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Thai Air Force radar may have picked up MH370


webfact

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The first question we should be asking is what action the Thai military took when an unknown aircraft entered their airspace over an area plagued by insurgency for more than a decade.

(Assuming of course that it did)

Edited by evadgib
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"But they didn't ask for it. Not specifically anyway..." smile.png

Once asked specifically:

"Oh, yeah sure, we can send that to you [soon]" biggrin.png

And yeah, in international media Thailand is getting hammered for it. But what I love is reading the comments to those various stories on all the sites. Where complete nincumpoops who've probably never been out of Wisconsin say things like, 'But they were busy - Bangkok is ready to EXPLODE with a revolution of their own and the military coup!"

cheesy.gif

You idiot, the Bangkok protests - political nuttiness aside - are more akin to an impromptu nightmarket! thumbsup.gif

Edited by EnigmaBurn
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What this report doesn't point out is that the Thai Military knew this ten days ago. The report I read quotes Air Vice Marshal Montol Suchookorn as saying "but did not share the data earlier because officials "did not pay any attention to it" and were not specifically asked for it."

Just let so many boats and aircraft search in the wrong places for ten days.

certain boats needed to enter the gulf of thailand because "someone" made arangements with certain companies to build oil platforms in the gulf. which is illegal....(who do you know in thai politics who enjoys selling national assets to foreign nations?) if the plane did not dissapear, this said paltform can not be made. it would look fishy. certain thai officials understand what is happening, and know better than to ask. but... comeon... .... stolen passport from thai mafia, with purchase orders from the middle east. this horrible event .... has THAI FINGERS all over it. when this is no longer just my educated opinion but instead a fact with proof. i will post.

and i consider myself disproportionately brighter than the average American thai. say, 99.999%

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Add to this the fact that the passports were obtained in Thailand (you would think they might want to redeem themselves), and it doesn't look at all good. However, no surprise to anyone who lives in the land of smiles.

What was the answer to the passport forging problem?...... Clamp down on the farangs who stay here for a long time on tourist visas.

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It matters not whose territory the aircraft flew over, if the world is looking for a lost aircraft every bit of information no matter how big or small should be passed onto those managing the search. It is up to the investigation team to decide what is and what isn't relevant. To not pass on any information is nothing short of CRIMINAL NEGLIGENCE.

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Not exactly on topic but I wonder why this (and all commercial aircraft) are not fitted with a distress radio beacon (EPIRB) which is automatically activiated, floats on the water, works on over 70% of the earths surface and sends a signal to satellites providing a location accurate to within 100 meters. Most offshore boaters wouldn't leave a coastline without one of these gadgets which have saved tens of thousands of lives and cost only a few hundred bucks. I know the black box will send an underwater "ping" which sonar can locate but first you have to get close to the black box. Anyone know why distress radio beacon technology is not used?

All ( UK ) offshore helicopters are required to be fitted with

ADELT ( Automatically Deployed Emergency Locator Transmitter )

which can be deployed by the pilot via a cockpit switch or as its

name implies automatically on entering the water by means of a

saline switch. This is, as mentioned above, a floating device which

transmits an emergency signal for many hours after deployment.

I am not aware if it is a requirement for public transport airliners

but if it is not I would surely consider that a gross oversight by the

international aviation authorities.

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Come on people..

The air force has known and has shared this information with the Malaysian government on day one.. They're announcing this now to cover themselves when the truth does come out.. If it does come out..

Classic way is to say we think this was the aircraft.. This way they can deny they knew the truth and also say they shared their information.

There is a cover up here.

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My guess is the US government wanted some of the people on the plane and I bet it landed at Utapow Airforce base....

A remote make-shift strip I could possibly understand, but how would they ensure silence @ Utapow or other Vietnam era airfield in SE Asia?

Edited by evadgib
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There is a lot of criticism of Thailand's military here, but what about the Malaysian military? Apparently they knew the plane was turning around, and heading back toward the mainland. There have to be major military radar stations in the north. Why were they not looking out for the plane? Was someone sleeping? Or are they that incompetent? Something does not add up here. Why are no questions being asked of them? Who is responsible here? I do not think this plane went through Thai airspace, right.

Spidermike

Chaiyaphum, Thailand

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

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Stop this stupid Thai bashing.

How is Air Command supposed to know their info is important?

They don't listen to BBC.

They don't read TV News.

And when they do they use Google translation page and still do not understand what is what.tongue.png

Maybe this news will bring the missing plane to the average Thai's notice.

I commented to a Thai friend a few days ago about flight MH370, and the response was 'Huh? What missing plane?"

Isn't that the problem? They live on their own planet still not sure if there is any intelligent life out of their sight

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Personally I am not sure if they did or did not detect the plane on primary radar. They should have so now they are

saying they did. Better to say you did but are reporting it late than say you didn't and show you did not have the

capability or were incompetent at reading the information. blink.png

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How about this - sighting of the plane on 8 March but only revealed it yesterday :

Another piece of the jig-saw puzzle is reported by a Maldives press. http://theconservativetreehouse.com/...aysian-flight/

HAVEERU NEWS - Residents of the remote Maldives island of Kuda Huvadhoo in Dhaal Atoll have reported seeing a “low flying jumbo jet” on the morning of the disappearance of the Malaysia Airlines flight MH370.

Whilst the disappearance of the Boeing 777 jet, carrying 239 passengers has left the whole world in bewilderment, several residents of Kuda Huvadhoo told Haveeru on Tuesday that they saw a “low flying jumbo jet” at around 6:15am on March 8.

They said that it was a white aircraft, with red stripes across it – which is what the Malaysia Airlines flights typically look like.

Eyewitnesses from the Kuda Huvadhoo concurred that the aeroplane was travelling North to South-East, towards the Southern tip of the Maldives – Addu. They also noted the incredibly loud noise that the flight made when it flew over the island.

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HAVEERU NEWS - Residents of the remote Maldives island of Kuda Huvadhoo in Dhaal Atoll have reported seeing a low flying jumbo jet on the morning of the disappearance of the Malaysia Airlines flight MH370.

Where in the Maldives could a 777 possibly be hidden?

The highest point above sea level in the entire nation is 2.4 metres, and average is 1.5 metres.

The tail of a 777 would stand out like a skyscraper.

Edited by bino
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<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

What this report doesn't point out is that the Thai Military knew this ten days ago. The report I read quotes Air Vice Marshal Montol Suchookorn as saying "[/size]but did not share the data earlier because officials "did not pay any attention to it" and were not specifically asked for it."[/size]

Just let so many boats and aircraft search in the wrong places for ten days.[/size]

Malaysia knew from their radar that MH 370 had altered course and told no one, the flight never flew into Thai air space , it turned back towards K.L then banked and flew over Butterworth , an air-force base , as this is Malaysia air space over a airbase ,why the worry , Malaysia knew and never told anybody.

^^^^

This... If the plane was over Malaysian airspace, Malaysia should have a better radar trace than Thailand, yes?

Find plenty of other reasons to bash the Thai governmental processes, procedures, people, etc. - this might not be one of them. Criticize for a valid reason.

Being able to divert search assets to the CORRECT SIDE OF THE COUNTRY, TEN DAYS AGO might be a valid reason for criticism, don't you think?

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Idiots. Seriously, Thailand, the laughing stock of Asia. facepalm.gif

Isn't that just a bit overboard?

How many countries can you name that have NOT done things that were both ridiculous and embarrassing?

Your list certainly could not include the U.S., the U.K, nor Oz, for example. Maybe you could just retract the ridiculous comment.

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Folks, I don't read one post that indicates to me that the writer is an expert on military radar systems. Maybe you should cut the Thais and the Malaysians some slack until or unless you know more about these systems. Basic info....most air traffic control facilities utilize transponder systems that require active response form the aircraft. Lacking that, it is extremely difficult at times to even see an aircraft using "raw"radar returns which is what military radars depend on. These systems simply radiate radio frequency energy and need the target to bounce it back. Range is a major issue. Environmental conditions are major issues. Angles play a role. Many times there are false targets. Sometimes ghost targets which are real targets but barely discernible. It is actually a real art form for an operator to analyze these radars and find a target unless there is cooperative emissions from the target. The Thais would have NO reason to eve review the tapes until it became apparent that the flight might have headed their way. And it took only a couple of days for them to potentially locate the radar returns once it become possible the aircraft entered their coverage. Notice the range at which the aircraft is said to have passed through their coverage....very longs range. Not easy to see even when analyzed. Much of the world is not covered by ANY radar. And this situation is I unprecedented in many ways. Criticism of the Malaysian folks has been way overboard and fueled by an out of control media

An excellent post by one of the few who actually knows what he is talking about. I lived and worked for 10 years in Malaysia on Air Traffic Control and Airport projects - as well as 30+ years in other Asian and South pacific locations, plus experience in Air Safety investigation. So my comments:

Only believe about 10% of what you read or see on the media at any time, but especially on aviation matters. The media is ignorant and will exaggerate any story to make them look good. This is what they are doing here too.

No doubt when Kuala Lumpur and Ho Chi Minh ATC Centres lost radio and transponder contact on the night the aircraft went missing, they would have checked with other nearby Control Centres, including Bangkok, to ask them to try to contact and also if they could see anything on their radars. No ATC Center had primary (non transponder) radar coverage of the area.

Sometime later the aircraft was apparently detected on the Malaysian Air Defence Radar, heading back towards Malaysia then crossing the Peninsular somewhere near Penang, then heading North West. Defence radars can detect non transponder aircraft by primary radar, and can make a calculation of the altitude.

There are civil ATC short range primary radars for approach control at Kota Bharu, Langkawi and Hat Yai, range about 110 km which could have detected the target crossing Malaysia, but it was in the early hours of the morning and as there are no movements ATC would have been closed. However the radars would have been operating and the data recorded - and played back later. There is a primary and secondary radar for approach control at Butterworth (it also provides approach control for Penang)and this operates 24 hours. I think that the Malaysian Air Force Chief first stated that THIS was the radar that first detected the aircraft crossing the peninsular.

The Thai Air Force defence radar at Surat Thani is about 550 km from where contact was lost with MAS370, and the aircraft could not be seen at this distance as it was below the radar horizon. The range from this radar where the aircraft crossed Malaysia is about 350 km, and the target could have been detected but with difficulty (see the above post) if the radar was manned at that time - Saturday morning at 2 am. However the data would have been recorded and played back. When? That is not clear, and it could have been difficult to actually confirm that there was an aircraft there. I think that the Thai Air Force would have been contacted by the KL Search Center before the 10 day period, and they then examined the recordings that there really was an aircraft there.

As Thailand and Malaysia are not under direct threat from any aggressor, their defence radars MAY not have been fully manned at 2 am on a Saturday morning. Nothing unusual about this. Not all countries an afford this unless threats can be reasonably forecast.

Something to remember. 9/11 when the hijackers turned off the aircraft transponders, the FAA ATC system could not detect the aircraft using primary radars. I bet they can now. And I bet that a better watch will be kept in most other countries -perceived threat or not.

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Business as usual in amazing Thailand. Pro-activity only leads to problems, better to shove everything under carpet and hope nothing happens. And when something happens, deny, deny, deny and/or get a foreign scapegoat.

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HAVEERU NEWS - Residents of the remote Maldives island of Kuda Huvadhoo in Dhaal Atoll have reported seeing a low flying jumbo jet on the morning of the disappearance of the Malaysia Airlines flight MH370.

Where in the Maldives could a 777 possibly be hidden?

The highest point above sea level in the entire nation is 2.4 metres, and average is 1.5 metres.

The tail of a 777 would stand out like a skyscraper.

Keep going. Diego Garcia, globally important American military base.

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A bit late but still seized the opportunity to get his picture in the newspaper.... nobody here knows it's <deleted> ;-)

Pathetic.....if ever Thailand is invaded......they will only know 11 days later.....

Perhaps this is also one reason why they cannot catch Thaksin who comes and goes in the region, celebrates his birthdays with officials...... Nobody reminds them that he should be arrested..... Pathetic!!!! Thailand

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Not exactly on topic but I wonder why this (and all commercial aircraft) are not fitted with a distress radio beacon (EPIRB) which is automatically activiated, floats on the water, works on over 70% of the earths surface and sends a signal to satellites providing a location accurate to within 100 meters. Most offshore boaters wouldn't leave a coastline without one of these gadgets which have saved tens of thousands of lives and cost only a few hundred bucks. I know the black box will send an underwater "ping" which sonar can locate but first you have to get close to the black box. Anyone know why distress radio beacon technology is not used?

Airline aircraft are required to have EPIRBs or ELTs - an aircraft like the B777 would have several. One in a secure part of the airframe (activated on hard ground contact or in water) and portable ELTs for life rafts or you go looking for help on land. The SARSAT satellites are equipped to receive activated ELT signals and will immediately send details of location and time etc to the nearest ground SAR organisation. However on this occasion no ELT signals have been received - same as for the Air France A330 in the Atlantic Ocean. The ELTs do not work too well in deep water and the batteries would have expired by now. But the flight Data and Cockpit Voice recorders have a 30 day battery life. As you may know these were recovered from the Air France A330 after 2 years. The wreckage was found by a French Submarine using sonar -and if there is nothing found on the surface in the Indian Ocean search I think that this is the only way the wreckage (if there is) will be located this time. I hope that the US, UK and other nations with suitable submarines are ready to search the very deep Indian Ocean if a reasonably accurate location can be determined.

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