Chiang Rai Rates Highly With Retirees.

[sceadugenga]

The World's 9 Most Affordable Places to Retire

Chiang Rai, Thailand

Monthly budget: $750

With a population of fewer than 100,000, Chiang Rai offers an intimacy that cannot be found in a large city. Although there are internationally accredited hospitals here, as well as some large shopping complexes just outside the city center, a small-town ambience prevails.

Chiang Rai is in a natural setting. Thick, cool forests, majestic waterfalls, elephant camps, hot springs and some of the most diverse hill-tribe villages in the world are located just a short distance outside the city.

Most expats move to Chiang Rai after living in Chiang Mai. Here they tout the cleaner air, lighter traffic, friendlier population and lower cost of living. And unlike better-known Chiang Mai, Chiang Rai is not overrun by tourists and expats.

Chiang Rai has largely escaped the breakneck pace of "development at any cost" prevalent in much of Southeast Asia. Rental prices are extremely low, and you get a lot of house for your money.

https://sg.finance.yahoo.com/news/worlds-9-most-affordable-places-132700908.html

[Fiddlesticks]

Well part of this story is correct but I really take exception to these two claims:

Here they tout the cleaner air. . . / Rental prices are extremely low, and you get a lot of house for your money.

I have lived in both and I can honestly say that the air here is no better than CM and the value you get for your rental dollar here is less than CM simply because the supply in CM is so much greater therefore the price competition results in more for your baht in CM.

[sceadugenga]

Yes, a lot of this type of story tends to be written from a distance.

I found the inclusion of Dumaguete interesting, I spent time there back in the day and found it one of the nicest cities you could wish for.

I suppose it comes down to the old "how long is a piece of string" question.

[Fiddlesticks]

I believe you would have to go very native to survive on $750/mo in any city in Thailand. I wonder who writes these thing, maybe a backpacker ! ! ! ! ?????

[sceadugenga]

It depends on what you want.

I used a visit a guy who was convalescing in Lila Apartments (next to the hospital) after an accident and he was paying 4300B a month.

A single room with aircon, satellite TV and wifi included.

Full of student nurses as well... not that that would be an issue....

[chiang mai]

A serious question, does Chiang Rai have world class medical care? I'd always been led to believe, rightly or wrongly, that CR residents would head for Chiang Mai hospitals if any serious or complex health care issue arose, am happy to be corrected however.

[Fiddlesticks]

A serious question, does Chiang Rai have world class medical care? I'd always been led to believe, rightly or wrongly, that CR residents would head for Chiang Mai hospitals if any serious or complex health care issue arose, am happy to be corrected however.

Yes we do! It's very easy to get to, just buy an airline ticket to Bangkok and then a taxi to one of the world-class hospitals.

[Fiddlesticks]

And how can an informed writer say that you can RETIRE in CR with only a budget of $750 when the government requires that you show proof of an income level that is a tad more than $2,000/mo. Do these people really research anything before publishing this garbage?

[chiang mai]

A serious question, does Chiang Rai have world class medical care? I'd always been led to believe, rightly or wrongly, that CR residents would head for Chiang Mai hospitals if any serious or complex health care issue arose, am happy to be corrected however.

Yes we do! It's very easy to get to, just buy an airline ticket to Bangkok and then a taxi to one of the world-class hospitals.

Can anyone else answer that question more sensibly?

[Fiddlesticks]

A serious question, does Chiang Rai have world class medical care? I'd always been led to believe, rightly or wrongly, that CR residents would head for Chiang Mai hospitals if any serious or complex health care issue arose, am happy to be corrected however.

Yes we do! It's very easy to get to, just buy an airline ticket to Bangkok and then a taxi to one of the world-class hospitals.

Can anyone else answer that question more sensibly?

What I am saying is that there are NO hospitals here in CR that come close to world-class. If I was really in need of medical attention, I would RUN to CM or BKK. Nothing here is near the quality of CM Ram.

[Will27]

And how can an informed writer say that you can RETIRE in CR with only a budget of $750 when the government requires that you show proof of an income level that is a tad more than $2,000/mo. Do these people really research anything before publishing this garbage?

You can obtain your non-immi o in your home country and there are no financials

to be provided. This is for a non-immi based on marriage though.

Also for example, Australians only need to go to the Embassy in Bangkok

and sign a stat dec saying they meet these financial requirements.

So it's not that hard to do. I talked to a lot of expats in Chiang Mai who were

living here on 25 000 Baht per month.

As mentioned by Scea, it depends on what you want and your requirements and needs.

Edited April 19, 2014 by Will27

[Fiddlesticks]

And how can an informed writer say that you can RETIRE in CR with only a budget of $750 when the government requires that you show proof of an income level that is a tad more than $2,000/mo. Do these people really research anything before publishing this garbage?

You can obtain your non-immi o in your home country and there are no financials

to be provided. This is for a non-immi based on marriage though.

Also for example, Australians only need to go to the Embassy in Bangkok

and sign a stat dec saying they meet these financial requirements.

So it's not that hard to do. I talked to a lot of expats in Chiang Mai who were

living here on 25 000 Baht per month.

As mentioned by Scea, it depends on what you want and your requirements and needs.

Yes, you can get a 90 day non-imm O in your own country but if you want to RETIRE here LEGALLY, you need to have an income of 800,000 baht per year. YES, you can LIE about it to your embassy and obtain a legal document under illegal circumstances but that kinda defeats the purpose of the Thai legal requirement.

Yes there are expats here who live on 25,000 per month which equates to about $780. I was talking about living here on $650/mo. I guess it really gets back to how you want to live during retirement. I was taking issue with the article and those like it that make it sound like you can retire here in Thailand (CR is an example) and expect to get by on $650/mo.

[Will27]

And how can an informed writer say that you can RETIRE in CR with only a budget of $750 when the government requires that you show proof of an income level that is a tad more than $2,000/mo. Do these people really research anything before publishing this garbage?

You can obtain your non-immi o in your home country and there are no financials

to be provided. This is for a non-immi based on marriage though.

Also for example, Australians only need to go to the Embassy in Bangkok

and sign a stat dec saying they meet these financial requirements.

So it's not that hard to do. I talked to a lot of expats in Chiang Mai who were

living here on 25 000 Baht per month.

As mentioned by Scea, it depends on what you want and your requirements and needs.

Yes, you can get a 90 day non-imm O in your own country but if you want to RETIRE here LEGALLY, you need to have an income of 800,000 baht per year. YES, you can LIE about it to your embassy and obtain a legal document under illegal circumstances but that kinda defeats the purpose of the Thai legal requirement.

Yes there are expats here who live on 25,000 per month which equates to about $780. I was talking about living here on $650/mo. I guess it really gets back to how you want to live during retirement. I was taking issue with the article and those like it that make it sound like you can retire here in Thailand (CR is an example) and expect to get by on $650/mo.

I'm not on a retirement visa, but AFAIK, you only have to have 800 000 Baht in a Thai bank account for 3 months

or have an income of 65 000 Baht per month. Correct me if I'm wrong. So if you have the 800 000 in the bank,

you don't have to show a monthly amount or am I missing something?

So if that's the case, you can retire and live on $750 per month which equates to around 25 000 Baht per month.

Just because you can live on $750 per month doesn't mean that you don't have any other money.

That's my take on it anyway.

[Fiddlesticks]

And how can an informed writer say that you can RETIRE in CR with only a budget of $750 when the government requires that you show proof of an income level that is a tad more than $2,000/mo. Do these people really research anything before publishing this garbage?

You can obtain your non-immi o in your home country and there are no financials

to be provided. This is for a non-immi based on marriage though.

Also for example, Australians only need to go to the Embassy in Bangkok

and sign a stat dec saying they meet these financial requirements.

So it's not that hard to do. I talked to a lot of expats in Chiang Mai who were

living here on 25 000 Baht per month.

As mentioned by Scea, it depends on what you want and your requirements and needs.

Yes, you can get a 90 day non-imm O in your own country but if you want to RETIRE here LEGALLY, you need to have an income of 800,000 baht per year. YES, you can LIE about it to your embassy and obtain a legal document under illegal circumstances but that kinda defeats the purpose of the Thai legal requirement.

Yes there are expats here who live on 25,000 per month which equates to about $780. I was talking about living here on $650/mo. I guess it really gets back to how you want to live during retirement. I was taking issue with the article and those like it that make it sound like you can retire here in Thailand (CR is an example) and expect to get by on $650/mo.

I'm not on a retirement visa, but AFAIK, you only have to have 800 000 Baht in a Thai bank account for 3 months

or have an income of 65 000 Baht per month. Correct me if I'm wrong. So if you have the 800 000 in the bank,

you don't have to show a monthly amount or am I missing something?

So if that's the case, you can retire and live on $750 per month which equates to around 25 000 Baht per month.

Just because you can live on $750 per month doesn't mean that you don't have any other money.

That's my take on it anyway.

Yes you are right. As long as you can deposit and KEEP at least 800,000 baht or about $25.000.00 USD in a Thai bank for three months prior to your retirement renewal you do not need to show proof of a monthly income. Then, using your logic you can retire on 100 baht / mo if you choose. So now if you write an article about retiring in CR you can claim that you can retire here on 100 baht per month. BUT that doesn't give a TRUE representation of retiring in Thailand does it?

I was commenting on the article that claimed that one can retire in CR for $650 per month.

[kevvy]

And how can an informed writer say that you can RETIRE in CR with only a budget of $750 when the government requires that you show proof of an income level that is a tad more than $2,000/mo. Do these people really research anything before publishing this garbage?

You can obtain your non-immi o in your home country and there are no financials

to be provided. This is for a non-immi based on marriage though.

Also for example, Australians only need to go to the Embassy in Bangkok

and sign a stat dec saying they meet these financial requirements.

So it's not that hard to do. I talked to a lot of expats in Chiang Mai who were

living here on 25 000 Baht per month.

As mentioned by Scea, it depends on what you want and your requirements and needs.

Yes, you can get a 90 day non-imm O in your own country but if you want to RETIRE here LEGALLY, you need to have an income of 800,000 baht per year. YES, you can LIE about it to your embassy and obtain a legal document under illegal circumstances but that kinda defeats the purpose of the Thai legal requirement.

Yes there are expats here who live on 25,000 per month which equates to about $780. I was talking about living here on $650/mo. I guess it really gets back to how you want to live during retirement. I was taking issue with the article and those like it that make it sound like you can retire here in Thailand (CR is an example) and expect to get by on $650/mo.

I'm not on a retirement visa, but AFAIK, you only have to have 800 000 Baht in a Thai bank account for 3 months

or have an income of 65 000 Baht per month. Correct me if I'm wrong. So if you have the 800 000 in the bank,

you don't have to show a monthly amount or am I missing something?

So if that's the case, you can retire and live on $750 per month which equates to around 25 000 Baht per month.

Just because you can live on $750 per month doesn't mean that you don't have any other money.

That's my take on it anyway.

I agree Will, I show my 800,000 baht in my bank to show immigration each year then I can take it out straight away , They dont even check if it has been in the bank for 3 months, and dont ask about any income or check if the money is still in the bank when I report every 3 months .I know some members who live on 20,000 baht a month , and others who live on 50,000 a month .Everyone to their own and what they can afford.

kevvy

[Will27]

No, my logic is, if you have the 800 000 Baht in the bank, you can live off of your pension or whatever.

I'm not saying that the 800 000 is coming out of your pension. I'm saying if you have that sort of nest egg,

you meet the financial requirements.

So yes, you can live off $750 (24 000THB) per month as the article says.

Like I've said, just because your pension or income is $750 per month, that doesn't mean that's the whole

amount of money someone has.

I assume from the article, that the $750 PM is for living expenses.

A lot of people can just leave the money in the bank and then live

off their pensions.

[villagefarang]

I find these kinds of stories entertaining, well, almost as entertaining as the heated banter that ensues between the haves and have-nots.

Sure, thirty-five years ago I could have, and did, live on such a paltry amount. Closing my eyes and trying to imagine such an existence today, is both frightening and depressing. I have been told that people do it but I don’t think I could.

Even if one could live on $750, I can’t imagine anyone wanting to, but then again I suppose some people don’t have a choice. Where I am less than enthralled by stories of this ilk, is that they tend to attract the kind of individuals who ends up being more of a burden than a benefit to Chiang Rai.

Still it is nice to see members on here having a conversation and sharing opinions without resorting to insults and vulgarity.

[sceadugenga]

I think what Will says is pretty close, your actual out goings in an average month would be fairly low in Chiang Rai compared to many other places.

Sure, I had a huge month last month, the car tax/insurance came up and we had hungry and thirsty people calling in most of last week for Songkran.

I still went out for a couple of meals and made a weekly shopping run to Tops and Big C without stretching the budget.

Edited April 19, 2014 by sceadugenga

[Will27]

What perplexes me, is that somehow "the haves" quite often tend to think that
the "have nots" don't deserve to be here for some reason. Or that they have more
of a reason to be here than them. As if it affects their lives.

Just because someone is fortunate, lucky or intelligent enough to have money, that
doesn't make them an asset to Chiang Rai. And people having less doesn't necessarily
make them a burden either.

I know people here on 30 000 Baht per month and people on 300 000 per month.
That doesn't make the higher earner a better person who is more deserving to be here.
IMO, they should just feel fortunate to be in that position.

Of course you get more "bang for you buck" in Thailand than you would do in Oz, UK,
the USA or wherever.

You can read often enough on here, people that swear they couldn't live on 100 000 per month
and others can do it on 15 000 Baht per month.

As I've mentioned on here before, a person I met in Chiang Mai quite a few years ago now
was living off his old age pension which was around 20 000 per month.

This guy had a decent life paying minimal rent and had enough left over for a few drinks, lady company
or whatever. He had money put away for emergencies.

Had been married for 40 years when his wife passed away. He said to me "I can either live
in a cheap council flat in the cold (UK) and go to bingo once a week or live here".
Who could argue with that?

That's the trouble with TV, everything becomes a "urinating" contest over how much one can spend,
afford "my car is better than yours, my house is bigger, my wife is hiso", etcetera etcetra.

If you're well off, why not just be happy about it and try not to begrudge others who aren't as well
off living here?

It's not as if Thailand is some exclusive club.

Edited April 19, 2014 by Will27

[Goat Roper]

Where one has chosen to live is always the best place. Many years ago I considered both CM and CR for living and CM came out on top by a large margin. Medical care in CR is totally lacking FYI.

[villagefarang]

No one is urinating and no one has mentioned cars, houses, wives or used the word hi-so, in this thread because they are not relevant. What is relevant is individuals being lured into moving to a foreign land with false expectations about affordability, without adequate funds to take care of themselves and then becoming a burden on the medical infrastructure and the social fabric as a whole. I don’t see why Thailand should feel obligated to take care of those who see Thailand as little more than a source of cheep booze and affordable sex or whatever, while complaining nonstop about Thailand and Thai people.

Edited April 19, 2014 by villagefarang

[chiang mai]

There are people on both ends of the income scale everywhere but using them as a guide as to whether a particular location is "livable" or not is meaningless. What the article tries to do is to set a median amount and basically they got it wrong, as others have pointed out. A realistic level of income that allows for rent, subsistence, medical care, transportation will not consider the top 5% who need 300k a month and it will not consider the bottom 5% who can scrape by on 20K - neither is USD 750 a month which likely accounts for a very small percentage of expats. In this respect I think the Immigration guideline of THB 800k a year is, from what I've read on this subject over time, now fit for purpose and probably quite accurate.

[Goat Roper]

No one is urinating and no one has mentioned cars, houses, wives or used the word hi-so, in this thread because they are not relevant. What is relevant is individuals being lured into moving to a foreign land with false expectations about affordability, without adequate funds to take care of themselves and then becoming a burden on the medical infrastructure and the social fabric as a whole. I don’t see why Thailand should feel obligated to take care of those who see Thailand as little more than a source of cheep booze and affordable sex or whatever, while complaining nonstop about Thailand and Thai people.

VF do you think cheap booze and affordable sex is the main criteria for retirement age people? People I know at these advanced ages have ample funds to support themselves. I think you must have in mind the younger generation who live here on a shoestring.

[villagefarang]

We are talking about this particular article, and articles like it, which put up a questionable number to lure unsuspecting individual with dreams of living the life of a king on little or no savings with the most modest of pensions. When they get here they may end up unable to return home when things don’t go as well as they had been lead to believe.

The article was not talking about young people or tourists, but was luring retires who are perhaps unaware of the hidden costs of moving to a foreign country with inadequate funds.

[villagefarang]

No one is urinating and no one has mentioned cars, houses, wives or used the word hi-so, in this thread because they are not relevant. What is relevant is individuals being lured into moving to a foreign land with false expectations about affordability, without adequate funds to take care of themselves and then becoming a burden on the medical infrastructure and the social fabric as a whole. I don’t see why Thailand should feel obligated to take care of those who see Thailand as little more than a source of cheep booze and affordable sex or whatever, while complaining nonstop about Thailand and Thai people.

VF do you think cheap booze and affordable sex is the main criteria for retirement age people? People I know at these advanced ages have ample funds to support themselves. I think you must have in mind the younger generation who live here on a shoestring.

I was simply paraphrasing a previous poster.

[Goat Roper]

No one is urinating and no one has mentioned cars, houses, wives or used the word hi-so, in this thread because they are not relevant. What is relevant is individuals being lured into moving to a foreign land with false expectations about affordability, without adequate funds to take care of themselves and then becoming a burden on the medical infrastructure and the social fabric as a whole. I don’t see why Thailand should feel obligated to take care of those who see Thailand as little more than a source of cheep booze and affordable sex or whatever, while complaining nonstop about Thailand and Thai people.

VF do you think cheap booze and affordable sex is the main criteria for retirement age people? People I know at these advanced ages have ample funds to support themselves. I think you must have in mind the younger generation who live here on a shoestring.

I was simply paraphrasing a previous poster.

Fair enough, I must have missed that.

[Will27]

No one is urinating and no one has mentioned cars, houses, wives or used the word hi-so, in this thread because they are not relevant. What is relevant is individuals being lured into moving to a foreign land with false expectations about affordability, without adequate funds to take care of themselves and then becoming a burden on the medical infrastructure and the social fabric as a whole. I don’t see why Thailand should feel obligated to take care of those who see Thailand as little more than a source of cheep booze and affordable sex or whatever, while complaining nonstop about Thailand and Thai people.

VF do you think cheap booze and affordable sex is the main criteria for retirement age people? People I know at these advanced ages have ample funds to support themselves. I think you must have in mind the younger generation who live here on a shoestring.

I was simply paraphrasing a previous poster.

Fair enough, I must have missed that.

Yep, me as well.

I think you're the one who mentioned cheap booze and affordable sex.

I did mention an elderly chap who could afford go out for a drink and a date.

But sex and alcohol was never mentioned.

Not that there's anything wrong with that

Edited April 19, 2014 by Will27

[sceadugenga]

I'm curious about the health care thing, what qualifies as a "worldclass" hospital?

Obviously major transplants would be in the ballpark but judging by the waiting lists elsewhere they seldom have to be done at a moments notice anyway.

Is there any suggestion that Chiang Rai hospitals could not cope with a heart attack or a stroke?

Judging by the number of road accidents locally I would be surprised if there weren't some competent trauma surgeons around. (A bit like knee replacement specialists in Belfast and those gender reassignment fellers in Bangkok).

[Will27]

Look, obviously I don't think $750 per month is great, but I think it's doable.

And I don't think I'm the Lone Ranger there either.

The average rent for Western Australia is approx. 50 000 Baht per month.

So, IMO, if people on pensions with a limited income want to come here and

have a better standard of living in their twilight years than they can get back

home, I say good on them.

[chiang mai]

Somewhere that is accredited such as JCC or similar rather than treating every patient in a different way via a different process, that's always a good starting point.

Then doctors who have overseas training and practice experience rather than those that have received, ahem, honorary degrees!