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Smoke, Smog, Dust 2016-2017 Chiang Mai

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37 minutes ago, LolaS said:

biogas production is very old, and highly used in Chiang Mai, in june is very big conference on biogas production and anaerobic digestion, in chiang mai, AdTech2018 organized by Griffith university, and kmutt.

It is silly to assume that Thai dont know or dont use biogas

Oh! Really! Where is that massive gas production happening? Farmers are what bringing their residue there? Sure, SOME MIGHT know, but many farmers are still burning all the farm residue? The key is to have means and cheap enough means for farmers to use what SOME KNOW instead of smoking up the whole region! 

 

Here is the question. Does each farmer make gas or a local village organization pay farmers for the stuff they burn to make gas? I don't think it is happening since I see and breathe the smoke.

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There are also university research projects and NGO's working with biogas in northern Thailand. There are just so many great alternatives to burning with many side benefits including the environment, health of the population, soil preservation, and prosperity. They keep experimenting and pouring money into these alternatives that end up not really going anywhere. The problem no one seems to address is the people doing the burning could care less about your great ideas. It's like educating a smoker to quit because you think once he learns he would be richer and healthier he would stop because it is in his best interest. It doesn't work folks. They just love their fires and feel it is their god given right to set things ablaze. Force is required.

 

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4 hours ago, EnlightenedAtheist said:

Oh! Really! Where is that massive gas production happening? Farmers are what bringing their residue there? Sure, SOME MIGHT know, but many farmers are still burning all the farm residue? The key is to have means and cheap enough means for farmers to use what SOME KNOW instead of smoking up the whole region! 

 

Here is the question. Does each farmer make gas or a local village organization pay farmers for the stuff they burn to make gas? I don't think it is happening since I see and breathe the smoke.

take a look at conference speaker available on website AdTech2018, there are few huge companies based in Chiang Mai that buy waste from farmers, also registered farmers cannot burn legally, they would lose insurance and get the penalty. 

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4 hours ago, canopy said:

There are also university research projects and NGO's working with biogas in northern Thailand. There are just so many great alternatives to burning with many side benefits including the environment, health of the population, soil preservation, and prosperity. They keep experimenting and pouring money into these alternatives that end up not really going anywhere. The problem no one seems to address is the people doing the burning could care less about your great ideas. It's like educating a smoker to quit because you think once he learns he would be richer and healthier he would stop because it is in his best interest. It doesn't work folks. They just love their fires and feel it is their god given right to set things ablaze. Force is required.

 

I think there is no other way than to burn, slash and burn, how else to do it?

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I think there is no other way than to burn, slash and burn, how else to do it?
I taught the village how to make compost. Many did it for a while and were in general, pleased with the outcome BUT after a few years, the "lazy factor" kicked in again and it was back to burning and chemical fertilizers.

Sent from my [device_name] using http://Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

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5 hours ago, scotbeve said:

I taught the village how to make compost. Many did it for a while and were in general, pleased with the outcome BUT after a few years, the "lazy factor" kicked in again and it was back to burning and chemical fertilizers.

Sent from my [device_name] using http://Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Interesting! Must be the hot climate. Wait! It probablty is.

 

Do you think the biogas contraption that I showed (modified to suit the Thai market in whatever ways it can) could simplify the process enough to make it appealing (with the free gas and the free compost)? True! Gas bottles last forever in my experience and they are dirt cheap at 400 B. True! Composting is done by burning. Sort of. How about a governmental program in schools to evaluate 15 anti-pollution video ads by parents and children as a soft manner to educate them on the consequences of their action! Surely, they are not going to continue burning their fields if they know that they are causing harm to their children AND them, as the videos would persuade incontrovertibly. It has to be done smartly. This is one of the smart ways that was done in some areas where smoking use was generalized and in 30 years it has been  virtually "eradicated". Big changes like these don't happen overnight, but demand clever persuasion techniques and incentives, along with peer pressure and losing face pressures. Children will remind their parents everyday that they are stupid and uncaring. Your thoughts?

 

 

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33 minutes ago, EnlightenedAtheist said:

Big changes like these don't happen overnight, but demand clever persuasion techniques and incentives

I generally agree with you, change is possible, however for a long process to be completed it has to start first, and things haven't even started to move to that direction in Thailand. So, 30 years from now, perhaps.

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On 2/26/2018 at 9:47 PM, XGM said:
I generally agree with you, change is possible, however for a long process to be completed it has to start first, and things haven't even started to move to that direction in Thailand. So, 30 years from now, perhaps.

Agreed. Let's put anotherspanner in the works and talk about the chemical salespeople that say(and I've actually heard this said), "With these products, we can enhance the burnt ash to double the effect of your output" ..... <deleted>Sakes!

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Interesting! Must be the hot climate. Wait! It probablty is.
 
Do you think the biogas contraption that I showed (modified to suit the Thai market in whatever ways it can) could simplify the process enough to make it appealing (with the free gas and the free compost)? True! Gas bottles last forever in my experience and they are dirt cheap at 400 B. True! Composting is done by burning. Sort of. How about a governmental program in schools to evaluate 15 anti-pollution video ads by parents and children as a soft manner to educate them on the consequences of their action! Surely, they are not going to continue burning their fields if they know that they are causing harm to their children AND them, as the videos would persuade incontrovertibly. It has to be done smartly. This is one of the smart ways that was done in some areas where smoking use was generalized and in 30 years it has been  virtually "eradicated". Big changes like these don't happen overnight, but demand clever persuasion techniques and incentives, along with peer pressure and losing face pressures. Children will remind their parents everyday that they are stupid and uncaring. Your thoughts?
 
 
We had a small pig farm and had the Agri people come in and build an underground Biogas collector. The volume was approx 2 tons and worked well. The pig manure was (of course) used as fertilizer. The cost was around 20K baht.

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2 hours ago, LolaS said:

 

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Values look really low, I think something is off with that one.  The average for the day shows around 25 ug/m3, that's mid-yellow on the US EPA AQI scale, around 80 US AQI.   All other stations today show about 108-147 US AQI. 

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13 hours ago, scotbeve said:

We had a small pig farm and had the Agri people come in and build an underground Biogas collector. The volume was approx 2 tons and worked well. The pig manure was (of course) used as fertilizer. The cost was around 20K baht.

Sent from my SM-N900 using Tapatalk
 

Do you think that mass production of such a contraption should not reduce significantly its price? Add improvements to make it cheaper and easier. Maybe add a robot or a drone to do the collecting too ! In fairness, it is hot and it is hilly sometimes. Do Thai farmers and big agro businesses use Burmese like construction companies use Burmese too?

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You should all evacuate CM and head south to the coast .  Think about your health, you only live once. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, balo said:

You should all evacuate CM and head south to the coast .  Think about your health, you only live once. 

 

How about you..? So far in February Chiang Mai has remained better than been about the same as Bangkok.  (And Pattaya wasn't great either.)

 

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