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BANGKOK 23 May 2019 05:41

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casualbiker

New requirements for proof of degree. Khurusapha

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Virtually all of American universities will not have a mechanism to reply to this request for "a letter." Thailand lacks a clue how this verification of degree works from USA. In my case, Mahidol U wanted a photocopy of my Ph.D. diploma, the "sheepskin" handed out on graduation day. This easily faked and not legal document is just wall candy. I had mine superbly framed and I got a copy company to copy it still in the frame.

What counts in usa is an "official grade transcript" that will show all degrees awarded, grades, and official name of degree holder. It must be requested by either the employer or the degree holder, with a fee of about $25, and is mailed to the stated, required address all sealed, often with return receipt requested card on it.

There ARE a few things Thailand can benefit from listening to expert foreigners.wai.gif

Of course this is how it works and how it should be done. They are just so clueless though. It will seriously probably take the another ten years to learn why they want what they are asking for, and in what form they need to ask for it. It's just too ridiculous to even put up with.

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Great ! My school sent my documents off today to renew my teaching permit! Hope it doesn't get rejected. I graduated 30 years ago, it is not going to be easy to get a letter from my university and then tell them what they have to write, make sure it is stamped with the seal and then put it in a sealed envelope and then what? Send to me to take the sealed envelope to Krusapa? Or do the university have to send it direct to Krusapa who will no doubt lose it ( that's if it arrives - with the great Thai postal system) or be unable to tie it up with the relevant paperwork, which by then will be massive with numerous pending teaching permit applications?? I think for those teaching Maths and Sciences a need to ensure they know and are qualified in their subject is important, but for a native speaker to go through these hoops to teach English is a bit excessive!!!!

People who never went to university generally expect to earn less than college graduates and less opportunities in their own country.

People who studied history don't expect the same salary or opportunuties as those that studied engineering and science.

Maybe someone with no formal education is excellent at math. Possible but less likely.

A university degree shows you can follow directions and pursue a long term course of study.

Are there bad teachers with degrees sure.

My experience is that the NES teaching 3rd grade ESL expects the same salary as the calculus teacher.

But he feels it is justified to pay Filipino teachers and Thai teachers with university degrees half the salary of a NES.

Interesting that it always works in their benefit and never for anybody else.

People without degrees wouldn't expect much in their own country but expect equal treatment compared to engineer degrees in Thailand.

Is being NES enough to teach English?

Only need higher qualifications for the physics and math teacher but similar salaries?

How should NES salary company with university graduate Thai salary?

the higher salaries for foreign teachers is not because they deserve more then thai teachers, its because Thai teachers are way underpaid and most foreigners would not teach for such little salary.

So why don't all thai teachers gather, and form a union? People have dies through history for much less. I think people get what they deserve. If you can't make life better for yourself and generations to come by way of sacrifice, then so be it.

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Great ! My school sent my documents off today to renew my teaching permit! Hope it doesn't get rejected. I graduated 30 years ago, it is not going to be easy to get a letter from my university and then tell them what they have to write, make sure it is stamped with the seal and then put it in a sealed envelope and then what? Send to me to take the sealed envelope to Krusapa? Or do the university have to send it direct to Krusapa who will no doubt lose it ( that's if it arrives - with the great Thai postal system) or be unable to tie it up with the relevant paperwork, which by then will be massive with numerous pending teaching permit applications?? I think for those teaching Maths and Sciences a need to ensure they know and are qualified in their subject is important, but for a native speaker to go through these hoops to teach English is a bit excessive!!!!

People who never went to university generally expect to earn less than college graduates and less opportunities in their own country.

People who studied history don't expect the same salary or opportunuties as those that studied engineering and science.

Maybe someone with no formal education is excellent at math. Possible but less likely.

A university degree shows you can follow directions and pursue a long term course of study.

Are there bad teachers with degrees sure.

My experience is that the NES teaching 3rd grade ESL expects the same salary as the calculus teacher.

But he feels it is justified to pay Filipino teachers and Thai teachers with university degrees half the salary of a NES.

Interesting that it always works in their benefit and never for anybody else.

People without degrees wouldn't expect much in their own country but expect equal treatment compared to engineer degrees in Thailand.

Is being NES enough to teach English?

Only need higher qualifications for the physics and math teacher but similar salaries?

How should NES salary company with university graduate Thai salary?

the higher salaries for foreign teachers is not because they deserve more then thai teachers, its because Thai teachers are way underpaid and most foreigners would not teach for such little salary.

I agree. Thai teachers are underpaid compared with foreign teachers.

English teachers seem to believe all foreign teachers should get the same salary.

The 3rd grade ESL teacher believes he deserves the same salary as the calculus teacher.

If they honestly believed this, then they should follow their beliefs and push for all teachers being equally compensated- including Thai teachers.

But in reality, supply and demand and parents ability to pay will control salaries.

Adding obstacles to teaching may lower supply of teachers but salaries are capped by the parents ability to pay.

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What a bunch of cry-baby biggoted baggers.

You uphold the virtues of uneducated farang teachers and defame the virtues of educated Filipino teachers. Certainly, anyone who can speak some English--even a bar-girl--can teach a few words of English to someone who speaks no English. Of course, there must be some uneducated NES teachers who do a good job, but to what depth can they teach the language and how many utter failures did the system go through to gain that few?

The Thais are trying to develop better educational systems for their children. Requiring educational standards for teachers is a step in the right direction.

Look at the written English displayed by TV posters--the vast majority of whom are NES and several even claim to be teachers. Far too many cannot put together a simple post without grammar or spelling errors. Is that the type of English competency you want for teachers of your child, or are you just trying to justify work in Thailand for an NES farang?

It goes even further: Within a different blog, I criticized the incorrect spelling, and punctuation of somebody from the island, who offered English courses, which would be honoured with a "Cambridge Certificate". Therfore I was called a "Grammar-Nazi". This also is Thailand.

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Whatever happened to 'Job Interview' - passed that - employed on probation - good at the job - made permanent...... No good - dismissed!

As usual, a total nonsense in Thailand as nobody is qualified to judge a person competent or incompetent. What a joke!

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Wanting to hire qualified teachers is all well and good, but more red tape helps nothing. There's only one thing that will work, and that is to START PAYING MORE. Until that happens, Thai schools will have to take what they can get, and all this talk is meaningless.

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Wanting to hire qualified teachers is all well and good, but more red tape helps nothing. There's only one thing that will work, and that is to START PAYING MORE. Until that happens, Thai schools will have to take what they can get, and all this talk is meaningless.

Problem solved then. If one is unable or unwilling to provide requested certification, then switch application to a school/college which doesn't insist.

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<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Or a lot of people with fake degrees making extra scrutiny necesarry.

And why is it "necessary"? To satisfy some egos, that's why...

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Wanting to hire qualified teachers is all well and good, but more red tape helps nothing. There's only one thing that will work, and that is to START PAYING MORE. Until that happens, Thai schools will have to take what they can get, and all this talk is meaningless.

Paying foreign teachers more would limit the people that can learn from NES teachers to the wealthy.

To tap into the larger market, the salaries paid need to be affordable to many people.

Sure I want a higher salary but I am probably already getting triple what the comparable Thai teacher is getting.

But no NES teacher would work for Thai salary.

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I'm fine with the market skewing towards the wealthy honestly. The schools with lower funding will still be able to attract qualified non-NES teachers. Schools that can afford to pay more for well-qualified native speakers works well for me! ;p

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What do you call a Thai salary?

Most Thai government teachers I know make at least 30,000 a month plus have a bonus of 10,000 a month for having developt themselves. They also get free healthcare for themselves and their family and a pension when they retire at 60.

A lot of the older teachers earn even more than 50,000 a month.

A Thai government teacher might start at around 17,000 if they have a master degree but it rises every 6 months.

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I saw a report card from my daughters respectable private school written by her qualified Philippine teacher,,, a good child in class she be very. I actually thought the thai teacher had written it until I checked with the Philippine teacher who proudly assured me it was her marking and comment,, priceless

quote "smotherb"

Look at the written English displayed by TV posters--the vast majority of whom are NES and several even claim to be teachers. Far too many cannot put together a simple post without grammar or spelling errors. Is that the type of English competency you want for teachers of your child, or are you just trying to justify work in Thailand for an NES farang?

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I wonder if unopened official transcript are acceptable.

But it says to send the letter directly to them.

There must be a huge surplus of teachers since they keep increasing the difficulty level to teach in Thailand.

its time to check the degrees and skills of teachers, ( we parents pay a lot of money for them !! )

anyway most of them not teachers,

they mostly did some study,

or were just native Brits and speaking somohow english !

A teacher must have also pedagogic skills !! Exams !!

Than he is a teacher !!

Though I understand what you are trying to say and the fact that a degree is called for here.... do remember that the Immigration officials are NOT asking for a degree in "Teaching" but rather in any subject! This raises the question, can say a someone with a degree in Art History teach English as a second language? Will this new rule do away with the need to obtain a certificate from a TESL (or equivalent) that will actually teach you more about the English language than you ever got in grade school. Or do you suggest that we allow anyone with a degree (of any kind and in any subject) to teach English in our schools here in Thai? The fact is that a TESL (or equivalent) is a far better tool and it should be up to the school to determine if this person has what it takes to be a teacher.

Also, given the fact that the education is so poor here (at least in the government schools for the most part) and that primary focus is upon Thai history and culture without much, if any, focus upon the rest of the world and/or the other teachable Social Study issues there is an intrinsic problem in this country that foreign teachers can help to rectify. But that will mean an understanding by the Thai educational system to see it and in so doing not simply lose 'Face' at the failure of their system to address these factors.

Then there is the fact that if you ask any Thai student which subject is the hardest, they will all say that their Thai language class fits that bill. So what we have here is a unbalanced educational system that needs to be fixed. Especially if Thailand is to become a partner in the Asia version of the old idea of a European Common Market. The fact that 8 of my students (in my English class) did not know that the ISS (International Space Station) was actually a real thing and not a "cartoon" (to use their word) frightened the hell out of me along with not knowing what is going on in Myanmar. I mean how could they not know those things, as they are both on TV which in and of itself seems to be the fastest and most complete education that they seem to be able to get! But they knew all about the Koh Tao mess, sort of. That was a positive, but it was also was an indicator that what is taught in schools here has its focus upon Thailand and not so much on the rest of the world. What's more, the Burma issues, given the fact that where I teach is right on the border with a major crossing (bridge) and an entry point for the supposed road connecting Myanmar with 'Nam... well the schools should be teaching them about what is going on in the world to a far greater extent. Then there is the fact that English is becoming the International Language (which though personally I find 'interesting') is being taught on a very fundamental level within grade schools (by Thai and/or Foreign teachers).

For the curriculum is based upon out dated parameters and no one seems to want to address this issue and it is left up to the teacher to design and create lesson plans that not only address their class needs but at the same time toe the line handed down from upon high and in so doing help to alienate the students from being able to assimilate that which is being taught, or rather attempted based upon a educational system that has a central command structure where the individual teacher's capabilities and abilities are relegated to the bottom of the pile. For we are not talking about stitching bras together here, but feeding and guiding Human minds!

So what are the teachers doing about this? Not a dam thing. They are just following the rules set forth and not speaking out. My feeling is that as they never received the training (or education) to go beyond, they find it easier to simply do the same old thing the same old way. This lets the students down. This does not give the students the education they will need to be improve themselves and be able to succeed when they go to university. Let face facts, the education in this country is basic at best and at worst taught by teachers with not enough education themselves and who have little if any understanding that today we are in a Global Community and not an insular one where Thailand can, as in the past, simply confine itself within its borders and pretend it is all by itself.

So I have a few other questions for you:

  • What do you mean when you say that "we parents pay a lot of money for them"? Are you referring to the education that we parents pay to get our children educated? Or are you talking about the salaries that we parents help pay for in our tuition payments/taxes?
  • What makes a teacher in your mindset?
  • How much "study" (studying is the correct spelling) do you think is required?
  • What the heck did you mean by the "Brits and speaking somohow english" (too many mistakes to hide behind Spell Check)
  • Pedagogic "is the science and art of education. Its aims range from the full development of the human being to educational skill/s acquisition". The teaching of adults, however, is referred to as andragogy. So, referring to what I wrote herein, can you tell me where this ability resides in any Thai school?
  • Are you suggesting that through the use of "exams" and "Pedagogic skills" that they make a teacher a teacher? If so you have a very myopic view of what a teacher is.

Teaching is an old profession and one that is needed worldwide. Good teachers are not that hard to come by and there are many without a degree that have the skill to do the job far better than some that have a degree. Furthermore, with age comes wisdom. That wisdom in and of itself is a 'degree'. The experiences that one has through a long life have a great deal more to contribute than what can be found in the pages of a text book (usually out dated in the schools here). So unless Thailand has a surplus of teachers that can actually teach and then raising the bar of the regulations, although seems like a positive thing to do, is actually reducing the number of those that want to give back and to teach and give what they have learned to a newer generation. For teaching is an "art" and not a science. Simply giving students iPads or other tablets and access to the Net is not the answer. Oh, it will help, but you will still need a teacher to help them assimilate the information and place it into context and show them,or rather guide them, through that process and to show them how to connect the dotes! So to Thailand and the Thai parents out there, we have a responsibility to our kids. We must show them how to succeed in life and that there is more going on and more that affects us than what is going on in Koh Tao or on the Soap Operas on TV.

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I saw a report card from my daughters respectable private school written by her qualified Philippine teacher,,, a good child in class she be very. I actually thought the thai teacher had written it until I checked with the Philippine teacher who proudly assured me it was her marking and comment,, priceless

quote "smotherb"

Look at the written English displayed by TV posters--the vast majority of whom are NES and several even claim to be teachers. Far too many cannot put together a simple post without grammar or spelling errors. Is that the type of English competency you want for teachers of your child, or are you just trying to justify work in Thailand for an NES farang?

Is your daughter attending international school, bilingual school, or Thai school teaching ESL a few hours a week.

I hope that teacher isn't teaching English.

But if low tuition and low budget for salaries then maybe they choose the best available teacher for the salary and area.

What does the school mean by qualified? Education degree, NES, high Toeic?

Sending a report home to parents I would expect proper English.

Are you happy with your daughter's academic progress? Do you review her homework? Do you ask to see her tests?

Growing up my Mom knew tests were given in school and she would ask to see my graded tests for all classes.

When I occasionally do meet a parent, they tell me that their son tells him that he never has any homework and the parents believe them. I tell them I am giving homework and their son never does it.

Why don't parents check about their kids progress?

If seeing graded tests and homework then the final grade should be no suprise.

My parents always looked at my class notebook and returned assignments.

I know I get lazy typing messages on my phone and don't always use proper English. Occasionally auto correct puts in a wrong word.

Proper English can be cumbersome. We can often omit many words without loosing meaning.

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What a bunch of cry-baby biggoted baggers.

You uphold the virtues of uneducated farang teachers and defame the virtues of educated Filipino teachers. Certainly, anyone who can speak some English--even a bar-girl--can teach a few words of English to someone who speaks no English. Of course, there must be some uneducated NES teachers who do a good job, but to what depth can they teach the language and how many utter failures did the system go through to gain that few?

The Thais are trying to develop better educational systems for their children. Requiring educational standards for teachers is a step in the right direction.

Look at the written English displayed by TV posters--the vast majority of whom are NES and several even claim to be teachers. Far too many cannot put together a simple post without grammar or spelling errors. Is that the type of English competency you want for teachers of your child, or are you just trying to justify work in Thailand for an NES farang?

Unless you are working at a good international school or perhaps a good Thai private school; most "teachers" are not really teaching; if they "really" taught and assessed properly they would probably be fired.

I doubt many of them even know the difference between summative and formative assessment; not to mention how to use it to improve student's learning.

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