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kwaiYai

Thai condo law question

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I'm rather disturbed at posters even considering the snitch camp.

The guy' is after all only trying to make an honest living.

Hey maybe he didn't even consider the effect of short termers....and after all it's probably very small.

Communicate or deal with it in-house I say, snitching brings you down far lower than his (possibly unrealised) lack of consideration.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

So be disturbed. It's NOT "honest" if he's not abiding by the immigration rules (for reporting stayers) and the tax laws. If this is the case, he's in effect intruding on the "quiet enjoyment" of other owners by infringing the law. If you WANT consideration, you have to SHOW consideration.

But if we're talking about Phuket, I'd say be a bit careful about just who you go to war with over something like this... It's not exactly the kind of place I'd like to be involved in real estate related disputes.

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...

Other options (assuming you can get a majority vote at the AGM which may be difficult if someone who opposes you owns many units) ...

Two important points to consider regarding voting, from the Condominium Act:

Section 45 In casting of votes, each joint-owner shall have the votes according to the ration of his ownership in the common property.
If one joint-owner owner has the votes more than half of the total votes, the number of votes shall be reduced to remain equivalent to the total votes of all other joint-owners.
...

Section 47 A co-owner may give a proxy vote for its unit but a proxy holder shall not be authorized to represent more than three condominium units.

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Other options (assuming you can get a majority vote at the AGM which may be difficult if someone who opposes you owns many units) ...

Two important points to consider regarding voting, from the Condominium Act:

Section 45 In casting of votes, each joint-owner shall have the votes according to the ration of his ownership in the common property.
If one joint-owner owner has the votes more than half of the total votes, the number of votes shall be reduced to remain equivalent to the total votes of all other joint-owners.
...

Section 47 A co-owner may give a proxy vote for its unit but a proxy holder shall not be authorized to represent more than three condominium units.

...

But, WRT Section 45, if the meeting turnout is relatively small, it's still possible to have control of a vote if your votes represent the majority of those present. And it seems to me Section 47 actually facilitates this by limiting the proxy-holding ability of other owners who DO show up. No idea what quorum reqts, if any, are though.

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Any restrictions regarding the use of of private and common property in the condominium building would have to be included in the condomimium regulation. From the Condominium Act:

Section 32 The condominium regulations shall comprise at least the following essence:

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(6) the use of private property and common property;

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Thanks Delight. They have put some signs up which are largely ignored!

I was wondering if there is anything in the condo law to prohibit running a business of this scale using residential condo units?

There are a couple of business units in the building - a shop & a café. I thought you could only use the nominated business units of a condominium building to run a business?

Some owners of course rent their apartments when they are away, but this is usually long term, a few months or more, and those renters aren't generally a problem and he has nothing against that. It's the short stay, noisy, holidaymakers which are the problem.

I think what is happening pretty much around the world, even here in Las Vegas, NV. That is why I own a house here, and would never buy a condo....

Probably, overbuilt, couldn't sell, and then an investor bought them, and is renting them out.

kilosierragiggle.gifgiggle.gifgiggle.gif

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Section 45 In casting of votes, each joint-owner shall have the votes according to the ration of his ownership in the common property.

If one joint-owner owner has the votes more than half of the total votes, the number of votes shall be reduced to remain equivalent to the total votes of all other joint-owners.

...

Section 47 A co-owner may give a proxy vote for its unit but a proxy holder shall not be authorized to represent more than three condominium units.

...

Interesting. The first clause preventing an overall majority is probably quite rarely applicable and certainly doesn't seem to apply in this case.

For the second clause, presumably there is nothing stopping the owner from having multiple proxies, each representing a maximum of three of his units (up to a total of 50% of the building)?

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Ah Quality tourist from Russia, What you don't want to support tourism in Thailand?cheesy.gif

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Not taking the side of the owner who owns several units?

For any owner of a Condo even in Thailand, if you never paid attention the one most important document prior to any purchase is asking for a thing called a CC&R, even in Thailand there should be something very similar. These rules should outline how the Condo Complex should be run. It is usually run by a volunteer committee comprise of other owners which usually meet once a month? Any perspective buyer should be able to review the CC&R, and review and obtain a monthly accounting of funds. Usually the review of funds and distribution is a good indication to me at least how well run is the complex.

Whether the owner is renting to Russians etc.. is really not relevant to me at least as long as it is legal and how much the facility is use is also not relevant since if the renters were actual owners they would still be using the facilities of the Condo. What is relevant is that the owner pays his Association fees for each unit he/she owns.

If the renters is doing something harmful and dangerous then it should be reported at the meeting. This might simply be a language problem and the rules not being conveyed so if they are majority Russians maybe signs conveying the rules around the facility can be in Russians. The decision of whether the Association pays for sign-etc..can be decided in a vote or whether to ask the owner of these units to have a translation of these rules of the Condo facility be given when the units are rented.

It is a rule of thumb as least for me when I work in Real Estate is to find a well run Condo with a strong balance sheet to show my clients. The CC&R should answer many if not all the questions regarding whether the Units can be rented out in this manner and how to address the renters usage and behavior.

Getting down and dirty? If the owner is a foreigner there might be some questions as to ownership in regards to Thai ownership law? There might also be a issue whether the owner is paying taxes from profiting from the rentals and even their Immigration status. My rule of thumb if one digs deep enough you normally will find something? Now what you do is another thing?

Currently there are a number of forms of renting going on outside of Thailand very similar to this but any agreement made by the owner can't ever circumvent the CC&R in place of a Condo Complex. Any owner purchased sign and agree to these terms when they purchase!

Good luck,,

Edited by thailand49

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Short Term rental (under 1 month) is illegal in a condominium. In my condo they are taking a person to court for this. It is the Juristic office that has to do this. So you really have to become active with the other owners and do things through the committee.

I think you are likely to have less problems with people renting for at least a month. In my condo they made it compulsory to register all visitors and tenants must be registered. Then you know what is happening.

Good luck. It is not easy to do. But in my condo everyone is against short term rentals.

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Whether the owner is renting to Russians etc.. is really not relevant to me at least as long as it is legal and how much the facility is use is also not relevant since if the renters were actual owners they would still be using the facilities of the Condo.

Actually there is a difference.

Owners in residence tend to use the pool a little. Owners not in residence wont be using the pool at all, of course, and in my building there are many units where the owner only comes for a couple of weeks a year or less. Some owners in residence just dont like swimming and so never use the pool.

But short-term renters with children often seem to be surgically attached to the pool from dawn till closing time. So the general impact they make is much greater in proportion.

Personally I would happily vote for an hourly fee for pool use in my building so that everyone pays in accordance with the costs they actually create. The same applies to other facilities.

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Short Term rental (under 1 month) is illegal in a condominium.

Hello Toany

Short term rental illegal?

I'd be interested to see the statute saying that.

Perhaps you mean it ias been banned under the regulations of your particular condo?

(Also unlikely as it requires a 50% vote....but possible).

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

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The Condo Act does state:

Section 17/1

In the case where a space in the condominium is set aside as a place to carry out the business, the system on entering and exiting such area shall be specifically set up in order to prevent the disturbance on the peaceful enjoyment of the joint owners.

No person shall be permitted to engage in any trade transactions in the condominium except it is a trade transaction in the area of the condominium designated in accordance with paragraph one.

Q Is renting out a room a ‘trade transaction’?

Also renting out the room is not actually the problem.

The co –owners who rents out a room also ‘rents out’ the common area-without the permission of the other co –owners.

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Whether the owner is renting to Russians etc.. is really not relevant to me at least as long as it is legal and how much the facility is use is also not relevant since if the renters were actual owners they would still be using the facilities of the Condo.

Actually there is a difference.

Owners in residence tend to use the pool a little. Owners not in residence wont be using the pool at all, of course, and in my building there are many units where the owner only comes for a couple of weeks a year or less. Some owners in residence just don't like swimming and so never use the pool.

But short-term renters with children often seem to be surgically attached to the pool from dawn till closing time. So the general impact they make is much greater in proportion.

Personally I would happily vote for an hourly fee for pool use in my building so that everyone pays in accordance with the costs they actually create. The same applies to other facilities.

The difference is with you just as you pointed out Russians... How often a owner use or not use the facility is not relevant it is not stated in the CCR or when the purchase was made! Just not relevant and can't hold water in a court of law unless it is stated in the CCR. Your other suggestion wouldn't hold up in a court of law in the States. Aside from your personal views and dislike of what is going on it really has no bearing unless it is a violation of the CCR, unless it was stated at the time of purchased. Sure you can vote and pass but if I was a buyer and had personally brought into a Condo because I love swimming and the workout facility and was sold as unlimited use and now you change the rules without any substantial proof that my overuse of the pool and the other facility your condo president would be hearing from my lawyer!

I suggest you leave your personal likes or dislike out of the equation and stick with what is legal!

Edited by Maestro
Fixed quote tags.

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The Condo Act does state:

Section 17/1

In the case where a space in the condominium is set aside as a place to carry out the business, the system on entering and exiting such area shall be specifically set up in order to prevent the disturbance on the peaceful enjoyment of the joint owners.

No person shall be permitted to engage in any trade transactions in the condominium except it is a trade transaction in the area of the condominium designated in accordance with paragraph one.

Q Is renting out a room a ‘trade transaction’?

Also renting out the room is not actually the problem.

The co –owners who rents out a room also ‘rents out’ the common area-without the permission of the other co –owners.

This particular section is basically means as least to me if I rent out a room to someone who end up turning that room into selling clothes like a store front etc.. with people coming and going which violating the possible safety or quiet enjoying of the other tenants or owners.

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