Growing Makua in Thailand

[Somtham]

If you put alot of rice hulls (probably free at the local rice mills or at a very very low price) over the drip lines it will inhibit the weeds and eventually it will enrich the soil.....You can do the same around the plants so that when you cut the weeds you can stay back from the plants.

Chownah

Good idea. We own 30 rai of rice paddy that we rent to relatives so maybe I can even get the hulls for free.

[Somtham]

Here's wishing all you farmers out there a safe and happy New Year with loads of fertile soil and bumper crops. This mornings harvest. 1.4kg of makua. It's a start

rgds

[Tim207]

Here's wishing all you farmers out there a safe and happy New Year with loads of fertile soil and bumper crops.

And the same to you.

This mornings harvest. 1.4kg of makua. It's a start

Nice, is that all of them or are there plenty more maturing? Your progress reports are very interesting to me.

Thanks

[btate]

Tim207

Interesting that you are finding land at that price around Chantaburi. I've been looking in the same general area. Mostly East and Northeast in the foothills. In that area most property is going for 100K / rai. From what available property I've seen, it is mostly orchards of one type or another.

Maybe we could start a makua co-op I'm not totally enamored with makua yet though. I have planted a couple of plants just to see if I don't kill them LoL

good luck

[Tim207]

Tim207

Interesting that you are finding land at that price around Chantaburi. I've been looking in the same general area. Mostly East and Northeast in the foothills. In that area most property is going for 100K / rai. From what available property I've seen, it is mostly orchards of one type or another.

Maybe we could start a makua co-op I'm not totally enamored with makua yet though. I have planted a couple of plants just to see if I don't kill them LoL

good luck

Have you checked into bank owned property? Banks publish a sale price that is reasonable without built in negotiating room or farang markup. Just because people are asking 100,000 doesn't mean they necesarily can sell for that.

Over the last several years I have been offered several properties at rock bottom prices due to loans coming due. I have not bought anything yet but I came close on a house once. The neighbor told us the asking price so we had the owner come out to show it to us. When we sat down to talk about it the price was double what the neighbors were told they wanted before I came into the picture.

I should be getting to Chan around the 15th. I have about a dozen properties I want to go look at. I'm not ready to buy yet but I want to do some looking around.

From Maize Farmer's descriptions I am loving the makhua idea. The big question for me is can a guy that doesn't even keep potted plants alive in his house manage to grow anything outside.

[btate]

No, have not checked the banks yet. Most of what I've looked at is 'local' knowledge from family members. In two cases you are correct the bank wants the money back.

Both were mangosteen orchards, one 12 rai and the other 29 rai. One other is a rubber plot just about expired also in the 100k range per rai.

will check with the banks.

thanks

[Tim207]

No, have not checked the banks yet. Most of what I've looked at is 'local' knowledge from family members. In two cases you are correct the bank wants the money back.

Both were mangosteen orchards, one 12 rai and the other 29 rai. One other is a rubber plot just about expired also in the 100k range per rai.

will check with the banks.

thanks

Easy loans with short term balloon payments was a recipe for disaster. I suspect the banks will have a lot of property to off load in the coming years.

[Somtham]

Nice, is that all of them or are there plenty more maturing? Your progress reports are very interesting to me.

Thanks

No, not all of them. I pick them every morning and I am get a few more each day. My New Year's resolution...start an Excel spreadsheet and log daily the weight picked and then share it with you guys in a month or so. Day 1 - ok; Day 2 - suffering from major NY party hangover....took the day off!!

From Maize Farmer's descriptions I am loving the makhua idea. The big question for me is can a guy that doesn't even keep potted plants alive in his house manage to grow anything outside.

They seem to be very easy plants to grow although I do have some problems.

1. There's a few plants that have the fungus Maize talked about. The plants just sort of shrivel up and die.

2. The seed packs we bought don't seem to be that pure. There are 3 variety's growing that were all planted from the same bag of seeds.

3. Worms, worms, worms. The pure white fruit plants seem to have an affinity for worms. I'd say at least 30% of those fruits have worms in them when I pick them. I'm not very keen on spraying even if I did know what to spray with. We'll see how it goes.

4. The 1.5m long stick I made for auntie who did the transplants baked in the sun all day. I don't think she ever used it so there are many plants that are almost on top of each other. Not sure if they would survive a transplant or if I should just yank them up and trash them.

5. All the Thais that came over yesterday said the fruit was way to big. "do you think your growing apples?" was the consistant comment!! OK, pick them smaller, not a big deal.

6. I cannot get seeds to germinate this time around. I planted about 300 seeds in the plastic trays about 2 weeks ago and not one of them came up. I used dirt from the existing 1 rai and I think I should have went out and got some potting soil. Will try again.

rgds

[Khonwan]

Nice, is that all of them or are there plenty more maturing? Your progress reports are very interesting to me.

Thanks

No, not all of them. I pick them every morning and I am get a few more each day. My New Year's resolution...start an Excel spreadsheet and log daily the weight picked and then share it with you guys in a month or so. Day 1 - ok; Day 2 - suffering from major NY party hangover....took the day off!!

From Maize Farmer's descriptions I am loving the makhua idea. The big question for me is can a guy that doesn't even keep potted plants alive in his house manage to grow anything outside.

They seem to be very easy plants to grow although I do have some problems.

1. There's a few plants that have the fungus Maize talked about. The plants just sort of shrivel up and die.

2. The seed packs we bought don't seem to be that pure. There are 3 variety's growing that were all planted from the same bag of seeds.

3. Worms, worms, worms. The pure white fruit plants seem to have an affinity for worms. I'd say at least 30% of those fruits have worms in them when I pick them. I'm not very keen on spraying even if I did know what to spray with. We'll see how it goes.

4. The 1.5m long stick I made for auntie who did the transplants baked in the sun all day. I don't think she ever used it so there are many plants that are almost on top of each other. Not sure if they would survive a transplant or if I should just yank them up and trash them.

5. All the Thais that came over yesterday said the fruit was way to big. "do you think your growing apples?" was the consistant comment!! OK, pick them smaller, not a big deal.

6. I cannot get seeds to germinate this time around. I planted about 300 seeds in the plastic trays about 2 weeks ago and not one of them came up. I used dirt from the existing 1 rai and I think I should have went out and got some potting soil. Will try again.

rgds

I too am very interested in your findings, Somtham, as I'm considering trying 1-4 rai myself. I can't recall from your earlier posts - did you use plastic buckets on any part of your site? That's the way I'd like to go.

[Tim207]

3. Worms, worms, worms. The pure white fruit plants seem to have an affinity for worms. I'd say at least 30% of those fruits have worms in them when I pick them. I'm not very keen on spraying even if I did know what to spray with. We'll see how it goes.

I can't be sure, but I believe there was some discussion on pesticides and worms in particular somewhere here.

4. The 1.5m long stick I made for auntie who did the transplants baked in the sun all day. I don't think she ever used it so there are many plants that are almost on top of each other. Not sure if they would survive a transplant or if I should just yank them up and trash them.

If you are just going to kill them you might as well try putting them in buckets as an experiment.

6. I cannot get seeds to germinate this time around. I planted about 300 seeds in the plastic trays about 2 weeks ago and not one of them came up. I used dirt from the existing 1 rai and I think I should have went out and got some potting soil. Will try again.

Seeds can be a problem. For years I have dreamed of supplying my makhua habit by growing them in the US. First two years not one plant. Last summer I gave seeds to a gardener friend. He got two plants but by first frost the plants were still only a foot tall and never a fruit.

Since this thread started I now understand what I was doing wrong. I had some seeds so I tried to get them to germinate using a method recomended specifically for eggplant. Of the 14 seeds only 3 germinated. Admittedly, my early attempts were shove the seed in the ground and walk away but even after learning proper methods the germination rate is only about 20%.

[pallasaide]

Somtham

Sorry for taking so long to reply to you.

Tim has seen all your notes and I have sent you a brief reply to your message box.

Sincerely

D.V.

Nice, is that all of them or are there plenty more maturing? Your progress reports are very interesting to me.

Thanks

No, not all of them. I pick them every morning and I am get a few more each day. My New Year's resolution...start an Excel spreadsheet and log daily the weight picked and then share it with you guys in a month or so. Day 1 - ok; Day 2 - suffering from major NY party hangover....took the day off!!

From Maize Farmer's descriptions I am loving the makhua idea. The big question for me is can a guy that doesn't even keep potted plants alive in his house manage to grow anything outside.

They seem to be very easy plants to grow although I do have some problems.

1. There's a few plants that have the fungus Maize talked about. The plants just sort of shrivel up and die.

2. The seed packs we bought don't seem to be that pure. There are 3 variety's growing that were all planted from the same bag of seeds.

3. Worms, worms, worms. The pure white fruit plants seem to have an affinity for worms. I'd say at least 30% of those fruits have worms in them when I pick them. I'm not very keen on spraying even if I did know what to spray with. We'll see how it goes.

4. The 1.5m long stick I made for auntie who did the transplants baked in the sun all day. I don't think she ever used it so there are many plants that are almost on top of each other. Not sure if they would survive a transplant or if I should just yank them up and trash them.

5. All the Thais that came over yesterday said the fruit was way to big. "do you think your growing apples?" was the consistant comment!! OK, pick them smaller, not a big deal.

6. I cannot get seeds to germinate this time around. I planted about 300 seeds in the plastic trays about 2 weeks ago and not one of them came up. I used dirt from the existing 1 rai and I think I should have went out and got some potting soil. Will try again.

rgds

[tato71]

Dear Tim,

First of al i am wishing you and your families an happy, healthy and

prosperous new year 2007

Your post are all excellent and i have printed them all out for future reference.

I am a Swiss guy married with a nice and charming Thai wife and intend to settle

down in Thailand within the next 2-3 years. We are considering buying between 20-40 rai

and still wondering what to do with it. My first thought was growing Palm trees but then

we would need a much bigger piece of land and put maybe too much money for the next 3-5

years without having any income from the trees but quite a big amount of money to take

care of the land / tress while they are growing.

Reading at your post it appears that Makua business would be a better choice, understand that

you have 20 rai north of Kon Ken but are you only growing Makua for a living ?

May i ask you what is your monthly running costs for growing 20 rai of Makua ? What is your

approximate net monthly revenu ?

Do you know the land price around your area 1) not near land or water facilities 2) near road

with water supply ?

Many thanks for your advise,

B.rgds

Tato

CNXPAT

Hers another option to discuss this with your other half - "Makua", those small hard green tomatoes you see in Thai soups and other dishes.

If you do it properly they will take 3 months to start producing and from 3 or 4 rai you'll be able to pick daily and generate around Baht 1000 - 2000 per day - yup, you pick them daily.

The Thai's love them (i.e. you will have no problems selling them at any market).

They're a tough hardy plant which are easy to grow (if done carefully are a commericaly vaiable - I have 21 rai) and will be a cheap introduction to farming, rom which you can easily get out of without lossing anything, should you change your mind or circumstances change.

Discuss it with your other half, and if the idea sounds good I'll fill you in on the fine detail.

It will get you out of bed early every morning ... they are best picked at dawn when still full of moisture.

Tim

[Somtham]

I too am very interested in your findings, Somtham, as I'm considering trying 1-4 rai myself. I can't recall from your earlier posts - did you use plastic buckets on any part of your site? That's the way I'd like to go.

Regretably no plastic buckets at this time. Straight into the ground. But as Tim207 suggested I may try transplanting some into buckets to eliminate the overcrowding proble I have.

Pallasaide - got your message and will reply in the morning with the pics Tim is looking for. There was a post by him earlier that mentioned what and how to spray for the bugs.

rgds

[pallasaide]

Tato

I will see him late afternoon Pacific time and then post what he has had to say.

Thanks

D.V.

Dear Tim,

First of al i am wishing you and your families an happy, healthy and

prosperous new year 2007

Your post are all excellent and i have printed them all out for future reference.

I am a Swiss guy married with a nice and charming Thai wife and intend to settle

down in Thailand within the next 2-3 years. We are considering buying between 20-40 rai

and still wondering what to do with it. My first thought was growing Palm trees but then

we would need a much bigger piece of land and put maybe too much money for the next 3-5

years without having any income from the trees but quite a big amount of money to take

care of the land / tress while they are growing.

Reading at your post it appears that Makua business would be a better choice, understand that

you have 20 rai north of Kon Ken but are you only growing Makua for a living ?

May i ask you what is your monthly running costs for growing 20 rai of Makua ? What is your

approximate net monthly revenu ?

Do you know the land price around your area 1) not near land or water facilities 2) near road

with water supply ?

Many thanks for your advise,

B.rgds

Tato

CNXPAT

Hers another option to discuss this with your other half - "Makua", those small hard green tomatoes you see in Thai soups and other dishes.

If you do it properly they will take 3 months to start producing and from 3 or 4 rai you'll be able to pick daily and generate around Baht 1000 - 2000 per day - yup, you pick them daily.

The Thai's love them (i.e. you will have no problems selling them at any market).

They're a tough hardy plant which are easy to grow (if done carefully are a commericaly vaiable - I have 21 rai) and will be a cheap introduction to farming, rom which you can easily get out of without lossing anything, should you change your mind or circumstances change.

Discuss it with your other half, and if the idea sounds good I'll fill you in on the fine detail.

It will get you out of bed early every morning ... they are best picked at dawn when still full of moisture.

Tim

[pallasaide]

Answers

1) You have to get those plants out and take them off the land in a plastic bag. Put some lime or ammonia in the hole and dont plant anything else there as it will die as well.

2) You get seeds and you get seeds. You have poor quality seeds, more than likely counterfeits using the brandname of a well established brandname.

3) If you have worms you should spray. Not wanting to spray is a nice idea, but not practical. It will just get worse.

4) Uneven spacing between the plants is not the end of the world. It will reduce the harvest from those plants bunched up more and more as they get bigger, and they will suffer more and more from insect damage. From a commercial point of view it would be best to replant those plants correctly spaced but from what you have said you may then have to tear up half your field (much to aunties horror), but otherwise stomach it, watch how it affects yield and make sure it doesnt happen next time round.

4) Watch the size. Everyone lets them grow to big to start.

5) 300 seeds planted none have grown. You have done some thing wrong. If thats the case its either the temperature or you have bad seeds.

For Tim

D.V.

Nice, is that all of them or are there plenty more maturing? Your progress reports are very interesting to me.

Thanks

No, not all of them. I pick them every morning and I am get a few more each day. My New Year's resolution...start an Excel spreadsheet and log daily the weight picked and then share it with you guys in a month or so. Day 1 - ok; Day 2 - suffering from major NY party hangover....took the day off!!

From Maize Farmer's descriptions I am loving the makhua idea. The big question for me is can a guy that doesn't even keep potted plants alive in his house manage to grow anything outside.

They seem to be very easy plants to grow although I do have some problems.

1. There's a few plants that have the fungus Maize talked about. The plants just sort of shrivel up and die.

2. The seed packs we bought don't seem to be that pure. There are 3 variety's growing that were all planted from the same bag of seeds.

3. Worms, worms, worms. The pure white fruit plants seem to have an affinity for worms. I'd say at least 30% of those fruits have worms in them when I pick them. I'm not very keen on spraying even if I did know what to spray with. We'll see how it goes.

4. The 1.5m long stick I made for auntie who did the transplants baked in the sun all day. I don't think she ever used it so there are many plants that are almost on top of each other. Not sure if they would survive a transplant or if I should just yank them up and trash them.

5. All the Thais that came over yesterday said the fruit was way to big. "do you think your growing apples?" was the consistant comment!! OK, pick them smaller, not a big deal.

6. I cannot get seeds to germinate this time around. I planted about 300 seeds in the plastic trays about 2 weeks ago and not one of them came up. I used dirt from the existing 1 rai and I think I should have went out and got some potting soil. Will try again.

rgds

[pallasaide]

If you only have 20-20rai you should diversify. It would be crazy to plant it all with one crop. No, Tim has close on 1400 rai of which only 21 is planted with vegetable. And that is a lot for a single vegetable. The rest of the land is used to sustain a commercial dairy and beef production unit and is planted with maize, sugercane and forage grass. The Makua is a sideline

If Makua grow then so will other vegetable.

But you are asking a very broad question. There are so many factors that have to be considered, like soil, land, water, where in Thailand will they farm be and loads of other issues.

If you are moving to Thailand and intend to make a living out of farming meaning it will be your only source of income, take note. You will live in debt and abject poverty if you grow rice on 20-40 rai. So forget that one. Whatever you do, if you want to sustain a Western type income you have a lot of homework to do and you will be working 24hrs 365 days every year, and you are going to have to grow a high nett value crop. Something like high quality cantaloupes in greenhouses would work.

Flowers or orchads is a possibility (huge market in Europe for orchads from Asia and it is growing every year.

Be careful, very careful, and use your head in making all decisions (not your heart).

Start off small, about 1 - 3 rai absolute max and do that for 6-12months. Establish yourself , your lifestyle and that you enjoy what you are doing. Tim has said that for nearly 20 years he has got up every morning for at 3.30am and worked sometimes 16-18hrs a day. In the begining he hated it with a vengence and had to discipline himself to do it. But he had a goal to work for. It was not until after about 5 years that he felt he was on the way to success and it was not untill about 10 years was up that he felt he had hacked it, enoyed it and made a success of it. During that time he saw dozens of foreigners arrive in the area, marry, settle down, try one thing after another and then within 3-5 years they were gone never to be seen again.

The reasons were many and varied but overall they thought they had adapted, they thought "this was it", they thought all sorts of things but they all made one common mistake. They thought with their hearts and not their heads.

Successful farming in Thailand is not easy. It is a tough profession. 20-40 rai is not "hobby farming". It will absorb a fair amount of capital to set up both in terms of labour and equipment if you wish it to work properly.

A mixed crop will be best, but exactly what will be dependant on many factors.

For Tim

D.V.

Dear Tim,

First of al i am wishing you and your families an happy, healthy and

prosperous new year 2007

Your post are all excellent and i have printed them all out for future reference.

I am a Swiss guy married with a nice and charming Thai wife and intend to settle

down in Thailand within the next 2-3 years. We are considering buying between 20-40 rai

and still wondering what to do with it. My first thought was growing Palm trees but then

we would need a much bigger piece of land and put maybe too much money for the next 3-5

years without having any income from the trees but quite a big amount of money to take

care of the land / tress while they are growing.

Reading at your post it appears that Makua business would be a better choice, understand that

you have 20 rai north of Kon Ken but are you only growing Makua for a living ?

May i ask you what is your monthly running costs for growing 20 rai of Makua ? What is your

approximate net monthly revenu ?

Do you know the land price around your area 1) not near land or water facilities 2) near road

with water supply ?

Many thanks for your advise,

B.rgds

Tato

CNXPAT

Hers another option to discuss this with your other half - "Makua", those small hard green tomatoes you see in Thai soups and other dishes.

If you do it properly they will take 3 months to start producing and from 3 or 4 rai you'll be able to pick daily and generate around Baht 1000 - 2000 per day - yup, you pick them daily.

The Thai's love them (i.e. you will have no problems selling them at any market).

They're a tough hardy plant which are easy to grow (if done carefully are a commericaly vaiable - I have 21 rai) and will be a cheap introduction to farming, rom which you can easily get out of without lossing anything, should you change your mind or circumstances change.

Discuss it with your other half, and if the idea sounds good I'll fill you in on the fine detail.

It will get you out of bed early every morning ... they are best picked at dawn when still full of moisture.

Tim

[Somtham]

Pallasaide - Here are the pictures that Tim wanted to see.

These first 3 are what I consider samples of the healthy plants. For ref the blue vertical pvc pipe behind some of the plants is 1m tall.

These 2 plants appear to have the fungus.

These are the seeds that were used.

And here's the latest problem. Several of the plants are starting to fall over. They still look healthy and have fruit. Not sure if it's over watering, laziness, or what.

Tell Tim thanks for the answers you sent in another mail. On thelack of the seed germination the Thai family members told me the dirt was packed to tight and that I should get some real potting soil instead of dirt from the garden.

Give Tim my regards. Very happy to hear he is doing better and will soon be out of ICU.

[pallasaide]

Somtham

I am picking his wife up at the airport in the morning, so will print all this out and take it with. A plant is a plant is a plant to me, so I am not saying anything! He asked me to ask you if you still have the packet that you got the seeds in? Who is the producer and would it be possible to post a few closeup pictures of the flowers so he can try and work out which varieties got mixed up in the packet.

He said something about mixed varieties grwoing together and how it will effect crop yields more and more as the plants mature becaus eof the cross pollination that is going to occur. It can be a good or bad depending on the variety mix. I'll get the low down from him tomorrow.

D.V.

[Somtham]

Somtham

I am picking his wife up at the airport in the morning, so will print all this out and take it with. A plant is a plant is a plant to me, so I am not saying anything! He asked me to ask you if you still have the packet that you got the seeds in? Who is the producer and would it be possible to post a few closeup pictures of the flowers so he can try and work out which varieties got mixed up in the packet.

He said something about mixed varieties grwoing together and how it will effect crop yields more and more as the plants mature becaus eof the cross pollination that is going to occur. It can be a good or bad depending on the variety mix. I'll get the low down from him tomorrow.

D.V.

DV - a picture of the seed pack is in my last reply with other photos.

Here's flower and fruit of the intended variety - Chaopraya

Here's flower and fruit of an all white variety. The flower looks to me the same as the Chaopraya but the fruit is definately different - name unknown to me

Here's flower and fruit of the third variety - possibly Tiger?

thanks again. Hey, you're up either really late or really early :-)

[pallasaide]

Somtham

Got them all.

Didn't realise what the packet was but Tim will no doubt recognise it.

I work for LAPD on the Santa Monica and beach cities patch, and am currently on night shift's till the end of Jan. Had just finished night shift. I have only been to Thailand once about 13 years ago.

Its no good asking him about living in Thailand as he has some very set views on it and doesn't understand why anyone would want to live in busy tourist areas. I'm the oppsite and prefer beach places and nightlife.

How do you find living in Thailand? Easy to settle in?

You have all sorts of rules and regulations about buying land and building houses?

I'm asking because I have retirement coming up in about 6 years and the idea of a 2nd home somewhere in a place like Thailand or South India (goa) sounds like fun.

I will get a reply from him later this morning.

D.V.

[Tim207]

These are the seeds that were used.

LOL, That is the same brand I tried with my terrible results. Pallasaide, please ask Tim where we can get quality seeds or what is a good brand.

Edited January 4, 2007 by Tim207

[pallasaide]

Somtham & Tim 207

I am with Tim at the moment. This is what he has to say.

The wilted plants are exactly what he warned about. Dig up, put in a bag and take off the field and burn.

When you take the plant out of the ground take a look at the main stem, just where it goes into the ground, and just below the ground. Is it it damp or wet and soft or mushy? It may or also smell a bit like ammonia? Or it could have a thin white or grey film growing on it. Or it may look quite normal.

Which is it.

You have 2 varities growing. Dont worry about it.

The plants are a bit stunted and could do with half a cup of fertiliser sprinkeled around their base. It will get them grwoing up and increase flower production dramatiocally. You have perinnial grass growing which has used up a lot of the nutrients. Get some 2:3:4:. This will stimulate root growth, which is what you need to do now before the dry season sets in good and proper. Abot 1/3 to 1/2 a cup applied at the base of the plant will make a big differance. In about a 4 weeks time you can apply some 3:2:1 (phosphate), about the same amount, but only if you are still watering. It will be pointless apply if you are not watering. This will encourage foilage growth during the dry season increasing your crop yield a lot.

Dont worry about the yellowing leaves low down. It is nothing to worry about, but watch out for leaves that start to take on grey, purpalish or rust coloured blotches and stains. The odd few is okay but if it looks as though its spreading, pick a few leaves and take a closer look underneath. You are more than likely going to find colonies of white or green aphids.

You have to spray otherwise they will feed on your plants during the dry season. Use Karate Zeon and apply it according to the instructions. It is systemic and can be applied by sprinkler, or buy can or by sprayer, as it is absorbed through the leaves as wel las the roots. If you spray, then spray early in the evening. This gives extar time for the moisture to absorb. Karate Zeon will deal with just about any bug you have.

Tim accepts that you have made it clear that you prefer not to, but adds that you need to be realistic about it. It is 100% safe if applied properly.

Otherwise, he reackons you have done just great and the plants, although a little stunted (the fertiliser regime will qucikly address that), look absolutely fine and healthy. Nothing to be worried about.

The seed you chose was not what he would have chosen personally. Give him a day or 2 and he will recall the brandname you can try next time. But stick with what you have for now. The other thing to check on seed packets is the date. It sould be stamped or embossed somewhere. Its not unusual to find them out of date.

The plants falling over? Pull one up, choose the one that is lying over the most. Check the stem where it goes into the ground. Split it in half and look for worm damage. Report back for next step if there is no worm damage but that is quite possibly the cause, a worm has burrowed into the stem at or just below ground level and is eating out the inside of the main stem , weakening it to the point where it can no longer support the wieght of the plant. Again, sorry to say but it is another reason why you should apply some insecticide.

Lastly, the seeds that did not germinate. Yes, if packed down to tight they will not germinate. he wrote something up about that in his original detailed writeup on the subject. You need to go back to that as he cant recall the detail but basically its something along the lines of not more than an about 1cm-2cm deep in the seed tray and use the watering to compact the soil on top of the seed, do not press down.

Overall it looks good and there does not appear to be any significant problem. Foilage is dense and consistant and the plants appear to be growing at much the same rate accept for those that are obvously not up to scratch. Any plant that has badly stunted growth can be taken out and replanted with a seedling. It will be a crop or 2 behind but will soon catch up with the rest. No pint in leaving in a badly stunted plant.

You will wake up one warm morning sometime over the next 3 - 5 weeks and find a mass of flowers (still a little earlier). Then you know it's all on its way to full production.

It's looking good.

For Tim

D.V.

These are the seeds that were used.

LOL, That is the same brand I tried with my terrible results. Pallasaide, please ask Tim where we can get quality seeds or what is a good brand.

[btate]

Sheeeeshs

What a guy, apparently still in ICU recovering from a trip to death's door and STILL willing to share and educate us wannabees.

Now that's dedication.

Thanks Tim and a speedy recovery.

[pallasaide]

Thanks - I'll pass it on.

He's fine in the sense that he is well on the road to recovery now and has been since just before Christmas. We are encouraging him to do this because he has had no mental stimulation for quite a while. Its standard policy in American hospitals to spend as much of insurance companies money as possible if you know what I mean! He would go home tomorrow if he could.

Sheeeeshs

What a guy, apparently still in ICU recovering from a trip to death's door and STILL willing to share and educate us wannabees.

Now that's dedication.

Thanks Tim and a speedy recovery.

[pallasaide]

Tim says, use East-West Seed Company seeds next time round, but do not take up what you have planted. See it through for a year or 2 and about 6 weeks before you want to change over plant the East-West seeds in their trays.

They produce a ful range of vegetable seeds but concentrate on Thai vegetables and produce all makua varieties. You would do no harm in phoning them (they have an english website somewhere) and getting through to the guy who knows all about Makua. Tim says he speaks english well but hasnt spoken to him for about 2 years and cant remember his name. He travels a lot around the country and if the seeds you want are not in your area he wil lbring them to you or post them to you. He also has a lot of knowledge.

These are the seeds that were used.

LOL, That is the same brand I tried with my terrible results. Pallasaide, please ask Tim where we can get quality seeds or what is a good brand.

[Tim207]

Tim says, use East-West Seed Company seeds next time round,

To save all the google searches the site is http://www.eastwestseed.com/ . The website is a little lite on varieties and has no ordering mechanism but an address and phone number is there. I suspect they have far more than what they show on the website. They are located in Nontaburi but I have e-mailed to see if they have local distributors in my area. I will post any reply here for you other guys around Chan who may be interested.

[Somtham]

Somtham & Tim 207

I am with Tim at the moment. This is what he has to say.

The wilted plants are exactly what he warned about. Dig up, put in a bag and take off the field and burn.

When you take the plant out of the ground take a look at the main stem, just where it goes into the ground, and just below the ground. Is it it damp or wet and soft or mushy? It may or also smell a bit like ammonia? Or it could have a thin white or grey film growing on it. Or it may look quite normal.

Which is it.

Too late. I pulled them up, bagged, and burnt them yesterday and then filled the holes with poon khao. I didn't notice any ammonia smell but the plants have been dead for awile. There is one more plant that looks like it's headed south so if it gets much worse I'll pull and check for mushines

The plants are a bit stunted and could do with half a cup of fertiliser sprinkeled around their base. It will get them grwoing up and increase flower production dramatiocally. You have perinnial grass growing which has used up a lot of the nutrients. Get some 2:3:4:. This will stimulate root growth, which is what you need to do now before the dry season sets in good and proper. Abot 1/3 to 1/2 a cup applied at the base of the plant will make a big differance. In about a 4 weeks time you can apply some 3:2:1 (phosphate), about the same amount, but only if you are still watering. It will be pointless apply if you are not watering. This will encourage foilage growth during the dry season increasing your crop yield a lot.

Could not find a 2-3-4 fertizer in Kamphaengphet so I bought 13-13-21. I also got the 3-2-1 for next month. Water supply is no problem so I will keep watering year round.

Dont worry about the yellowing leaves low down. It is nothing to worry about, but watch out for leaves that start to take on grey, purpalish or rust coloured blotches and stains. The odd few is okay but if it looks as though its spreading, pick a few leaves and take a closer look underneath. You are more than likely going to find colonies of white or green aphids.

You have to spray otherwise they will feed on your plants during the dry season. Use Karate Zeon and apply it according to the instructions. It is systemic and can be applied by sprinkler, or buy can or by sprayer, as it is absorbed through the leaves as wel las the roots. If you spray, then spray early in the evening. This gives extar time for the moisture to absorb. Karate Zeon will deal with just about any bug you have.

No aphids yet. I bought the Karate, no Zeon available, today and will spray tomorrow evening.

The seed you chose was not what he would have chosen personally. Give him a day or 2 and he will recall the brandname you can try next time. But stick with what you have for now. The other thing to check on seed packets is the date. It sould be stamped or embossed somewhere. Its not unusual to find them out of date.

The seeds are supposed to be good until July 07 with a 98% purity!!

The plants falling over? Pull one up, choose the one that is lying over the most. Check the stem where it goes into the ground. Split it in half and look for worm damage. Report back for next step if there is no worm damage but that is quite possibly the cause, a worm has burrowed into the stem at or just below ground level and is eating out the inside of the main stem , weakening it to the point where it can no longer support the wieght of the plant. Again, sorry to say but it is another reason why you should apply some insecticide.

Pulled a prone plant and did not see any evidence of worm or other insects burrowing. The stem is very firm and was hard to pull from the ground. Here's a couple pics of the plant and root.

You will wake up one warm morning sometime over the next 3 - 5 weeks and find a mass of flowers (still a little earlier). Then you know it's all on its way to full production.

Some time ago people were asking Tim where he sells his produce and the reply was something like "don't worry, once they know you have makua they'll be knocking down your door". Well, on Monday MIL took home 3kg to sell to the restaraunt next to her house. She went to three other restaraunts in her neighboorhood to check if the B10 price was right. They all wanted to order makuas from her. Yesterday the worker took home the 6kg we had. :-) "They'll be knocking down the door!"

Oh, just saw the post on the seeds and I will try to find them locally. I won't pull any existing healthy plants but I still have space reserved in the garden for another 300 plants or so.

Thank you.

[Tim207]

Pulled a prone plant and did not see any evidence of worm or other insects burrowing. The stem is very firm and was hard to pull from the ground. Here's a couple pics of the plant and root.

Just a thought, do you have kids or large animals running around that could have stepped on it? I picture the little boys around the house chasing eachother. When they are playing they could bounce off a baby elephant, hop over it's back and still not notice they stepped on the elephant.

Some time ago people were asking Tim where he sells his produce and the reply was something like "don't worry, once they know you have makua they'll be knocking down your door". Well, on Monday MIL took home 3kg to sell to the restaraunt next to her house. She went to three other restaraunts in her neighboorhood to check if the B10 price was right. They all wanted to order makuas from her. Yesterday the worker took home the 6kg we had. :-) "They'll be knocking down the door!"

It amazes me that just a few months ago Tim through out the idea of makhua as a cash crop and here you are with producing plants and selling everyting before it is even picked.

[Somtham]

Just a thought, do you have kids or large animals running around that could have stepped on it? I picture the little boys around the house chasing eachother. When they are playing they could bounce off a baby elephant, hop over it's back and still not notice they stepped on the elephant.

No kids running around here although we do have a 2 yo German Shepard. He's pretty smart and he does spend time with me in the garden. I haven't ever seen him tramping plants anywhere in the yard although he does like to fertilize every now and then :-)

It amazes me that just a few months ago Tim through out the idea of makhua as a cash crop and here you are with producing plants and selling everyting before it is even picked.

Great, isn't it. Since the garden is only 1 rai the wife mentioned yesterday that maybe we should fill a 15 rai rice paddy and plant more!!

[pallasaide]

Somtham

Tim says, he told - once news got round you wouldnt have a problem selling what you produced.

Good if you can get in with the resturants in your area. Get round to the fresh market every morning, check out the market price and be willing to beat the market, even if it is only by 1 or 2 cents that will be fine.

Make an effort not to send worm damaged or browned makua to the resturant, and get your other half to play up that you pick fresh every morning.

13 13 21 will be fine.

I have showed him the picture of the plants you pulled up. He doesnt like the look of the mottled yellow on the leaves. That is not what he was expecting. Closer picture if possible.

There is little differance between Karate and Karate Zeon. Both will do okay.

No explination for why the plants fell over. Its usualy worm damage to the stem where it comes out the ground. Hes going to chew it over for a day or 2.