webfact Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Largest orange farm in Chiang Mai now seized for land reform CHIANG MAI: -- Thanatorn Orange Farm, Thailand's biggest orange farm, and one of Chiang Mai's famous tourist attractions, is facing seizure by the state after its owner could not produce official documents to prove its legal ownership. The orange farm, which covers 2,144 rai of land in Fang and Mae Ai districts of Chiang Mai, is among three large orange farms in over 6,000 rai of land in Chiang Mai to be seized back by the state under order of the military junta for redistribution to landless farmers for agricultural purposes. Two other orchard farms that will be seized are Chiang Mai Mit Kaset (Saithong Orange Farm), and Amornmit Orange. Thanatorn Orange Farm has been ranked No.6 on TripAdvisor among 11 attractions in Fang district of Chiang Mai. Agriculture Minister Gen Chatchai Sarikalya said owners of the three large orange farms could not produce rights of ownership documents to authorities. Therefore all the land of these orange farms covering 5,900 rai would be taken back for redistribution to landless farmers for farming. For their orange production this year, he made clear that another round of would be held. But he said farm owners would be allowed to buy all the yields. Disclosure by the minister came after a team of officials from the Agricultural Land Reform Office, the Pa Muang Field Force’s 5th Calvary Regiment, Royal Thai Police and Department of Provincial Administration made site inspection of the three orange farms upon order of the military junta head to seize back the land in Fang and Mae Ai for agricultural reform. Full story: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/largest-orange-farm-chiang-mai-now-seized-land-reform/ -- © Copyright Thai PBS 2016-12-22 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khwaibah Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Laughing my arse off over this. To bad but in Thailand this is not surprising. Corruption at it finest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiang mai Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 A whopping great serious big time Ouch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MESmith Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Restore the forest while you're clearing your farm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Briggsy Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 The Thanatorn Company has a long and dubious history over land ownership. I remember the Bangkok Post running highly critical stories 10 years ago. That in itself is unusual because newspapers tend to self-censor. Also beneficial ownership of many of the orange operations in Fang may be in the hands of Yunnanese using front organisations or fake Thai ID's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdgbb Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 29 minutes ago, khwaibah said: Laughing my arse off over this. To bad but in Thailand this is not surprising. Corruption at it finest. This is not corruption, it is a solution to a corrupt situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdgbb Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 25 minutes ago, MESmith said: Restore the forest while you're clearing your farm The land will not be restored to forest, in order to protect 300 workers' livelihoods the ALRO is taking over the orchards as a co-operative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brer Fox Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 The price of oranges now on the up and up? Land given back to landless farmers who wouldn't know an orange if they tripped over one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pieeyed Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 I am waiting to see someone get busted. Big time thieves. No rights to the land they claim to have, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bokningar Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Great hit the land steeling bastards. But with all that land at least some of if could be restored to natural forest again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dante99 Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 Perhaps wait and see if it really happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alant Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 At a loss to see how this works. OK take land away because they can't prove it is theirs and it was possibly "acquired" by doubtful means but what then? Owners and workers out of work and possibly homeless? Give to landless farmers, what are landless farmers and then does the land given to them become theirs? do they get papers? What happens in the meanwhile? what happens to the oranges do they go to the army? Just what does "For their orange production this year, he made clear that another round of would be held." Just trying to make sense of it all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpaul1 Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 I remember when this was all (NOT) fields!...It would be funny except it should never have been converted from forest in the first place and it will never be restored. The fact that it is one of Fang's biggest tourist attractions is pretty pathetic too. Where I come from, there are pretty much farms everywhere and we don't get any tourists going there to look at fields full of fruit trees etc. because there are more interesting places to visit. I sometimes wonder that for all the 'amazing' tourist places in Thailand, the locals seem to be bored with places that foreign tourists are supposed to go to (which I can understand too) and the locals spend their weekends driving all over the country desperately trying to find something worth of stopping at. Around Pattaya with its sheep, bee you name it farms as well as so called "vineyard" and all the Disney fake Italian style food stops, Mimosa etc, it really is rather sad compared to say Europe which has the real deal. Heck, they even fake their own stuff such as floating markets. On the other hand, there are some worthy places to visit such as some of the further of the radar national parks, it is just it is a struggle to get to them when you have to fight for space on the road with meandering Vios and Honda city drivers intent on searching for any location worthy of a selfie to impress their friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlQaholic Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 I am a little bit confused, If you are a farmer, by definition you would have a "farm". The definition of a farm in my mind is a plot of land where the farmer can cultivate the land and produce farm products. Soooooo where did these "landless" farmers come from? If you gamble away your land or loose your land in some other way for example to the Creditors or sell your land, then you are not a farmer anymore. Can I just raise my hand and say "I'm a landless farmer!"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamgeorgeallen Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 12 hours ago, Brer Fox said: The price of oranges now on the up and up? Land given back to landless farmers who wouldn't know an orange if they tripped over one. they can always farm rice. would seem to be a better idea to let the business carry on with a long term lease. the army needs to learn to work with the people, not against them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elgordo38 Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 18 hours ago, gdgbb said: The land will not be restored to forest, in order to protect 300 workers' livelihoods the ALRO is taking over the orchards as a co-operative. Rather makes sense why destroy all them mature trees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Deerhunter Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 4 hours ago, williamgeorgeallen said: they can always farm rice. would seem to be a better idea to let the business carry on with a long term lease. the army needs to learn to work with the people, not against them. This suggestion although laudable may not be practical. The problem with rice is its year round need for huge amounts of water. I suspect that orange orcharda have lower demands for water than rice. Also rice prices are down so may not be worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamgeorgeallen Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 5 minutes ago, The Deerhunter said: This suggestion although laudable may not be practical. The problem with rice is its year round need for huge amounts of water. I suspect that orange orcharda have lower demands for water than rice. Also rice prices are down so may not be worth it. yea was a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Deerhunter Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 13 minutes ago, williamgeorgeallen said: yea was a joke. Oh. Too subtle for me to pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tandor Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 19 hours ago, gdgbb said: This is not corruption, it is a solution to a corrupt situation. ..agent orange again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleur3 Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 5 hours ago, alant said: At a loss to see how this works. OK take land away because they can't prove it is theirs and it was possibly "acquired" by doubtful means but what then? Owners and workers out of work and possibly homeless? Give to landless farmers, what are landless farmers and then does the land given to them become theirs? do they get papers? What happens in the meanwhile? what happens to the oranges do they go to the army? Just what does "For their orange production this year, he made clear that another round of would be held." Just trying to make sense of it all... just start at the beginning: they stole the land. The rest is nonsense. Compare with the following. Burglars broke in my house and stole one million pound. They used the money to start a business. The business is doing well but i want my money back,.So end of the business. Your philosophy: what a pity let them keep the money ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loaded Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 These people started growing oranges on land that nobody else wanted and nobody else owned. It was unused mountain land. This went on for many years without a single complaint from anyone. The army has now decided that they should receive revenue from this land rather that the people who developed it - shades of Robert Mugabe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maybole Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 Who's pockets will the profit go into? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elgordo38 Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 28 minutes ago, Loaded said: These people started growing oranges on land that nobody else wanted and nobody else owned. It was unused mountain land. This went on for many years without a single complaint from anyone. The army has now decided that they should receive revenue from this land rather that the people who developed it - shades of Robert Mugabe. Squatters rights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moe666 Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 26 minutes ago, Loaded said: These people started growing oranges on land that nobody else wanted and nobody else owned. It was unused mountain land. This went on for many years without a single complaint from anyone. The army has now decided that they should receive revenue from this land rather that the people who developed it - shades of Robert Mugabe. The land originally was for poor farmers not to be sold or transfered, so some way the big companies got control of the land and planted the orange trees. This is similar to the land confiscated in Issan from the race track folks and also houses built on similar parcels. Poor farmer cannot make a go of it sells land he really doesn't own now he has money in the bank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loaded Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 6 minutes ago, moe666 said: The land originally was for poor farmers not to be sold or transfered, so some way the big companies got control of the land and planted the orange trees. This is similar to the land confiscated in Issan from the race track folks and also houses built on similar parcels. Poor farmer cannot make a go of it sells land he really doesn't own now he has money in the bank I am not aware that this land was ever given to poor farmers. Do you have a source for this? It doesn't say that in the original OP. My understanding is that it was unused and unregistered land when they started growing oranges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MESmith Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 Chop it all down. Plant real trees, the forest will recover eventually. The last thing you want is for people to profit by raping the land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moe666 Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 1 minute ago, Loaded said: I am not aware that this land was ever given to poor farmers. Do you have a source for this? It doesn't say that in the original OP. My understanding is that it was unused and unregistered land when they started growing oranges. That was from the Bangkok Post this morning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shot Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 This is going to put a squeeze on the orange farmers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loaded Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 4 minutes ago, moe666 said: That was from the Bangkok Post this morning I just found that report. It says the farms were occupying Sor Por Kor land. This is land that can be allocated to poor farmers. It doesn't say when it became Sor Por Kor land nor does it say the land had been allocated to poor farmers. My feeling is that goal posts are not only being moved but are also being created. The junta gets what the junta wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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