May ready for tough talks over Brexit

[pitrevie]

44 minutes ago, aright said:

You need to read more and leave the first Industrial Revolution behind you. We are in phase 5 or is it 6 now.

Nobody produces complete aircraft anymore. It's all about modular systems.

Outsourcing

Many components are not built by Boeing but are outsourced to other manufacturers both in the US and increasingly around the world. This may be either for cost savings in production, specialist development or as an incentive for that country to buy other Boeing products. Here is a list of some of the outsourced components:

• Fuselage, engine nacelles and pylons - Spirit AeroSystems (formerly Boeing), Wichita.
• Slats and flaps - Spirit AeroSystems (formerly Boeing), Tulsa.
• Doors - Vought, Stuart, FL.
• Spoilers - Goodrich, Charlotte, NC.
• Vertical fin - Xi'an Aircraft Industry, China.
• Horizontal stabiliser - Korea Aerospace Industries.
• Ailerons - Asian Composites Manufacturing, Malaysia.
• Rudder - Bombardier, Belfast and AVIC subsidiary Chengfei Commercial Aircraft (CCAC), China
• Tail section (aluminium extrusions for) - Alcoa / Shanghai Aircraft Manufacturing, China.
• Main landing gear doors - Aerospace Industrial Development Corp, Taiwan.
• Inboard Flap - Mitsubishi, Japan.
• Elevator - Fuji, Japan.
• Winglets - Kawasaki, Japan.
• Fwd entry door & Overwing exits - Chengdu Aircraft, China.
• Wing-to-body fairing panels and tail cone - BHA Aero Composite Parts Co. Ltd, China.

As for nuclear reactors

http://www.cityam.com/256579/rolls-royce-launches-partnership-engineering-giants-amec

 

As for Dyson He claims that assembly as opposed to manufacturing  isn't worth a candle but what does he know? He claims in todays world intellectual property is more important than manufacturing. How much is his business worth? Do you think by assembling in Asia thus denying Brits jobs he is immoral?  As a shareholder myself of manufacturing companies I expect the owner or CEO  of those companies to have an obligation, to me, to maximise profits and share value and if that involves manufacturing off shore get it on. It's called Capitalism and I am the one risking my capital.  You can of course change this at the next election by voting for Corbyn who will nationalise everything and bring it all in house,  but be assured you will get a tractor report every week.

 

I was in Edinburgh last month for the Festival. Had dinner on 2 nights in Leith...great place.

Poundland is a chain of stores (Indian owned I think) where everything costs a £1. I doubt you would find them north of the border they are far too expensive for Scotland.      

Perhaps he should have a word with the Germans but hell what do they know about manufacturing.

 

An interesting article about Dyson who was an avid supporter of joining the Euro and then his nose got put of of joint when he lost a legal challenge in Europe along with other similar switches in allegiance,

 

https://www.ft.com/content/d8e3eb44-3244-11e6-bda0-04585c31b153

[pitrevie]

13 minutes ago, aright said:

Why not throw in some reality as well. The EU has no control over who we sell arms to now or post Brexit.

It appears they do post Brexit.

https://epthinktank.eu/2015/12/14/eu-rules-on-control-of-arms-exports/

[aright]

4 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

It appears they do post Brexit.

https://epthinktank.eu/2015/12/14/eu-rules-on-control-of-arms-exports/

A policy of enhancement is not control. Where does it say in that document that when we leave the EU they will still control who we sell to.

[pitrevie]

1 minute ago, aright said:

A policy of enhancement is not control. Where does it say in that document that when we leave the EU they will still control who we sell to.

it appears they issue licences which implies some form of control

The eight common criteria for assessing arms export licences .....

[aright]

Make up your mind. You said post brexit

[aright]

21 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

Perhaps he should have a word with the Germans but hell what do they know about manufacturing.

 

An interesting article about Bryson who was an avid supporter of joining the Euro and then his nose got put of of joint when he lost a legal challenge in Europe along with other similar switches in allegiance,

 

https://www.ft.com/content/d8e3eb44-3244-11e6-bda0-04585c31b153

I thought Bryson was an American author.

[pitrevie]

Just now, aright said:

Make up your mind. You said post brexit

Sorry I should have said pre Brexit but of course you knew that

[pitrevie]

1 minute ago, aright said:

I thought Bryson was an American author.

 

1 minute ago, aright said:

I thought Bryson was an American author.

Don't address the subject just pick up on a simple mistake

[Srikcir]

6 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

it appears they issue licences which implies some form of control

The eight common criteria for assessing arms export licences .....

Isn't that for EU Member States?

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/IDAN/2017/578047/EXPO_IDA(2017)578047_EN.pdf

How would that apply to a nonMember state which UK will become?

 

[pitrevie]

Just now, Srikcir said:

Isn't that for EU Member States?

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/IDAN/2017/578047/EXPO_IDA(2017)578047_EN.pdf

How would that apply to a nonMember state which UK will become?

 

I agree my OP should have said pre Brexit which aright knew but he implied there were no control and it appears the EU does have a licensing system which implies some form of control over conventional arms sales. 

[aright]

32 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

Perhaps he should have a word with the Germans but hell what do they know about manufacturing.

 

An interesting article about Bryson who was an avid supporter of joining the Euro and then his nose got put of of joint when he lost a legal challenge in Europe along with other similar switches in allegiance,

 

https://www.ft.com/content/d8e3eb44-3244-11e6-bda0-04585c31b153

I don't think the Germans would know any more about manufacturing than the engineers at Rolls Royce Bristol, the wing experts at Broughton or James Dyson. Why do you want to disrespect a man who has created by his own hands a net worth of £8billion and provides employment for almost 5000 people in the UK. A man who also puts back into the UK

 

'Dyson degree'

Sir James' comments came as 33 undergraduates began studying at the Dyson Institute of Engineering and Technology.

The student engineers have begun a four-year degree, during which they will be mentored by Dyson's scientists and engineers who will teach alongside academics from Warwick University.

Universities Minister Jo Johnson challenged Sir James 18 months ago to help train engineers in the UK.

Sir James said: "It is a great opportunity, and I think a great step forward in the way that higher education is provided.

"We're paying these people, they're getting about 40 days a year more academic time than you'd get at university, plus the fact that they're working with some of the best scientists and engineers in the world."

[aright]

2 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

I agree my OP should have said pre Brexit which aright knew but he implied there were no control and it appears the EU does have a licensing system which implies some form of control over conventional arms sales. 

I stand by what I said  the important word is assessing. Assessing does not imply control

It doesn't say eight common criteria for controlling

[pitrevie]

Just now, aright said:

I don't think the Germans would know any more about manufacturing than the engineers at Rolls Royce Bristol, the wing experts at Broughton or James Dyson. Why do you want to disrespect a man who has created by his own hands a net worth of £8billion and provides employment for almost 5000 people in the UK. A man who also puts back into the UK

 

'Dyson degree'

Sir James' comments came as 33 undergraduates began studying at the Dyson Institute of Engineering and Technology.

The student engineers have begun a four-year degree, during which they will be mentored by Dyson's scientists and engineers who will teach alongside academics from Warwick University.

Universities Minister Jo Johnson challenged Sir James 18 months ago to help train engineers in the UK.

Sir James said: "It is a great opportunity, and I think a great step forward in the way that higher education is provided.

"We're paying these people, they're getting about 40 days a year more academic time than you'd get at university, plus the fact that they're working with some of the best scientists and engineers in the world."

I see you have avoided the real issue. You were implying that Dyson was some sort of authority on manufacturing well it appears the Germans have maintained a very highly successful manufacturing industry so they really do know something about these things.

Dyson went from being an avid supporter of Europe and the Euro as a result of a lost legal challenge. 

 

[pitrevie]

2 minutes ago, aright said:

I stand by what I said  the important word is assessing. Assessing does not imply control

It doesn't say eight common criteria for controlling

It says licensing and licensing implies some form of control. In order to get an export licence they need to meet eight common criteria. That seems perfectly straightforward if there were no controls why would you need an export licence?

[rockingrobin]

8 minutes ago, aright said:

I don't think the Germans would know any more about manufacturing than the engineers at Rolls Royce Bristol, the wing experts at Broughton or James Dyson. Why do you want to disrespect a man who has created by his own hands a net worth of £8billion and provides employment for almost 5000 people in the UK. A man who also puts back into the UK

 

'Dyson degree'

Sir James' comments came as 33 undergraduates began studying at the Dyson Institute of Engineering and Technology.

The student engineers have begun a four-year degree, during which they will be mentored by Dyson's scientists and engineers who will teach alongside academics from Warwick University.

Universities Minister Jo Johnson challenged Sir James 18 months ago to help train engineers in the UK.

Sir James said: "It is a great opportunity, and I think a great step forward in the way that higher education is provided.

"We're paying these people, they're getting about 40 days a year more academic time than you'd get at university, plus the fact that they're working with some of the best scientists and engineers in the world."

Dyson's success came about from a remark he made to a question put to him by Lord Howe in 1995 , who used is influence to put Dyson in touch with Comet

[aright]

What? Are you saying James Dyson who employs about 9000 people world wide  and manufactures a variety of products which  he sells globally knows nothing about manufacturing. It beggars belief.

As for his opinions on the Euro and Europe, I wouldn't hold that against him and certainly they don't have anything to do with or detract from his knowledge of manufacturing. Why do you think he was Knighted? 

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

Edinburgh?

 

Went to UNI there / Rose Street & Royal Mile piss ups- ahh memories!!

 

RR; do some formidable marine stuff you guys seem to forget about,

       both engine/propulsion thingies

      as weel excellent electronic gadgets for the offshore industry - dynamic positioning and such

 

------------

Interesting and sizeable brexit related article in today's Bangkok Post:

 

One of several reasons that some people voted brexit was to stop the inflow of riff raff from the less

well off EU states (read Eastern Europe).

Seems that has been successful already, the inflow has stopped up severly,

hurting the UK service industry badly. More than 200 000 riff raff missing in the service industry already.

Several hotel and hotel like establishments suffer badly.

 

 

Edinburgh is one of my favourite places - Athens of the North.

 

I favour The Grass Market and Cowgate. Bannerman's Rock and Whisky Bar. Splendid!

[rockingrobin]

1 minute ago, aright said:

What? Are you saying James Dyson who employs about 9000 people world wide  and manufactures a variety of products which  he sells globally knows nothing about manufacturing. It beggars belief.

As for his opinions on the Euro and Europe, I wouldn't hold that against him and certainly they don't have anything to do with or detract from his knowledge of manufacturing. Why do you think he was Knighted? 

What about his farms that make a loss

[aright]

7 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

It says licensing and licensing implies some form of control. In order to get an export licence they need to meet eight common criteria. That seems perfectly straightforward if there were no controls why would you need an export licence?

Simples. An export licence keeps tabs on what's going on it doesn't control it. 

[aright]

1 minute ago, rockingrobin said:

What about his farms that make a loss

What about them?

[pitrevie]

3 minutes ago, aright said:

What? Are you saying James Dyson who employs about 9000 people world wide  and manufactures a variety of products which  he sells globally knows nothing about manufacturing. It beggars belief.

As for his opinions on the Euro and Europe, I wouldn't hold that against him and certainly they don't have anything to do with or detract from his knowledge of manufacturing. Why do you think he was Knighted? 

I don't think he knows nothing but obviously the Germans know a lot more about manufacturing than does Dyson and if we were going to follow any model I think theirs has been a lot more successful that anything Dyson has done or is proposing.

[pitrevie]

3 minutes ago, aright said:

Simples. An export licence keeps tabs on what's going on it doesn't control it. 

Keeping tabs what a joke, even keeping tabs implies control. We give out dog licences and TV licences which don't control any dogs or TVs but they keep tabs on them.

[aright]

Just now, pitrevie said:

I don't think he knows nothing but obviously the Germans know a lot more about manufacturing than does Dyson and if we were going to follow any model I think theirs has been a lot more successful that anything Dyson has done or is proposing.

Please give me the evidence that says "the Germans know a lot more about manufacturing than does Dyson"

What is the German model?

[rockingrobin]

4 minutes ago, aright said:

Simples. An export licence keeps tabs on what's going on it doesn't control it. 

you need to expand on this

As an example are you saying that a driving licence doesnt control who is entitled to drive a vehicle

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, aright said:

You need to read more and leave the first Industrial Revolution behind you. We are in phase 5 or is it 6 now.

Nobody produces complete aircraft anymore. It's all about modular systems.

Outsourcing

Many components are not built by Boeing but are outsourced to other manufacturers both in the US and increasingly around the world. This may be either for cost savings in production, specialist development or as an incentive for that country to buy other Boeing products. Here is a list of some of the outsourced components:

• Fuselage, engine nacelles and pylons - Spirit AeroSystems (formerly Boeing), Wichita.
• Slats and flaps - Spirit AeroSystems (formerly Boeing), Tulsa.
• Doors - Vought, Stuart, FL.
• Spoilers - Goodrich, Charlotte, NC.
• Vertical fin - Xi'an Aircraft Industry, China.
• Horizontal stabiliser - Korea Aerospace Industries.
• Ailerons - Asian Composites Manufacturing, Malaysia.
• Rudder - Bombardier, Belfast and AVIC subsidiary Chengfei Commercial Aircraft (CCAC), China
• Tail section (aluminium extrusions for) - Alcoa / Shanghai Aircraft Manufacturing, China.
• Main landing gear doors - Aerospace Industrial Development Corp, Taiwan.
• Inboard Flap - Mitsubishi, Japan.
• Elevator - Fuji, Japan.
• Winglets - Kawasaki, Japan.
• Fwd entry door & Overwing exits - Chengdu Aircraft, China.
• Wing-to-body fairing panels and tail cone - BHA Aero Composite Parts Co. Ltd, China.

As for nuclear reactors

http://www.cityam.com/256579/rolls-royce-launches-partnership-engineering-giants-amec

 

As for Dyson He claims that assembly as opposed to manufacturing  isn't worth a candle but what does he know? He claims in todays world intellectual property is more important than manufacturing. How much is his business worth? Do you think by assembling in Asia thus denying Brits jobs he is immoral?  As a shareholder myself of manufacturing companies I expect the owner or CEO  of those companies to have an obligation, to me, to maximise profits and share value and if that involves manufacturing off shore get it on. It's called Capitalism and I am the one risking my capital.  You can of course change this at the next election by voting for Corbyn who will nationalise everything and bring it all in house,  but be assured you will get a tractor report every week.

 

I was in Edinburgh last month for the Festival. Had dinner on 2 nights in Leith...great place.

Poundland is a chain of stores (Indian owned I think) where everything costs a £1. I doubt you would find them north of the border they are far too expensive for Scotland.      

Glad you've grasped globalisation. Airbus is a European venture and a highly successful one. Our vehicle manufacturing is in large part assembling vehicles locally for Europe.

 

What then is the reason for Brexit?

 

Nobody, NOBODY, has been able to explain what the huge tangible upside is! The one which will offset the huge risks.

 

I love The Fringe. First saw Rowen Atkinson there in the Cambridge Footlights review before he was famous. Some of the Festival events are a little too high brow for my taste though ?

 

The Leith Police dismisseth us!

[pitrevie]

2 minutes ago, aright said:

Please give me the evidence that says "the Germans know a lot more about manufacturing than does Dyson"

What is the German model?

I didn't think I would have to explain the obvious.

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/germany/2011-06-16/secrets-germanys-success just what is available is enough.You do know they are the World's second largest exporter.

As a share of its economy, Germany’s manufacturing sector is twice the size of Britain’s – 23% of national GDP, compared with 11%, according to the World Bank. Unlike Britain, it runs a large surplus on trade in goods.

[aright]

2 minutes ago, rockingrobin said:

you need to expand on this

As an example are you saying that a driving licence doesnt control who is entitled to drive a vehicle

No a driving, dog, or TV  licence is not an export licence

The French sold Mistral ships to Russia amidst  objections from the other EU partners. The ships however were never delivered not because of EU objections but because of what Russia did in the Crimea. The export licence in part is needed for transparency. 

[nauseus]

1 minute ago, Grouse said:

Glad you've grasped globalisation. Airbus is a European venture and a highly successful one. Our vehicle manufacturing is in large part assembling vehicles locally for Europe.

 

What then is the reason for Brexit?

 

Nobody, NOBODY, has been able to explain what the huge tangible upside is! The one which will offset the huge risks.

 

I love The Fringe. First saw Rowen Atkinson there in the Cambridge Footlights review before he was famous. Some of the Festival events are a little too high brow for my taste though ?

Explained several times but you only want to listen to the economic arguments, Grouse.

Are you saying that so-called risks can be called tangible? 

[Grouse]

5 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

I didn't think I would have to explain the obvious.

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/germany/2011-06-16/secrets-germanys-success just what is available is enough.You do know they are the World's second largest exporter.

As a share of its economy, Germany’s manufacturing sector is twice the size of Britain’s – 23% of national GDP, compared with 11%, according to the World Bank. Unlike Britain, it runs a large surplus on trade in goods.

The mittelstand is a key factor in this as is the education system and management systems that involve unions

[pitrevie]

3 minutes ago, aright said:

No a driving, dog, or TV  licence is not an export licence

The French sold Mistral ships to Russia amidst  objections from the other EU partners. The ships however were never delivered not because of EU objections but because of what Russia did in the Crimea. The export licence in part is needed for transparency. 

It doesn't matter how many times you twist and turn if you have to apply for a licence that implies control even a dog licence.