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Visa agent vs DIY


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get a tourist visa, place 800,000 baht in a bank account in your name, convert while in Thailand to a non immigrant 'O' visa, during the last 30 days of that 90 day permission to stay stamp, apply for a one year extension for being retired.

 

try to get in your head, the differences of

a yearly extension, ( applied for in Thailand but must have a non immigrant 'O' visa first, requires 90 day address reports)

a single entry non immigrant 'O' visa, issued outside Thailand at a Thai consulate/Embassy, but can be issued within Thailand as part of a conversion process, this allows one entry/permission to stay stamp of 90 days)

a multi entry non immigrant 'O' visa,  ( as above but multi entry, each entry giving a 90 day permission to stay stamp)

a multi entry non immigrant 'O''A' visa( this one is only issued in home country and requires , medical form, financials, police check)

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On 1/13/2017 at 2:08 PM, jpinx said:

The OP would help us to advise him if he mentions the immigration office he will use. 

 

If he actually means he wants to obtain a non-imm O-A, it can't be done at any immigration office.

 

On 1/13/2017 at 0:20 PM, PhotoJeremy said:

Has anyone got any experience of getting an agent to do all the paperwork for an O-A visa as opposed to doing everything themselves?

 

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This post sounds like where I was a year ago.  In addition,  I have some physical disability that makes writing/completing paperwork or standing in line far more difficult for me than it might be for many others. From my home in the US,  Siam Legal did all for 90day visa packet for $350 even advising on which Honorary Consulate to send it to (note-not the closest to my residence).  I had the Visa back to my residence in 5 days.  After arrival in Chiang Mai I opened bank account and deposit - 3 quick branch stops to find a location with staff anxious for my patronage.  On day 46 of 90 I went to G4T and they told me to come back the next day at 1030, signed the  papers copies and then told to return at 2pm,  went with them over to immigration for 30 minutes and out the door,  packed,  wrapped and done! My bill was 3000 baht,  I considered it a great service and value,  AA, Aggravation Avoidance. :-)   So,  in total, agent  fees cost me about $650 breaking down to about $10 week for the 15 months.  After having some trepidation from many online comments about both the CM immigration office/ process and less than stellar agents ,  I walked away a very happy man.  I had gotten a personal recommendation from my short term landlord of his positive G4T experience, to me that is a long held belief in advance research,  due diligence and the value of personal experience and referrals.  Different strokes for different folks,  this may not be the right route for all but it was for me.  Note* I saw quite a few people in line and waiting outside,  I went to the other side of Promenada,  had lunch and a foot massage,  went back for 30 minutes and was done.  An all around satisfied customer. 

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It many respects it comes down to just how much patience you have or do not have

Of course the money part is a big factor for some people ....but if you want the whole affair to be far less hassle and less frustration and eventually less of all the more loathing of the bureaucracy and all too often some of the officials you would deal with then have a visa agent arrange everything for you.

On the other hand, if you are the more adventurous type and do not mind the various challenges involved while you want to learn about the ways and means of obtaining the sought after immigration status while having to go over there and come back over here and obtain this document and that document and photo copied in triplicate and several photos needed and this signature and that signature and stamped and approved and having to conform with all the details and all the while testing your patience ...and more ...then do it yourself and save some money...lol

Cheers

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3 hours ago, TravelerEastWest said:

The biggest obstacle for me is not paperwork - I am calm and organized - but I am working and have children taht need to eb picked up at school so don't have the free time to sit for hours in an immigration office.

 

Fair enough. I do have the advantage of using a fairly efficient immigration office and having what is probably the easiest extension (retirement with cash deposit). As such my total time spent at the immigration office last year for my extension was under half an hour, spread over two days. And I live very close to the office as well, so the idea of paying anyone to do that for me just seems very pointless.

 

I can appreciate that those who have neither the cash deposit nor a high enough income would also be inclined to use an agent.

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On 1/13/2017 at 2:08 PM, jpinx said:

The OP would help us to advise him if he mentions the immigration office he will use.  They all have slight variations on the interpretations of the rules.

If every Immigration office had the same requirements, it would save people like the OP a lot of hassle, yes there is a lot of great help from UbonJoe and others. But hey. This is Thailand, where they don't believe in making things simple, and not just IOs.

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On 1/13/2017 at 2:08 PM, KhunBENQ said:

All that's really needed for a one year extension is the proof of financials (income/pension statement or/plus funds in a Thai bank account).

The rest is paperwork, forms, copies ...

 

If you have the money, then the "25k" agents are a big waste of money.

They serve the "difficult" cases where proof of money is a problem.

 

Personally, I don't think the majority of expats and long stayers have the required amount of money in the bank, hence the use of the "25K" agents. It does not apply to me, I do not trust Thailand enough to have a lot of money in their banks.

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I always diy for all visas, all countries. I want to learn and know all issues related to obtaining my visas and extensions.

 

I do a non O marriage extension annually, thought of one of the more hassled processes. It's now a non issue, took us 20-30 mins in BKK CW few weeks ago.

 

Not much respect from me for those that use agents. Yeah, I'll waste my time, out in hot sun, lots of walking, waiting in line... wouldn't have it any other way.

Edited by ozmeldo
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2 hours ago, possum1931 said:

Personally, I don't think the majority of expats and long stayers have the required amount of money in the bank, hence the use of the "25K" agents. It does not apply to me, I do not trust Thailand enough to have a lot of money in their banks.

 

Sure the 800k is not everybody's solution.

But the older expats who receive a pension can use this method or the combination.

So I don't believe that a majority depends on dubious agents.

With the current rules and their interpretation the "no money, no problem, pickup 'visa' in the afternoon" offerings can not be immaculate.

There was a loophole in the combination method (no seasoning of additional funds necessary) which seems to be closed.

 

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19 minutes ago, KhunBENQ said:

 

Sure the 800k is not everybody's solution.

But the older expats who receive a pension can use this method or the combination.

So I don't believe that a majority depends on dubious agents.

With the current rules and their interpretation the "no money, no problem, pickup 'visa' in the afternoon" offerings can not be immaculate.

There was a loophole in the combination method (no seasoning of additional funds necessary) which seems to be closed.

 

No, I'm sorry, maybe I put that wrongly, I was only thinking about the 800.000Bt in the bank, I lot of expats only have the 400.000Bt in the bank for marriage extensions, and a lot use the combination. What I really mean is only a minority, say less than half have the full 800.000 in the bank. That is only my opinion.

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9 hours ago, thaihome said:

I think it's important to distinguish between the agencies that do charge 20k baht, possibly providing assistance of a somewhat illegal nature with the financial requirements and those agencies that provide a ethical, convenient service in dealing with immigration at a reasonable price.

 

Personally,  I am happy to to pay the equivalent of a couple hundred dollars to an agent that completes all the paperwork with me providing an income letter from my embassy when we meet at Immigration once a year. She arrives early,  gets in the queue, gets the number, and calls me at the coffee shop downstairs when our number is called. I then sit there for some 10 minutes while stamps are put into my passport and I leave. She then goes and gets the reentry permit and a courier returns my passport later that day. 

 

I guess it comes down to, as these things often do, to how much is your time worth. The last thing I want to be doing is filling out government forms, making copies, and standing in line at Chang Wattana immigration waiting for door to open and the mad rush to get a number. I will sit downstairs in the coffee shop and I'm happy to pay somebody to do all that. My choice and I certainly wouldn't criticize some one that does all at themselves. 

 

If you go my route, you do need to use a reputable agent that is not going to overcharge you. 15k or 20k is way over.

TH 

15000 is for: He or she or they pick up your passport today and 2 or 3 days later give your passport back to you and you are good for 1 more year.

I do the retirement Visa myself now and save some money while all said and done is about 7000  plus baht ...with one day of getting an affidavit from my embassy stating that I can financially support myself instead of submitting bank statements and then get a health check up document for certain health control issues and then next day out to immigration and go through all the motions of applying for the one year extension from the same ladies as the last year and the year before....while they do not even check the documents and papers I give to them...rather just sign them while we chit chat  and then ask me to wait awhile and then go over to the next desk in the same room and then more chit chat and more signatures and no questions and then finally over to the Multiple entry sector and  give them the passport and the filled in forms in triplicate and photos and submit and wait and then come collect your passport and pay the price for the multiple entry stamp and off you go...good for another year...lol 

Edited by gemguy
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Well that's more like it: thanks to everybody for their advice and opinions. If anyone has anything else it might help if I clarify my position:

The single most important thing for me about the application is accuracy, by which I mean the process is handled so the application is passed first time. My experience elsewhere is that when something like this is screwed up at the first attempt it makes subsequent attempts more difficult. So I'm happy to do the paperwork myself, but if paying an agent guarantees that it's done correctly and just flows through the system I tend to regard that as a good investment.

Second is convenience. I've spent enough time dealing with bureaucracy elsewhere, and I simply can't be arsed to engage in a 4am bundle to get a good place in the queue at some immigration office. So far as I'm concerned, paying someone to handle that so I can do more useful things with my time is money well spent.

Finally, I'm aware that some agents offer a service to help with the 800k baht bank account. Fortunately I don't need that, so it wouldn't be a factor in any decision.


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I absolutely agree with you for people intending to live in Bangkok. Unfortunately, the OP will be living in Chiang Mai. Needing to attend there once for a retirement extension is already a nightmare. Actually, I would probably bite the bullet and use an agent if needing to deal with the Chiang Mai immigration hell.


In what way is CM so much more of a nightmare than Bangkok? Does CM just have a massively more inefficient system for dealing with expats?


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11 hours ago, PhotoJeremy said:

In what way is CM so much more of a nightmare than Bangkok? Does CM just have a massively more inefficient system for dealing with expats?

 

 

CM offer a limited number of "que numbers" for a particular service (ex: "retirement extensions) per day.  People line up in the wee-hours of the morning for these.  Or, you pay an agent ("fixer"), and to straight to the front of the line, ahead of the others.   Perhaps they requested additional staff, didn't get it, and decided to "make the best" of the situation.

 

There have been reports of other offices sending people out over and over for "one more document" until they relent and pay an agent to "handle" their application.  A fellow at Bangkok immi the other day, who had used an agent for his previous extension, was not allowed to file his own extension, and told to "go back to the agent."   Speculation is that the agent did something dodgy with the original application, actions permitted "only for agents."

 

The point is to strongly encourage the use of agents.  It's not hard to guess why.

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I am now in Pattaya and have spoken with about half a dozen people within the same condo about extension for retirement  and am rather surprised that every one of them used an agent and have very little in a Thai bank account.

It seems that it really is common practice to have an agent do a dodgy deal with Immigration.

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3 hours ago, mlkik said:

I am now in Pattaya and have spoken with about half a dozen people within the same condo about extension for retirement  and am rather surprised that every one of them used an agent and have very little in a Thai bank account.

It seems that it really is common practice to have an agent do a dodgy deal with Immigration.

Mostly due to the high concentration of British expats that cannot make the pension incomes of 65000bht a month on today's exchange rates. That equates to a pension income of over £1550 a month after Tax. Having the 800,000bht in a an account, lots can only ever dream of having.

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