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brucetefl

What REALLY happens when Immigration inspect a school

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A school can provide paperwork for non-immigrant B visas, work permits and visa extensions for foreign teachers. If the school were inspected, the school can always argue the application is in process.......

A school can't provide all the paperwork. It cannot provide the Teacher's Licence or the exemption from the Teacher's Licence.

But I agree with the thrust of what you say. A school can provide paperwork (letters) that can be sent to the Teachers Council of Thailand requesting that an exemption be issued. And while you wait for that exemption to be issued the application is in process.

That's not too far from my own situation currently. Last year I was working at a school with a work permit. This year I changed schools. I went along to the area Labour Office with my old work permit and told them I had changed schools and needed a new permit. They told me to get a new exemption from the TCT and then to come back and apply for a new work permit. My new school has written to the TCT in Bangkok asking for the exemption for me, sending them copies of my degree certificate and TEFL certificate, telling them I am working at their school, and we are still waiting for that to be dealt with. The school has chased up the TCT a number of times but they work slowly. I have a signed contract with the school.

I am currently in the country on an extension of permission to stay. It's due for annual renewal shortly. It seems likely that I won't have my work permit when I go to immigration to extend again for another 12 months. But I will have my school contract of employment and a letter from the school that explains my application is in process. I still have my old work permit (which the area labour office were not interested in taking away from me - they actually told me to keep it when I asked if they wanted it). And my wife is Thai so if there are any issues with extending on grounds of employment I will instead go down the married to a Thai national route.

I have no idea when my exemption from the Teachers Licence requirements will be ready. When it is ready a quick trip to my area labour office and the issue of the work permit is a simple formality - that part will be quite quick. Everything is being delayed by the slow speed at which the TCT seem to be working. I've heard that if you go and see them in Bangkok in person it is much quicker, but my school has already put everything in motion by mail and I don't actually fancy a long trip to Bangkok and back.

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A school can provide paperwork for non-immigrant B visas, work permits and visa extensions for foreign teachers. If the school were inspected, the school can always argue the application is in process.......

A school can't provide all the paperwork. It cannot provide the Teacher's Licence or the exemption from the Teacher's Licence.

But I agree with the thrust of what you say. A school can provide paperwork (letters) that can be sent to the Teachers Council of Thailand requesting that an exemption be issued. And while you wait for that exemption to be issued the application is in process.

That's not too far from my own situation currently. Last year I was working at a school with a work permit. This year I changed schools. I went along to the area Labour Office with my old work permit and told them I had changed schools and needed a new permit. They told me to get a new exemption from the TCT and then to come back and apply for a new work permit. My new school has written to the TCT in Bangkok asking for the exemption for me, sending them copies of my degree certificate and TEFL certificate, telling them I am working at their school, and we are still waiting for that to be dealt with. The school has chased up the TCT a number of times but they work slowly. I have a signed contract with the school.

I am currently in the country on an extension of permission to stay. It's due for annual renewal shortly. It seems likely that I won't have my work permit when I go to immigration to extend again for another 12 months. But I will have my school contract of employment and a letter from the school that explains my application is in process. I still have my old work permit (which the area labour office were not interested in taking away from me - they actually told me to keep it when I asked if they wanted it). And my wife is Thai so if there are any issues with extending on grounds of employment I will instead go down the married to a Thai national route.

I have no idea when my exemption from the Teachers Licence requirements will be ready. When it is ready a quick trip to my area labour office and the issue of the work permit is a simple formality - that part will be quite quick. Everything is being delayed by the slow speed at which the TCT seem to be working. I've heard that if you go and see them in Bangkok in person it is much quicker, but my school has already put everything in motion by mail and I don't actually fancy a long trip to Bangkok and back.

Actually, according to the law you are not allowed to work until the actual work permit has been issued and is at the place of employment (and can be produced on demand by an authority).

However, in most cases; immigration may give you the "courtesy" of allowing you to work during the process if they are aware of it; but according to the letter of the law; working while your papers are in progress is illegal.

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I believe that when you finish your old job you are suppose to cancel the work permit and the visa is also cancelled.

Best of luck and let us know how this works out for you.

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A school can provide paperwork for non-immigrant B visas, work permits and visa extensions for foreign teachers. If the school were inspected, the school can always argue the application is in process.......

A school can't provide all the paperwork. It cannot provide the Teacher's Licence or the exemption from the Teacher's Licence.

But I agree with the thrust of what you say. A school can provide paperwork (letters) that can be sent to the Teachers Council of Thailand requesting that an exemption be issued. And while you wait for that exemption to be issued the application is in process.

That's not too far from my own situation currently. Last year I was working at a school with a work permit. This year I changed schools. I went along to the area Labour Office with my old work permit and told them I had changed schools and needed a new permit. They told me to get a new exemption from the TCT and then to come back and apply for a new work permit. My new school has written to the TCT in Bangkok asking for the exemption for me, sending them copies of my degree certificate and TEFL certificate, telling them I am working at their school, and we are still waiting for that to be dealt with. The school has chased up the TCT a number of times but they work slowly. I have a signed contract with the school.

I am currently in the country on an extension of permission to stay. It's due for annual renewal shortly. It seems likely that I won't have my work permit when I go to immigration to extend again for another 12 months. But I will have my school contract of employment and a letter from the school that explains my application is in process. I still have my old work permit (which the area labour office were not interested in taking away from me - they actually told me to keep it when I asked if they wanted it). And my wife is Thai so if there are any issues with extending on grounds of employment I will instead go down the married to a Thai national route.

I have no idea when my exemption from the Teachers Licence requirements will be ready. When it is ready a quick trip to my area labour office and the issue of the work permit is a simple formality - that part will be quite quick. Everything is being delayed by the slow speed at which the TCT seem to be working. I've heard that if you go and see them in Bangkok in person it is much quicker, but my school has already put everything in motion by mail and I don't actually fancy a long trip to Bangkok and back.

You should probably apply for a marriage visa, as if it's taking a long time for the TCT to issue a teaching licence for you, then there might be a problem with it. Also marriage extensions are usually a lot more reliable than work visas, so it'd probably be easier to simply apply for a marriage visa instead if you meet the criteria for it. You can just apply for a marriage extension at your local immigration office, instead of an employment extension, when you go in to do your next extension.

Also technically you probably should have either applied for a new extension or left the country either straight away, or within 7 days (I forget which, I think it's straight away but a 7 day extension is possible?), when your employment at your previous school finished (regardless of the fact that you were then starting at another school).

Although luckily most schools are pretty relaxed/slack when it comes to reporting these things to immigration, so it's likely not a problem. However, you should probably look into applying for a new extension based on employment at your new school (or based on marriage) soon just in case (Also when you do, probably best to not mention to immigration that you finished working at your old school a long time ago).

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Bruce, you have nothing to worry about if you work in a rural school. In 20 years I've only heard of 2 teachers being deported and that was for not having a degree and they must have done something else to piss someone off. In rural areas they all know each other, went to uni together.

I friend of mine was caught overstayed and spent a night in the Imm. Jail. Another friend was caught with 8 years overstay whilst working as a teacher and paid 20k baht fine.

Always good to have a 'get out of jail' card just in case. If you've been here 18 years you'll know this.

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I believe that when you finish your old job you are suppose to cancel the work permit and the visa is also cancelled.

Best of luck and let us know how this works out for you.

Thanks for your good wishes.

I thought I said that I took my WP along to the labour office and told them about my situation and offered them my old work permit, but they told me to keep it.

My visa wasn't cancelled because I left the country after my teaching job finished and then re-entered the country. I obtained a re-entry permission from immigration in Kon Kaen before I left the country. My re-entry stamp from the airport gave me until the expiration date of my extension of stay stamp.

I visited immigration in KK after I re-entered the country. Told them I had changed jobs and was waiting on a work permit for my new job. Asked if I needed to do anything about permission to stay. They told me everything was fine because the stamp from Suvarnabum airport now covered me. The airport immigration stamp gave me permission to stay for four and a half months, based on the stamps in my passport for re-entry permission and the original permission to extend my stay from KK. KK told me they didn't need me to make another report until the end of that time.

So when I go to see them soon it will be interesting to see how this all pans out. But I plan to have all the paperwork ready for an extension of stay based on marriage just in case the work route is denied to me because of the absence of a current valid work permit.

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........Also technically you probably should have either applied for a new extension or left the country either straight away, or within 7 days (I forget which, I think it's straight away but a 7 day extension is possible?), when your employment at your previous school finished (regardless of the fact that you were then starting at another school).

Although luckily most schools are pretty relaxed/slack when it comes to reporting these things to immigration, so it's likely not a problem. However, you should probably look into applying for a new extension based on employment at your new school (or based on marriage) soon just in case (Also when you do, probably best to not mention to immigration that you finished working at your old school a long time ago).....

Thanks Sly - I think these points were taken care of, although I kept immigration fully in the loop about my change of school. See comments in my reply above to Scott.

I originally entered the country 5 years ago on a marriage visa and got my permission to stay extended each year. But somewhere along the way my permission to stay in the country got switched to permission granted on grounds of working. This time might be the time it gets switched back to grounds of marriage. I think immigration just found it a lot simpler to complete their paperwork when it was extended on grounds of work.

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Bruce, you have nothing to worry about if you work in a rural school. In 20 years I've only heard of 2 teachers being deported and that was for not having a degree and they must have done something else to piss someone off. In rural areas they all know each other, went to uni together.

I friend of mine was caught overstayed and spent a night in the Imm. Jail. Another friend was caught with 8 years overstay whilst working as a teacher and paid 20k baht fine.

Always good to have a 'get out of jail' card just in case. If you've been here 18 years you'll know this.

I agree.

Bruce, no need to pack your backpack just yet. I'm sure you won't get caught :)

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Not until you graduate after 4 years of study. Until then, you encourage them to work on non-imm EDs. I guess that's what this thread is about - reassuring your 'students'.

Nor do I! Much better to take a BA TESOL course and get a TCT exemption! THEN I make more money. See how that works?

I am just giving people real info based upon personal experience. Whether it fits my agenda or not.

No offense, up country, but you are one of the champions of the "work without all proper documentation and you will be deported" club. Certainly if you had any first hand knowledge you would post it.

I have never broken Thai immigration law, so no, I don't have first hand knowledge.

I also have no financial stake in playing down the risks inherent to breaking immigration law.

brucefefl, no offense, but you're obviously one of the Champions of the "work without all proper documentation and you will not be deported" club.

"Your students" , being on an ed visa are and were never allowed to work as English, or subject teachers, until they graduated.

Seems that you're not a native English speaker, otherwise you'd have understood what other poster have written.

Those who got deported won't read your posts and reply. Here's my question: How many of the tens of thousand illegal working teachers in Thailand have read your thread?

So your thread is basically to let people know that they can work illegally, being on an ed visa, provided by people who work for you.

Is that what you're trying to do with your thread? And why are you not allowed to post at another well-known forum anymore?

That's when you started posing here more often.

To make one thing clear. You're not allowed to make that three, or four year degree and go to teach at the same time.

Ed stands for education ,when you'd like to study. Time that they close that loophole.

Edited by lostinisaan

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The thing I find interesting about Lostinissan is his/her writing style changes so dramatically from one post to another.

Anyway.....

As I have said, and NO ONE has contradicted, apparently no one gets in trouble for working on tourist or ED visas.

If it happens its extremely rare. Because its NOT the death penalty. They could post if they were deported and their friends could also post.

Wait, are you saying they kill the guy who worked illegally AND their family and friends!?! Wow, thats pretty tough! In that case, DO NOT EVERY WORK ILLEGALLY IN THAILAND! Especially if you have kids. Those poor little kids, executed because their dad worked on a Tourist visa. THE INJUSTICE!!!

cheesy.gif

As I have also mentioned like a kajillion times, not many of our BA TESOL students are working on ED visas. its less than 1/3. And many are working legally with work permits and waivers from TCT. Don't ask me how or why. I just sign the letters to the TCT confirming their enrollment.

And NONE of our 130+ students have had ANY real visa issues in 2+ years. So why would I need to reassure them?

You guys make no sense at all.

Just tell people what life is really like here. And if you do not know, don;t post. But posting things that are not true is... odd? Pathetic? Not sure.

Not until you graduate after 4 years of study. Until then, you encourage them to work on non-imm EDs. I guess that's what this thread is about - reassuring your 'students'.

brucefefl, no offense, but you're obviously one of the Champions of the "work without all proper documentation and you will not be deported" club.

"Your students" , being on an ed visa are and were never allowed to work as English, or subject teachers, until they graduated.

Seems that you're not a native English speaker, otherwise you'd have understood what other poster have written.

Those who got deported won't read your posts and reply. Here's my question: How many of the tens of thousand illegal working teachers in Thailand have read your thread?

So your thread is basically to let people know that they can work illegally, being on an ed visa, provided by people who work for you.

Is that what you're trying to do with your thread? And why are you not allowed to post at another well-known forum anymore?

That's when you started posing here more often.

To make one thing clear. You're not allowed to make that three, or four year degree and go to teach at the same time.

Ed stands for education ,when you'd like to study. Time that they close that loophole.

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The thing I find interesting about Lostinissan is his/her writing style changes so dramatically from one post to another.

Anyway.....

As I have said, and NO ONE has contradicted, apparently no one gets in trouble for working on tourist or ED visas.

If it happens its extremely rare. Because its NOT the death penalty. They could post if they were deported and their friends could also post.

Wait, are you saying they kill the guy who worked illegally AND their family and friends!?! Wow, thats pretty tough! In that case, DO NOT EVERY WORK ILLEGALLY IN THAILAND! Especially if you have kids. Those poor little kids, executed because their dad worked on a Tourist visa. THE INJUSTICE!!!

cheesy.gif

As I have also mentioned like a kajillion times, not many of our BA TESOL students are working on ED visas. its less than 1/3. And many are working legally with work permits and waivers from TCT. Don't ask me how or why. I just sign the letters to the TCT confirming their enrollment.

And NONE of our 130+ students have had ANY real visa issues in 2+ years. So why would I need to reassure them?

You guys make no sense at all.

Just tell people what life is really like here. And if you do not know, don;t post. But posting things that are not true is... odd? Pathetic? Not sure.

Not until you graduate after 4 years of study. Until then, you encourage them to work on non-imm EDs. I guess that's what this thread is about - reassuring your 'students'.

brucefefl, no offense, but you're obviously one of the Champions of the "work without all proper documentation and you will not be deported" club.

"Your students" , being on an ed visa are and were never allowed to work as English, or subject teachers, until they graduated.

Seems that you're not a native English speaker, otherwise you'd have understood what other poster have written.

Those who got deported won't read your posts and reply. Here's my question: How many of the tens of thousand illegal working teachers in Thailand have read your thread?

So your thread is basically to let people know that they can work illegally, being on an ed visa, provided by people who work for you.

Is that what you're trying to do with your thread? And why are you not allowed to post at another well-known forum anymore?

That's when you started posing here more often.

To make one thing clear. You're not allowed to make that three, or four year degree and go to teach at the same time.

Ed stands for education ,when you'd like to study. Time that they close that loophole.

Great reply brucefefl.

So, you're trying to suggest to do something against the Thai law, which working as an English teacher on an Ed visa obviously is.

The Ed visa is issued for educational purposes, and people are not allowed to work on that type of visa!

I've had quite a few high school students, who had the nice opportunity to study abroad.

They're also on an Ed visa for that particular country and it's clearly NOT allowed to work on that type of visa.

Before those students even make it to their destination, they have to sign a document that they're aware that they're not allowed to work on that type of visa.

Same goes for exchange students from Western countries, who study at a Thai school for a particular period of time.

And exactly here's the problem. All of your "students", who're on an Ed visas will never have a work permit, as they're not allowed to work on that visa.

The fact that nobody wrote a post about teachers who got caught, does not mean that there were no people who went through that process and finally got deported.

Edited by lostinisaan
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nobody on this thread has made up 'crap' about being fined and deported.

a degree is needed to obtain a TCT waiver but your students don't have one yet, how do they obtain waivers?

not sure what the girlfriend comment relates to

this is a very strange thread

Strange doesn't seem the right word for it. It's frightening how the OP is trying to persuade people to commit a crime. Oh, it's Thailand, no problem.

Of course it has nothing to do to get some new customers for his "institution."

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if you want to start a separate thread about your own Crusades go ahead. I stated a very simple question. I've stated my hypothesis.no one is contradicting me. The rest of your babble isn't really important to me or this thread.

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What REALLY happens when Immigration inspect a school

They'd find out that some people are on Ed visas and they'll be imprisoned, deported and blacklisted. ( Please see Thai laws)

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What REALLY happens when Immigration inspect a school

They'd find out that some people are on Ed visas and they'll be imprisoned, deported and blacklisted. ( Please see Thai laws)

Yes, that is the law. People working on on Ed visa are subject to being locked up in a Thai jail.

It certainly doesn't happen in every instance, but for someone to suggest it never happens because he/she personally never heard of it happening is ludicrous.

I would never advertise the fact that I had deliberately broken the law, was apprehended by the police and punished by a fine (on or off the books) jailed or deported. And quite honestly, I can't imagine anyone that would.

Edited by up-country_sinclair
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