the clearest part of the day in the early afternoon, but it's still remarkable especially noting that the weather looks fairly normal otherwise. Long may it last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mapguy Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Lovely photo, Winnie. Breath deeply! I don't intend to publish daily, but here's the most recent FIRMS report of the Doi Suthep - Pui region. Gets nastier and nastier each day. There is a pattern that seems to be showing up similar to last year. The area around Mae Taeng (and generally north of the city south of Rte 1095) seems as bad as ever. Yesterday, there seems to have been more clearly defined agricultural burning out of the mountains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T_Dog Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Burning up here in Mae Taeng seem less than last year. Last year, my mountain biking trails were burned twice by this time. This year, only about 15% of the trails have been burned and only once. The leaves are not yet fully off the trees up here yet so there is a good chance that the burning could increase in the coming weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mapguy Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Here is well-organized (and sourced) general information about particulate matter pollution that needs to be posted here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Particulates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tywais Posted March 10, 2014 Author Share Posted March 10, 2014 The overall fire density from the firemap seems to have jumped up quite a bit from a week ago. Suspect winds are still keeping the levels down. March 04, 2014 Today March 10, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chooka Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 The overall fire density from the firemap seems to have jumped up quite a bit from a week ago. Suspect winds are still keeping the levels down. March 04, 2014 Firemap Overlay March 4 2014.jpg Today March 10, 2014 March 10 2014 overlay.jpg This is ground level today at our home, 10th march 2014. 4.45 p.m You can see the blue haze/smoke that people are breathing in. This year is really bad. The crackdown by authorities definitely is not working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Throatwobbler Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Took the motorbike up yo Fang yesterday. Lots of fires between Chiang Dao and Fang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Visibility down to about 1.5km at Sansai this morning. Got the 3M Filtrete (replaced after just 4 days) a/c and dedicated air filter running on max. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinnieTheKhwai Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 The overall fire density from the firemap seems to have jumped up quite a bit from a week ago. Suspect winds are still keeping the levels down. March 04, 2014 Firemap Overlay March 4 2014.jpg Today March 10, 2014 March 10 2014 overlay.jpg This is ground level today at our home, 10th march 2014. 4.45 p.m You can see the blue haze/smoke that people are breathing in. This year is really bad. The crackdown by authorities definitely is not working. I'd be the last to claim that the very good year we're having so far is due to the authorities doing anything (I think weather and other random factors account for more). However we are having a very good year so far. What many people seem to be doing is similar to what climate-change deniers do whenever there is a very cold day. Then they go: 'see? Cold!'. (See? Smoke!). But that's not how you approach a very wide-spread seasonal haze problem. You do that by looking at frequent, standardized measurements and then compare this to see how things are progressing over the years / decades. Just like you can with near certainty predict that 'it'll get colder' when you're in early December, it is also a complete given that the air will get worse now that we're in early March. At the end of the season we then look at the numbers and may very well conclude that overall this was the best year on record when there wasn't unseasonal rain going on. (I don't know this yet, it might, but it might also get insanely bad for the second half of March. We'll know next month) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chooka Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 The overall fire density from the firemap seems to have jumped up quite a bit from a week ago. Suspect winds are still keeping the levels down. March 04, 2014 Firemap Overlay March 4 2014.jpg Today March 10, 2014 March 10 2014 overlay.jpg This is ground level today at our home, 10th march 2014. 4.45 p.m You can see the blue haze/smoke that people are breathing in. This year is really bad. The crackdown by authorities definitely is not working. I'd be the last to claim that the very good year we're having so far is due to the authorities doing anything (I think weather and other random factors account for more). However we are having a very good year so far. What many people seem to be doing is similar to what climate-change deniers do whenever there is a very cold day. Then they go: 'see? Cold!'. (See? Smoke!). But that's not how you approach a very wide-spread seasonal haze problem. You do that by looking at frequent, standardized measurements and then compare this to see how things are progressing over the years / decades. Just like you can with near certainty predict that 'it'll get colder' when you're in early December, it is also a complete given that the air will get worse now that we're in early March. At the end of the season we then look at the numbers and may very well conclude that overall this was the best year on record when there wasn't unseasonal rain going on. (I don't know this yet, it might, but it might also get insanely bad for the second half of March. We'll know next month) Now 7.05 p.m in Sansai/Sansainoi area. Went outside to lock the front gate and had to wrap a towel around my head. It is impossible to breathe outside and we have the place totally locked up and the air conditioners and humidifiers working flat out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tywais Posted March 11, 2014 Author Share Posted March 11, 2014 Now 7.05 p.m in Sansai/Sansainoi area. Went outside to lock the front gate and had to wrap a towel around my head. It is impossible to breathe outside and we have the place totally locked up and the air conditioners and humidifiers working flat out. Sorry to hear how bad it is for you out that way. Wonder why it is so much different in the Sansai area versus Mae Hia where I live as it is still pretty good here. Well, except for the mosquito foggers who came by when I had my car door open. My car interior is now mosquito proofed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chooka Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Now 7.05 p.m in Sansai/Sansainoi area. Went outside to lock the front gate and had to wrap a towel around my head. It is impossible to breathe outside and we have the place totally locked up and the air conditioners and humidifiers working flat out. Sorry to hear how bad it is for you out that way. Wonder why it is so much different in the Sansai area versus Mae Hia where I live as it is still pretty good here. Well, except for the mosquito foggers who came by when I had my car door open. My car interior is now mosquito proofed. between around 10.00 a.m and 4 p.m it is bearable but outside those times it is hell, burning eyes and so hard to breathe. I normally get up at 5 a.m and like to go outside but at the moment I open the door and it hits you in the face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinnieTheKhwai Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Now 7.05 p.m in Sansai/Sansainoi area. Went outside to lock the front gate and had to wrap a towel around my head. It is impossible to breathe outside and we have the place totally locked up and the air conditioners and humidifiers working flat out. Sorry to hear how bad it is for you out that way. Wonder why it is so much different in the Sansai area versus Mae Hia where I live as it is still pretty good here. Well, except for the mosquito foggers who came by when I had my car door open. My car interior is now mosquito proofed. between around 10.00 a.m and 4 p.m it is bearable but outside those times it is hell, burning eyes and so hard to breathe. I normally get up at 5 a.m and like to go outside but at the moment I open the door and it hits you in the face. Local source? It seems unlikely that haze differs that much, since we're seeing consistent measureements from Well North of town all the way to Lamphun. But if there is local burning going on then you will of course encounter actual smoke. Also the times don't match.. the mornings (until a bit past noon) see the wordt readings currenlty. If you experience something in the afternoon then can you identify a source? Is it actual smoke that's floating in? I'd almost want to go see for myself.. San Sai is a big place though, what area are you in, roughly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chooka Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Now 7.05 p.m in Sansai/Sansainoi area. Went outside to lock the front gate and had to wrap a towel around my head. It is impossible to breathe outside and we have the place totally locked up and the air conditioners and humidifiers working flat out. Sorry to hear how bad it is for you out that way. Wonder what it is so much different in the Sansai area versus Mae Hia where I live as it is still pretty good here. Well, except for the mosquito foggers who came by when I had my car door open. My car interior is now mosquito proofed. between around 10.00 a.m and 4 p.m it is bearable but outside those times it is hell, burning eyes and so hard to breathe. I normally get up at 5 a.m and like to go outside but at the moment I open the door and it hits you in the face. Local source? It seems unlikely that haze differs that much, since we're seeing consistent measureements from Well North of town all the way to Lamphun. But if there is local burning going on then you will of course encounter actual smoke. Also the times don't match.. the mornings (until a bit past noon) see the wordt readings currenlty. If you experience something in the afternoon then can you identify a source? Is it actual smoke that's floating in? I'd almost want to go see for myself.. San Sai is a big place though, what area are you in, roughly? Like I have posted the sansia/sansainoi area. I posted photo's last night of the low level smoke haze in the area. I am on the 121 next to where they are building the new homepro super store. At the moment outside 8.16 p,m it burns your eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmmum Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 Seems to be a pretty good year in comparison to the last few for us, that said though, we are in the sansai area also, and today was by far the worst day of this season so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naboo Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 This year has been excellent to date. That's not to say its been good, just better than usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmmum Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 By the way, does anyone know why aqmthai.com and aqicn.com give such different readings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinnieTheKhwai Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 The Chinese site (Aqicn) gave accurate information for a while but at the moment doesn't seem to be showing current values. Either way it's supposed to be data from the same source, from the measuring stations run by the Thai Pollution Control Department. (Just with the difference that the Chinese site showed the two-day average) So stick with the Thai site. It provides values in real time, and I've checked the readings visually for about a week and I'm quite confident in the readings (for the Yupparaj downtown station). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmmum Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Thanks for clearing that up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tywais Posted March 12, 2014 Author Share Posted March 12, 2014 If you have Google Earth installed then you can download this MODIS firemap file and open it in Google Earth. You can zoom in to the CM area to see the hotspots. Right click and "Save Link As" and then open in Google Earth. Fire data can be obtained here - MODIS Active Fire Maps MODIS.kml Example of current 48 hours Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mapguy Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Interesting report elsewhere today on ThaiVisa Chiang Mai about a NIDA study about cancer. See: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/692704-smoke-smog-dust-2014-chiang-mai/page-8#entry7553896 Not really good news when you think about it, so nothing to really make you feel much better! Keep in mind that cancer is only one danger from carbon emissions of various kinds, and it is not clear what else might have been included in the study. One could wonder about the regional analysis, too, and whether there is an apples and oranges problem in the research design. Ignored, of course, is that the morbidity and mortality rates due to agricultural burning probably have much more to do with respiratory and other diseases, not cancer. See under “Health Effects” here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Particulates . NIDA is basically a business school, but does have a Faculty of Social and Environmental Development. Perhaps that is where the research came from. One might think that the Ministry of Public Health or Natural Resources and Environment would have done some research like this. Maybe they have. There is one quite good study on the hazards agricultural burning involving concentrations of PM<2.5 done by someone at CMU. It was posted on "Smoke, Smog, Dust 2013 CHiang Mai, as I recall. Anyway, a little cross-disciplinary research can be a good thing. All in all, of course, inhaling automotive exhaust or smoke from agricultural burning or forest fires is not recommended, to say the least! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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