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ChaangNoi

Are their any Sports Bars in CR?

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Hi PC, I agree there is a difference between the number of part-time foreigners here and the full-timers officially registered here. The method you have used to calculate the numbers depends very much on when (month, day and time of day) you take your sample. For example, I have been in Big C and Central many times and never seen a single foreigner, so using your method I would calculate that there are zero foreigners living here.

Also, I know of quite a few Thai-farang couples with kids who live in the farang's home country, and just come back every year or two to see the family.

But for officially registered foreigners, the numbers I have are from a friend of my father-in-law who works at immigration, and they are in line with Don's.

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Don's estimate of about 700 isn't so different than my big C estimate of 500-1000. I actually go to Big C at different times of day and do for some reason semi count how many farangs i see there....which is usually about 4 or so per hour....and most of them for some reason won't so much as nod at me which i always find a bit strange, but it is what it is.

Anyway. I think the total farang population staying at least 4 or 5 months a year or more in the entire province is likely somewhere in the 1000 or so range.. But i could be wrong. It wouldn't be the first time.

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I have been in CR for over 10 years and honestly I do not know anyone who is on a retirement visa well enough to ask if that is the type of visa they are on. I guess I am just too young. There are many younger people here who are not old enough to get a retirement visa. Many are here visiting family (like myself), students or working. Also many of the people who live here most of the year do not live here all of the year.

500 to 1000 is a much more reasonable number than 30.

That being said a sport bar targeted at expats is not going to be a winner. The goal was always to have more Thai than farang anyway. The location and prices of the beer would have been prohibitive to keep out most of the ex-pats esp retired ones. Anyways I was looking to do this as a fun hobby even if it lost money, but the more I look into this the more it seems I would be a lot of work.

I'm currently looking into buying/building an apartment complex. The ROI seems decent (10 to 12 years) and should not be as much work as a bar. Sadly however wont be as fun but such is life.

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I think Don's count of 27 US citizens was just an off the cuff count between him and a couple of friends wasn't it? And his bigger number related to farangs of all types?

Anyway, a couple of thoughts based on some other comments made... If it's true that US citizens are in a small minority here, then they seem to spend to a lot more time online than other nationals - I'm sure there's a moral to be drawn from that, but not sure what it is exactly.

Also the perennial question about whether or not to greet a complete stranger just because they're a farang. Personally I don't, and I'll try to explain why.... oh on second thoughts I won't, because I'm sure it'll get contentious.

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I personally treat every farang that I do not know just like every Thai I do not know. Then again I'm slightly anti social by nature.

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I try to acknowledge every person i cross paths (within reason in close contact) with whether thai or farang. A simple nod of the head seems to me to be no big deal....but as i said, it is what it is, and if some prefer to avoid eye contact etc then it's no big deal.

I now have a whole group of Thais that i encounter in my daily walks who used to just pass by but now seem to go out of their way to wave to me.....again no big deal but i do sort of enjoy it.

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I like pomchop’s Big C analogy and found myself in the “never go into big C but shop elsewhere” group. Of course that is not completely true as we may go there once or twice each year. Most of our shopping is Central Plaza or Makro.

We seldom get to town before noonish and I never seem to have any problem getting a parking place. Of course I am healthy enough that I don’t need to park next to a door and don’t mind walking a few feet to get inside. After all, I am going to walk end to end inside the mall anyway.
Many of us who live here full-time, reside in outlying areas and are seldom in town early morning or after dark. That said, with just a little effort one can get to know enough people to be able to bump into friendly faces on each trip to town.
I would say 50% of the farangs I smile and nod at, return the gesture. There really needs to be some plausible scenario and a willingness from both parties for a conversation to ensue and that simply doesn’t happen all that often.
Just yesterday I bumped into one of our members feeding the goats at the pet display at the Mall. In a crowd of strangers it is always nice to be treated to a smile, a handshake and a brief but pleasant exchange. It is not necessary to have a whole lot in common to be polite and civil.

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We also go to Big-C about twice a year. Once just before Christmas and one time just randomly. We do go to central often and also saw the goats yesterday. If I saw you I did not nod or smile, sorry about that!

I'm slow to make friends and almost never becomes friends with someone I meet randomly. Almost always in a club or event setting, something like that. Maybe I'm just shy in the real world:)

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In the past I have used club, sports and event settings as networking environments but I prefer one on one. My preference is for spontaneous encounters over planned events so that is made easier by knowing a lot of people. I would get bored hanging out with the same small group of people everyday.

Because of my online exposure, I do get requests to meet but I try to keep it as low key as possible by meeting at Starbucks or someplace similar, where I plan on going anyway. That way it is easy for either party to make excuses if they feel uncomfortable and want a way out.

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About greeting complete strangers. I’ll try to express some thoughts and experiences about this, hopefully in a way that doesn’t arouse inflammatory responses:

I can understand that many foreigners here feel isolated and alienated, by location, retirement, or the culture, and therefore take any opportunity to mix, even in shopping malls; I’ve had complete strangers spill out their whole life story to me in supermarket checkout queues. Others may spend huge amounts of time online; this is of course their prerogative.

Any expat community, especially a small one like CR’s is full of gossip: I’ve heard gossip, often malicious, about people I am never likely to meet.

I’m gregarious and friendly by nature: before I came to Thailand I would trust anyone until I had a reason not to. My experiences here with foreigners has sadly reversed that, now I don’t trust (farangs) until I have good reason to.

I’ve been an expat for a very long time; I guess any surprise or curiosity I might have had about seeing fellow farangs in supermarkets disappeared a long time ago.

80% of the conversations that I’ve had with farangs degenerate quickly into their endless stream of complaints about Thais and Thailand. I really don’t need that. 5% have been great.

Do any of you do this in your home countries? I think if you’re honest with yourselves most of you will probably say no, so why do it here?

By the way, I do occasionally greet strangers, but it depends on the situation.

I meet a large number of people in my work anyway.

Finally, there is no code of politeness or civility in my culture that suggests you need to talk to complete strangers when you’re shopping. Quite the contrary, it would be considered rude (and slightly crazy) to assume that you have the right to impose yourself on a complete stranger.

Cheers all, please take this in the spirit of constructive dialogue in which it’s intended.

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I agree with most of what you say but I don’t think a polite smile and a nod should be considered rude, crazy or an imposition. Often that is all that is wanted or needed to be civil.

I’m also not sure you can compare here with there, either. When we travel in my home country, however, we often meet and talk with complete strangers. It all depends on the environment and situation. Some of our favorite memories are of chance encounters with locals or fellow travelers.
I am not really sure why you feel the need to begin and end your posts with disclaimers and warnings about inappropriate responses.

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I had a meeting near the Big-C and needed to get some stuff for my dog so I went in to count farang. I walked in at 12:15 and left at 1:20. In that time I counted 12 different farang. Since my meeting was at 2 I went back in for iced cream and saw 3 more. More than I thought I would see. Also every farang was with a Thai lady but one. The exception was with a Thai lady what i would guess to be a step daughter.

I have no idea if any of them live here or are just tourists but most of them were picking up good. Three were eating (well one was just drinking beer).

Not really sure how this will affect the numbers but that is what I observed. Also I was constantly looking to see if people were farang or not, something I never do.

In central I always see 5 to 10 farang if I stay a few hours. However central is also more likely to attract tourists than Big C.

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Most of the guys you see in Big C and Makro are like me over 70 and living outside on a very limited income. To see one in a gin mill with his wife would be very unusual. Chiang Rai does not have many wealthy farangs.

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Don , I love the way you bring it down to earth with your honesty and straight-talking experience. Sometimes I don't agree with you, but at least I know what it is I'm not agreeing with... if u get my drift.

I had always assumed you were pretty well off financially, but I have never doubted your wealth of experience. I know of 3 other farangs in CR who may have more inherited money in the bank , but have never done a day's work... and it shows.

More power to you sir.

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